Cutting Dovetails

[bobscarle]

I have a couple of projects to do in the near future which will require me to make drawers. I would like to construct the drawer box in the traditional way using through dovetails.

I have started to practice cutting some with limited success. I have read articles about which way to cut them, my first attempt was cutting the pins first but that proved difficult when marking the tails. Later attempts have been made by cutting the tails first which seems easier.

Am I correct in thinking that this is just a matter of practice and the joints will improve in time? Also, can I ask, should I cut as close to the lines as possible with my initial saw cuts, or stay away from the lines, remove the bulk of the waste and then form the joint with a chisel?

Even with my attempts it is possible to see why people love the joint. It looks good, but doesn't it steal your time!

Bob

 

[Waka]

Bob

I tend to handcut my dovetails, I find it more satisfying although it does take a little longer.

You are right its the practice that you need, when I first started doing them I did one set everyday until I had mastered the nack.

I followed Rob Cosmans DVD on dovetails and find this an excellent teaching DVD.

You don't mention how you mark them out, I allways use a marking knife and cut as near as I can to the line, if I find them a bit on the tight side it means you only have to take a sliver off.

I'm sure others will be along soon.

 

[WoodStoat]

If you're feeling flush you could always try one of these http://www.rutlands.co.uk/cgi-bin/psProdDet.cgi/D4R

I brought one back from America at half the price we pay here, as usual - But they are jolly good bits of kit, if you can justify the expense.

 

[Waka]

I have the Liegh 24" and stil prefer to do them by hand, having said that if you are doing a batch run then the jig comes into its own.

 

[woodbloke]

The ususal practice is to cut lapped dovetails at the front (if a solid front) and thu' D/T's if the front is applied after, thus covering the front of the tails, the rear joints are thru' D/T's. All pieces of timber need to be shot dead square. They can be cut in whichever way you want, most people including myself cut the tails first and then pins.

One of the trickiest things to do which I couldn't master for years is to set out the tails evenly spaced - I now use the divider approach (very good article in F&C about this by DC) which makes the whole job far easier, use a thin black biro to mark out.

When the joint is cut you should be able to cut to the line without recourse for a chisel to fit - does happen occasionally :wink: .Pins are marked from the tails with a sharp knife or scalpel (this tends to make too thin a line which I can't see) and again should be cut to the line. Shoulder lines should be carefully chiselled onto the line.

One error that I used to do when cleaning up before gluing up is to remove a fine shaving or two from the inside of each of the drawer parts thus making the fit too loose. Clean up the inside with a scraper and fine sandpaper but stop at the shoulder lines, don't take anything off where the wood meets.

And yup, you do get better with practice. As my old lecturer at college said to me (Barnsley trained) you 'need to cut a few before it gets easier' . There's loads of info on the net and on this forum on cutting D/T's - look at the 'How To' drop down menu at the top of the screen. Hope of some help - Rob

 

[Alf]

Am I correct in thinking that this is just a matter of practice and the joints will improve in time?

Unfortunately, yes. As the advice on the Old Tools List goes "make a bunch of boxes to hold rubbish until the boxes don't look like rubbish, then start on drawers" :lol:

Also, can I ask, should I cut as close to the lines as possible with my initial saw cuts, or stay away from the lines, remove the bulk of the waste and then form the joint with a chisel?

Be brave - aim to saw to your lines. Also avoid tweaking the tail board, then the pin board, then back to the tail board etc etc. Saw the tail board, remove the waste, mark up the pin board from it and then STOP. Put the tail board away and don't do any more to it. Any tweaking should be confined to the pin board from then on.

Oh and I second Waka's suggestion of Rob Cosman's DVD; worked for me anyway. Well on the actual cutting anyway. My last dovetails were virtually perfect in all detail. I was so chuffed. If only I'd remembered to allow for the compound nature of the joint... #-o Luckily they look okay from the outside, so if you won't tell... :-$

Cheers, Alf

 

[RogerM]

Bob - given that the front of the drawers should have half-blind dovetails, why not practice on the back of the drawer with half bind DTs first rather than through DTs? If you cut the sides and back oversize, you can cut a set of joints, and if they are good, then fine - keep them. But if you are not happy with them, then cut off the pins and tails and the piece will still be long enough to try again! Then when you have cut the joints at the back start on the front on the basis that you will now have learned enough to know what you are doing. You could even cut the fronts wider than necessary although by now the sides will be their final length.

That's what I did with a recent project anyway, and it worked fine for me, having never cut DTs before. Have a look at an article in FWW Aug 2006 - great set of illustrated instructions. I found the key was to use a scalpel to do the marking out from the tails then highlight the score marks with a sharp pencil, and used a fine razorsaw to do the cutting as it left a very fine kerf.

HTH

 

[Anonymous]

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[Alf]

Yeah, a good point worth stressing, Jacob. Hard to cover everything without ending up with an interminably long post. As a matter of interest do you chop your waste of use a coping/fret saw first?

Cheers, Alf

 

[bobscarle]

Thanks all for your help. I have just come back in from the shed having cut one more corner joint. I cut to the lines on the tail board using a gents saw (this is the finest I have). The waste between the tails I cut out with a coping saw. Maybe its just me, but cutting to the line with that is not easy. Anyway I got as close as possible and then chiselled the rest away.

The pins were marked out using a marking knife using the tail board as the pattern. I think I need to make some kind of right angle jig to hold the 2 pieces as I mark them. Again I cut to the lines using the gents saw then removed most of the waste with a coping saw.

What do you know it fitted. Well nearly it was too tight to fit properly but a lot closer than before. A little bit of fiddling, only the pins (thanks Alf), and it goes together. OK, its not perfect but this is the third joint and so far the best.

Thanks for all the advice. This is something I have wanted to do for a while but never felt brave enough. So, more practice and you never know I might even post some pictures (but I might not)!

Bob

 

[Alf]

I think I need to make some kind of right angle jig to hold the 2 pieces as I mark them.

Cue BugBear here.

What do you know it fitted.

Yay! =D> \/

Cheers, Alf

 

[garywayne]

Bob.

Just a little trick I was told about to assist in cutting to the line.

If you prop up a mirror behind your workpiece, you will be able to see the lines at the back. This way you can check that you cut to the line at the front and back at the same time.

I hope this makes sense, and is of some help.

Sorry if I am a bit late.

 

[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

I have a couple of projects to do in the near future which will require me to make drawers. I would like to construct the drawer box in the traditional way using through dovetails.

I have started to practice cutting some with limited success. I have read articles about which way to cut them, my first attempt was cutting the pins first but that proved difficult when marking the tails. Later attempts have been made by cutting the tails first which seems easier.

Am I correct in thinking that this is just a matter of practice and the joints will improve in time? Also, can I ask, should I cut as close to the lines as possible with my initial saw cuts, or stay away from the lines, remove the bulk of the waste and then form the joint with a chisel?

Even with my attempts it is possible to see why people love the joint. It looks good, but doesn't it steal your time!

Bob

Bob

Practice is the key - see my houndstooth tutorial in the How-To section at the top of the forum for a few tips

 

[woodbloke]

bobscarle wrote:
snip
some kind of right angle jig to hold the 2 pieces as I mark them.

Don't even need a jig - line up the two pieces by using a decent sized square - pin board in the vice with the square against it ane the tail board on top of it held against the blade of the square - works for me - Rob

 

[Alf]

Oh lor, if we're exhibiting our minimalist credentials I use an offcut (not even a plane on its side) to rest the tail board on. Do I win? Or is there a Yorkshireman out there who got up before he went to bed to work a 67 hour shift for a penny once every three years who's going to trump me? :lol:

Cheers, Alf

 

[woodbloke]

If it works, keep it simple, why make life more complicated when you don't really need to? - Rob