Advice on combination machines

[Paul66]

Hi, I am new to this site and have joined as I am seeking advice. I am a carpenter joiner and have worked mostly as a fitter, but would like to get in to manufacturing.
I have a double garage as a workshop and have been seriously looking at combination machines.
Sadly budgets have to be respected and I have zoned down to something that looks interesting although I have not been able to find many reviews?
So the Damatomacchine 300/7 Super has really caught my eye. Table size, power of the motors, planer size, etc.
The price seems pretty good for what it is? It seems a pretty big company which offers some confidence regarding qulity? This machine is on a promo at the moment, and as I am a registered company I get my VAT back which means I can get 560kg of combination maching for under 3000€.
It seems pretty interesting, and so I bow myself before the masters, and seek your advice?
If this is not a good machine, what are my other options at the same(ish) price?
Thanks for any help you can offer.

 

[heimlaga]

For 3000 euros plus the time needed for some repairs you could probably get a top quality combination machine secondhand. l'Invincible made excellent combinations in the old days and so did several British ond German makers as well. In Scandinavia Stenberg is a fairly common brand. I have Stenberg KEV 600 from 1957 and like it a lot. It is a cast iron beast weighing roundabout 1500 kilos. I use it when I make one off doors and windows and other custom joinery that I need at construction sites. Including rebuild costs it costed me 5000 euros plus some work but secondhand machinery is considerably cheaper and more plentiful further south in Europe so you chould be able to get an equivalent for less than 4000 and problably less than 3000 euros in total cost.
The secondhand option does of cause require that you have days or hours off from paid work due to bad weather or delayed deliveries and can utilize those unprofitable hours for a rebuild or at least a thorogh setup which you would not have to do on a new machine.

Another option you could consider would be a surface planer/thicknesser combination and a separate table saw/spindle moulder combination. In a double garage that would work.

I do not know the Damattomachine brand but it looks fairly good but very lightweight. I have a hard time imagining how you could build a rigid and long lasting combination machine with only 560 kilos of metal........ but I suppose they can.......

Let's hope that some more knowledgeable guys reply to this thread and maybe they have other better ideas than I have.

 

[JanneKi]

I would really be careful with the combination machines, if you really have to go into production. You should try to locate some shops or dealers with combination machines and give them a try. You might be surprised about the setup times. I visited some dealers in Turku area and for example the Robland combination machine had to be basically torn apart to switch to planing/thicknessing mode. It was horrible in that sense, if you miss one component and you have to switch back -> takes ages...

Moulder/saw and planer/thicknesser would be pretty much the combinations I'd be willing to go into and even then the thicknesser planer switch has to be fast. The best ones can just be flipped over - in the worst ones you have to take out the whole side fence etc. and then you might even lose your calibrations (like in my Bernardo). The most clever machine I know actually doesn't require any flipping/removals, it works as both as a thicknesser and jointer at the same time (a Swedish Moretens).

I'd also advice you to look into 2nd hand machines, there are sometimes some good deals around.

 

[Steve Maskery]

The other thing you should consider, besides cost and setup times, is the space these things take up. As well as being sizeable machines, you need plenty of access all around them, which may be pushing it a bit in a garage-sized space.
S

 

[Paul66]

Ok so no one actually knows of the Damatomacchine 300/7 super, or can advise on this. So I'll go with #1 and get an axe. Cheap and doesn't take up too much space.

 

[beech1948]

I have no knowledge of the DamatoTechnics machine.

I do however have a Felder 746 combo with a 2.6m slider attached. It needs an awful lot of space to work around. Mine is in a 5mx5m space and I need all of that.

Example. If your timber is 2.4m long then you need 2.4m behind the machine and 2.4m in front to work around it plus man space. If I am going to plane say 300mm wide then you need say 1.2 m space to maneuver at that side of the machine. If you use your slider to cut up a 2440x1200 sheet then you need 2.4m before the machine, 2.4m behind it and 1.22 material plus 1.2 movement space to the side.

Separates are just as space hungry but can be arranged to overlap which is not possible with a combo.

I chose the Felder because of quality, rapid and accurate adjustment to 0.0x of a metre every time with no hassle.

Hope this helps but Steve above is right a double garage may not be big enough for you combo.

Al

Most manufacturers will provide a diagram of the machine space needed plus the people movement space needed. If you squeeze one in you will probably regret it due all the issues of moving around it.

Al