Cheaper Steb Centres Now?

[chipmunk]

Hi All,
Well, the UK patent on the Steb drive centre expired on 1st February this year...
https://www.ipo.gov.uk/p-ipsum/Case/PublicationNumber/GB2286138

So we are now free to make our own versions and to legally import cheap knock-offs from the US and Europe.

If you're looking for a neat way of making your own, I'd recommend a blank-end arbor such as the ones here...
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Blank-End-Arbors
Quite possible to drill and file on the woodlathe.

HTH
Jon

 

[Rhossydd]

So we are now free to make our own versions

You always have been. It's the sale of them that patents control.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

so pleased I just spent £85 on the sorby ones for head and tailstock then!

 

[marcros]

ouch

have you got one that fits in the chuck bob?

 

[chipmunk]

Hi Rhossydd,
According to the Patents Act 1977 (https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-patents-act-1977)...

"Meaning of infringement
60.-(1) Subject to the provisions of this section, a person infringes a patent for an invention if, but only if, while the patent is in force, he does any of the following things in the United Kingdom in relation to the invention without the consent of the proprietor of the patent, that is to say -

(a) where the invention is a product, he makes, disposes of, offers to dispose of, uses or imports the product or keeps it whether for disposal or otherwise; "

In theory you can be sued for damages by the patent owner even if you make your own for your own use.

...but I admit it's a bit of a grey area because it also says...

"(5) An act which, apart from this subsection, would constitute an infringement of a patent for an invention shall not do so if -
(a) it is done privately and for purposes which are not commercial;"

So, I think it probably is if you didn't describe it on a forum such as this and kept it in your workshop without showing anyone ;-)

Jon

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

ouch

have you got one that fits in the chuck bob?

Yup...called the stebchuck or an abbreviated version of that. I got the 7/8" version as that seemed neither too large get in the way of smaller stock nor too small to fail to hold larger pieces. I then got the matching MT2 tailstock live centre so I can do off centre work if necessary. I cant believe how much better than a regular spur drive they are. For a start, no more malleting in the drive centre in very hard end grain which is a good enough reason alone to own one

 

[Robbo3]

Les Thorne grips a morse taper steb centre in the jaws of a woodturning chuck.

At his last demo, I couldn't quite see whether he gripped the top of the shank or the steb body. I suppose either would do as all the pressure is towards the headstock.

http://www.noturningback.co.uk/ntbk/

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I asked John Davis Woodturning about that and he says the Sorby's aren't designed to do that. However, if it works.....

 

[marcros]

There is a dedicated chuck version available for £15 which I am going to get at some point. I have a penn state industries version of the drive centre and it has been very good.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Les Thorne grips a morse taper steb centre in the jaws of a woodturning chuck.

At his last demo, I couldn't quite see whether he gripped the top of the shank or the steb body. I suppose either would do as all the pressure is towards the headstock.

http://www.noturningback.co.uk/ntbk/

At our club all morse taper drive centres are invariably used in chucks, although I'd rather take the chuck off.

 

[Robbo3]

Managed to get a couple of minutes to try it out.

The morse taper shank can be gripped in the centre hole formed with Axminster 'C' jaws as can the main body of the steb centre. I presume this would apply to most jaws.

I prefer the second method so as not to risk damaging the taper.

 

[chipmunk]

Of course you can grip it in the 1" hole of the C-jaws but I can thoroughly recommend the Axminster morse taper carriers. You can then use the carrier for drive centres and drill chucks which you really want to run concentrically.

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-morse-taper-carriers

I actually have one carrier for when the C-jaws are in the chuck and one turned to have a dovetail to fit in my O'Donnell jaws. I actually used a big ******* file to do this before I bought my metal lathe but if you do this it's better if you turn it with a Morse Taper as a mandrel so you're sure everything will end up true to the inside taper.

The only problem with these carriers is how to remove the MT's after use. To get around it I have a block of wood with a ~4" deep blind 1.5" diameter hole down the middle. Stick the drive centre down the hole and hit the tang with a mallet - hey presto!

HTH
Jon

 

[Phil Pascoe]

"You can then use the carrier for drive centres and drill chucks which you really want to run concentrically."
If I were that worried about concentricity, I'd put the drive centre straight in the spindle and not use the chuck.

 

[chipmunk]

"You can then use the carrier for drive centres and drill chucks which you really want to run concentrically."
If I were that worried about concentricity, I'd put the drive centre straight in the spindle and not use the chuck.

Maybe, but I suppose my point would be why waste time removing the chuck if you know it'll all be concentric without?

My Axminster chuck with an MT carrier in the jaws is within a "gnat's" of the headstock taper. So I hardly ever remove it from the headstock thread.

Jon

 

[chipmunk]

As a postscript to this thread...

I'm not sure if anyone has seen these for sale at Chronos but they are a bargain!
http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/acatalog/SCT-Woodworking-Chucks---Centres---Faceplates-etc.html

I bought a 1" drive centre at £9.83 and a 1" live centre at £14.94.
Brilliant value and they both seem to run without any noticeable run out at all.
I suppose the bearings in the live centre may not turn out to be the best but that's by far the cheapest live centre I've ever bought.

If I have any criticisms I'd say that the spring seems quite weak and they are not the same size and so swapping end-for end is not going to be as easy as it could be.

...But these appear to be Steb clones with the ring of points projecting straight out which I think I'm more comfortable with. The other drive centre seems to have angled points in the driving direction.

I haven't used them in anger yet but will let you know if they turn out to be duds.
Jon

 

[marcros]

good find Jon

 

[duncanh]

That's excellent news. It just goes to show how ridiculously over priced the official Steb Centres are - starting at £34 + VAT from Toolpost compared to from less than £10 +VAT from Chronos.

Just a shame that they're not listed as being at the Harrogate show or I would have picked up several tomorrow

 

[duncanh]

Also, did you notice the chucks and jaws on the same page? Does anyone know if their chuck is by any chance compatible with the Nova/Record ones? Their jaws are really cheap - Powergrip ones £14 + VAT compared to ~£50 for the Nova ones.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

:idea: ... yes ... it would be good to with which others they are compatible.

 

[chipmunk]

It just goes to show how ridiculously over priced the official Steb Centres are - starting at £34 + VAT from Toolpost compared to from less than £10 +VAT from Chronos.

The thing is that many of us bought them at that price because they were such an innovative and useful product and by implication must have thought they were worth that much.

To be fair to Sorby they do spend quite a lot of money on innovation and marketing and I guess that's what we were paying for, and are continuing to pay for, when buying Sorby stuff. Robert Sorby still have the most complete set of Steb centres as well, including the chuck mounted variants, perhaps because they know the woodturning market better than any of the late-comers.

Jon