Any central heating epxerts on here - oil fired Riello burner

[RogerS]

Having an ongoing issue with it locking out every few hours. Sometimes it will restart. Others it has a hissy fit. I have two audios...the first is it running and then it stops , a few seconds later there is a click then silence fo about two minutes.

The second recording is when it tries to restart (and fails) and goes into lockout.

 

[Spectric]

Could there be air in the system and it is causing an overheat condition. With boilers using oil the other issue is dirty nozzles , I am no oil burner expert but like all boilers they will have a method that determines if the burner is lit, in gas boilers this is a thermocouple device which controls the gas flow so if it is not lit then it turns off the gas. In oil burners there is some photocell device which I believe controls a pump which injects the oil via the nozzle and can be a source of issues.

look at this video

 

[flying haggis]

check the photocell isnt covered in soot

 

[Doug B]

Also check the oil supply & the tiger loop if you have one fitted

 

[RogerS]

Thanks chaps. My bad but I should have mentioned that my CH guy came out and serviced it, new nozzle, thorough cleaning etc and when he left it was working just fine. But later in the day it locked up again. Then after reset worked. Then locked out again a bit later and completely failed to start.

He does know what he's doing. It's some intermittent problem.

 

[Old.bodger]

I think air in the oil supply. Do you have a tiger loop?

 

[RogerS]

I think air in the oil supply. Do you have a tiger loop?

No.

 

[Spectric]

Air in the fuel supply is going to cause problems but you would have thought some form of de-aerator would be fitted as std because the negative pressure side of the pump can have a long run from the tank.

 

[RogerS]

Problem started 1 Dec when I got a lockout. Reset worked, boiler ran but then two days later, locked out again. Reset and ran OK. Ran OK for several days then lockout. No rhyme or reason.

Following the Fault Finding Logic for the burner is of no help because it's not locking out at any point in their Logic. Then on Monday - Dec 11 - it locked out and reset wouldn't work. All it did was buzz. I slept on it and the next morning checked out the capacitor. Knackered. Yippee..sorted. Or so I thought.

New capacitor fitted (Riello spare part) and Bingo...reset worked and it fired up.

But then a couple of hours later it locked up again and we were back in the lockout/reset loop. Then once more last night, it locked out and refused to restart. So this morning, 8am, my CH guy came round, pulled it apart, cleaned everything, did all that was needed to service it and checked it through. As I say he's very much old school and knows what he's doing. Switched it on and it worked great.

It ran for the best part of the day but early evening realised it had gone into lockout. Reset it, it fired up and ran for 20 minutes then lockout. Reset then failed to restart it. The audio files are of this time.

My thoughts are that it is stopping in mid-burn...the pump/fan/whirly thing stops running...you can hear it in the audio.

I'm thinking intermittent fault in the control box.

 

[RogerS]

Air in the fuel supply is going to cause problems but you would have thought some form of de-aerator would be fitted as std because the negative pressure side of the pump can have a long run from the tank.

First off, gravity is working well !

But more importantly, if you listen to the audio, the whirly thing stops going round instantly. Surely air in the pipe is going to cause it to stop in a very stuttery way ?

 

[Spectric]

The whirly thing, is this the fan or the pump ? In the audio at 0.7 it stutters and in the second audio it sounds very much like a motor has jamed and the click is some thermal trip cutting it out.

 

[Dave T]

First thing to do is change the starting capacitor on the motor.

 

[mc281]

Having an ongoing issue with it locking out every few hours. Sometimes it will restart. Others it has a hissy fit. I have two audios...the first is it running and then it stops , a few seconds later there is a click then silence fo about two minutes.
View attachment 171652
The second recording is when it tries to restart (and fails) and goes into lockout.

View attachment 171653

I would suggest either a sooted up flame sensing photocell or a knackered flame sensing flame sensor.
I cleaned mine and it worked but sooted up again....changed the jet and it ran OK for a couple of years again.
Of course it depends on the sensing system and model but try that first.

 

[Richard_C]

Had the exact same problem a few years back on my old boiler, immediately after a service. The air mix had been set right at the limit for max efficiency, there was not enough. yellow in the flame, so the photocell kept thinking it had gone out. I use a small family firm, lad did the service, dad called by when I reported it and said he always set this model a bit yellow or they can lock out erratically if there is a tiny change in airflow. Like a blustery day. Look down your flame viewing hole, any yellow at the flame tips? You might be able to set it yourself by eye and observing the flame, but better is to get them back.

 

[furnace]

My boiler is over 35yrs old and I've encountered a few things with it. The second audio file sounds like the fan trying to start but failing. It could be that the fan has become stuck on the housing. After removing the power, try raising the shutter assembly (see image on link below) and sticking a finger in to see if the fan rotates easily. These burners are typically very durable and despite the hostile conditions in which they operate last really well.

https://www.heatingspareparts.com/boiler-diagrams/riello/g3b-spc-a-spc-20039828-spc-(437t1)

 

[MikeJhn]

Has your oil tank had the water drained out of the bottom recently? Water absorbant socks are available.
No matter the problem get a dual flow filter Tigerloop on the oil line? Helps eliminate air in the system.

Sometime you can chase these type of problems around for age's getting cold and frustrated, in the end it's cheaper to by a new burner unit, about £300.00, look on the Riello web site they have a comprehensive chart to show the replacement burner for most boilers: riello burner - Google Search

 

[RogerS]

First thing to do is change the starting capacitor on the motor.

Already done.

 

[RogerS]

The whirly thing, is this the fan or the pump ? In the audio at 0.7 it stutters and in the second audio it sounds very much like a motor has jamed and the click is some thermal trip cutting it out.

Fan and pump are driven by the same motor. The click is the lockout happening.

 

[RogerS]

Had the exact same problem a few years back on my old boiler, immediately after a service. The air mix had been set right at the limit for max efficiency, there was not enough. yellow in the flame, so the photocell kept thinking it had gone out. I use a small family firm, lad did the service, dad called by when I reported it and said he always set this model a bit yellow or they can lock out erratically if there is a tiny change in airflow. Like a blustery day. Look down your flame viewing hole, any yellow at the flame tips? You might be able to set it yourself by eye and observing the flame, but better is to get them back.

The fault was occurring before the service.

 

[RogerS]

My boiler is over 35yrs old and I've encountered a few things with it. The second audio file sounds like the fan trying to start but failing. It could be that the fan has become stuck on the housing. After removing the power, try raising the shutter assembly (see image on link below) and sticking a finger in to see if the fan rotates easily. These burners are typically very durable and despite the hostile conditions in which they operate last really well.

https://www.heatingspareparts.com/boiler-diagrams/riello/g3b-spc-a-spc-20039828-spc-(437t1)

Fan runs fine as does the pump. Monitored the pump pressure while it was running and it was steady. If the fan or pump was getting stuck etc then there would be a fluctuation.