Bevel up and Low Angle planes

[Armagedon]

Hi everyone,
I would need to get some advise. I was planning to buy some planes. I was wondering which planes are better (more functional) for work: bevel up's or low angle. I am thinking about getting jointer and nr 5 atm.
Any advises more than welcome

 

[adidat]

welcome to the forum

what do you want to do with these tools, low angle planes are great but expensive and if the grain is straight then a normal pitched 5 1/2 bd will do you fine

5 1/2 and 7 are the best sizes and a block plane for smaller jobs.

enjoy

adidat

 

[Armagedon]

right now I have standard nr 4 and 5 plus normal block and low angle block as well as shoulder plane and rebate. Recently I am working with burr oak and bur elm and some weird grain sycamore. Standard angle planes tend to struggle and do tear outs so I was looking for some solution to it. I got card scrapers but they are really for final touches rather than planing material.

 

[adidat]

wood like that is always going to be hard work especially burr oak, and interlocking grain. the low angle will help with tear out, lie neilsen make a very nice one.

your thumbs will become very saw if u use the scrapers for heavy removal. they heat up so quick.

 

[Armagedon]

have you got any experience with Veritas bevel up planes?

 

[adidat]

i have used the veritas lots, very nice thick blade. but then i used the LN and it was so comfy in the hand, and very nice to use

go to a toolshop and hold them both. if i was buying one i would go for the LN.

also i think the cherry looks nicer than burbinga (i think that what it is)

 

[adidat]

just looked on the map, axminster tools may be some distance :lol:

 

[Armagedon]

yeah true. journey would cost me one of those toys. I have to admit I like Veritas planes and I don't mind wether I got bubinga or cherry handle as long plane is fully working

 

[adidat]

the veritas is a fine plane, buy one keep it razor sharp and it will do the job very well.

i thought i was cold in somerset, must be seriously cold where u are

 

[Armagedon]

not too bad atm over 10deg on plus.
So which will be better bevel up or low angle?

 

[adidat]

the veritas is both perfect for dodgy grain

 

[Vann]

So which will be better bevel up or low angle?

They're just two different names for the same thing. For example, the Veritas Bevel Up Smoother, Low Angle Jack & Bevel Up Jointer all use the same irons (blades).

For tricky grain you want a higher pitch. You could either buy a higher angle blade (38 or 50 deg.) or use the low angle (25 deg.) iron with a higher angle micro bevel - this allows more versatility, as you can experiment with a number of different pitches until you find the one you need.

HTH.

Cheers, Vann.

 

[bugbear]

For tricky grain you want a higher pitch.

Higher Effective pitch.

OP - try googling "effective pitch" or "tear out". Try not to become too confused by what you find!

BugBear

 

[Argus]

.


I agree with the above, but if cost is an issue, there is another avenue of attack, so to speak, and that is to use a high bevel angle on a ‘conventional’ plane, as Vann said.

You may not be working cantankerous grain all the time and it’s not always viable (or desirable) to set the blade up on your standard metal plane unless you have a few spares, aqnd the mooth aperture remains an issue.

But you could consider one of the so-called Hong Kong planes sold by Rutlands. There are three in the range, all at 60 degree angle with an exceptionally fine mouth. I can vouch that they work a treat on wild grain, BUT, they won’t work straight out of the box and do need an amount of fettling before use, as with all wood planes. You could get all three for less than half the price of a BU from either LN or Veritas. I think that they work out at about 20 odd quid each.
The smallest one is equivalent to the old (unobtainable) Stanley No; 1 in size and is a real corker for a good finish. I never use abrasives - these palnes are capable of delivering a fine finish straight from the edge when set up. well.

If your grain is really wild, you can also consider a toothed blade to get it flat. They are an (expensive) option for Low Angle and BU planes, but a version to fit a Stanley/Record type of metal plane made by Kunz is available from Dick in Germany at a reasonable cost in Euros.

Hope this helps.

.

 

[warrenr]

Argus

Can you be more specific about "so-called Hong Kong planes sold by Rutlands". I cannot find anything smaller than a No.3.

Regards
Richard

[/quote]

 

[Argus]

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Richard,

The three Chinese planes offered by Rutland’s are as below: the smallest one is 127 mm long, (about 5”) which is about the size of the old No: 1.

127mm Hong Kong Style Plane Part No. AH1051155

165mm Hong Kong Style Plane Part No. AH1071155

230mm Hong Kong Style Plane Part No. AH1072155

Here is the web page for the smallest one:

http://www.rutlands.co.uk/hand-tools/pl ... tyle-plane


There were some posts on this forum a while back on these planes mainly under the Chinese maker's name that I can't remember now..... Fuminjang or something like that.



.

 

[warrenr]

Hi Argus

Thanks for that. I may look and see if I can see them in HK when I am next there on business probably before Xmas.

Have you also tried any of the Japanese planes as I have atrip planned in February

Regards
Richard

 

[Alf]

There were some posts on this forum a while back on these planes mainly under the Chinese maker's name that I can't remember now..... Fuminjang or something like that.

Mujingfang

 

[Andrea]

If you intend to buy a low angle jack plane, maybe you should wait until it is put up for sale this newness from Qiangsheng Tools.

Regards,
Andrea

 

[Argus]

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Mujingfang! Of course... thank you.


Richard,

I think that they are just termed Hong Kong planes........ not sure that they come from there though. Bit like calling pasties 'Cornish', I suppose, there may be a geographical connection originally. HK is a might big place.

Alf came up with the correct manufacturer's name. But they are cheap enough to take a punt on at Rutland.

Seriously, Lee Valley also offer them on their Canadian web site and have a slightly better photo and a bit more info.

As far as I’m concerned they are great value, terrific little planes and turn into a seriously useful bit of kit after a little work. Besides, where else can you get 60 degree wooden planes these days? (There’s a term for that pitch, used by the wise and knowledgeable, but it escapes me, at the moment)

I used to visit Japan regularly some years ago when I worked for one of the big conglomerates – though I was mainly confined in metropolitan Tokyo and Fuji City. I can’t say that I came across much in the way of hand tools there. In those days it was blue suits, wall to wall.
The really good stuff just doesn’t get exported. Having said that, I’m not a big fan of Japanese tools personally, they just don’t suit my style of work.
Besides, getting stuff onto aeroplanes these days is a hazardous sport.

These Chinese planes suit western work very well and are particularly good at wild and woolly grain, which is what the OP wanted in the first place.

.