A hand plane question

[digitalbot]

Happy New Year all.

I've been searching for a couple of decent secondhand hand planes for ages ( years in fact ), unfortunately with little success.
I would ideally like to come across some old rusty and unloved ones from somewhere and restore them to working condition. I don't really know enough or have the confidence to buy from ebay. It's different when you can heft the thing in your hand and inspect it before you buy. And i'm not looking to spend silly money.

So a couple of questions:
Did Marples make decent handplanes?
I've come across them occasionally on old tool sites and have often wondered about the quality. The prices asked seem to suggest that they did but it may just be a 'collector' thing.
Other than stanley and record, are there any other makes to consider getting second hand?
Are cutters vailable for most of the old makes?

Any info will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Did Marples make decent handplanes? Yes, but not for many years, so they are nowhere near as commonly available as Stanley and Record, hence the 'collectability' being down to relative rarity. There are lots of Marples woodies about, though, and they are as good as any woodies.

Other than Stanley and Record, who were by far the greatest volume manufacturers, names such as Acorn, WS and possibly others crop up from time to time. They are of comparable quality to Stanley/Record, but relatively rare.

Replacement blades for Stanley and Record planes can be obtained from almost any good tool supplier, and thicker irons (preferred by many craftsmen) are available from Lie-Nielsen, Clifton, Veritas, Ray Isles (who can supply the unusual-sized ones), Quangsheng and possibly others. Prices vary from about £20 or less to about £60 for top-end 2 3/8" irons. You can choose from O1, A2, D2, T10 (water-hardening) and the new PMV11 powder-metallurgy steels.

 

[Harbo]

What do you call silly money?
There's lots of rusty old stuff on the bay very cheap at times - must be worth a punt?
Also lots of stuff available about fettling planes on the web and in books.
You could try Ray Iles site (oldtools.co.uk) he sells reasonably priced S/H tools if you want something workable from the start?

Rod

 

[MIGNAL]

Years! That's a mighty long time to be searching for a rusty old plane.
I think life's a bit too short for that. Just saying.

 

[Fromey]

"silly money" is quite ambiguous. If you don't want to risk ebay purchases (I just suffered from one of those), then a reputable second hand tool dealer may be the way (but then it will depend on whether that falls in to the "silly money" category or not). At least looking at those sources should give you an idea of what are reasonable prices.

http://www.oldtools.co.uk/

http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/tooldealers.html (this list might be a bit out of date now)

 

[Vann]

Did Marples make decent handplanes?

Old Stanley or Record are your best bet, IMHO. You could risk Marples or WS.

Stay away from Rapier, Acorn, Stanley Handyman, newer Stanley and Record, and Record-Marples. These are all budget planes and, while some are okay, the chances of a cr#p one are greater.

Are cutters (a)vailable for most of the old makes?

Cutting irons are interchangeable between most planes (of the same width). Some of the thicker new replacement irons do necessitate some work on the plane (such as filing the mouth and/or lengthening the yoke). However, interchanging cap-irons can sometimes cause problems.

Good luck.

Cheers, Vann.

 

[MIGNAL]

Plenty of the chaps on Ebay:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3x-stanley-no ... 2a278eed88

OK, so they appear to be of a later vintage and the Pics don't tell us much on the condition. Bid accordingly. You'll be extremely unlucky to not get one good working example out of them (you may get 3 working examples). You can always sell the other two as Planes/spares.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STANLEY-BAILE ... 1c2e6c36fb

Appears to be of an earlier vintage (going by the blade), perhaps post war. Ask for pics of the sole (mouth condition) and one of the Frog with blade removed. Don't ask, you don't get.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Stanl ... 337ec4b5f1

In slightly distressed condition. Older US Stanley.

BTW. I'm only suggesting these as being the type of thing that you should be looking for. You can always ask them to mail you more detailed Pics and to thoroughly check that the castings are free from cracks. If they aren't willing to do that, walk away.

 

[Jacob]

I'd go for Record in preference to Stanley, unless you can identify the Stanley as being old (and in good nick of course). Record seem generally to be better quality - judging from my fairly random and uninformed purchases, over the years, of both.
That Stanley 5 1/2 is a gamble - it could be very good, or completely flucked, depending on how long it spent in the pond. :roll: It appears to have little use judging from the amount of blade left, but could be rusted to b.g..ry.

 

[carlb40]

I have 3 stanley hand planes, and think it is either 2 or 3 block planes all purchased via ebay. No issues with the purchases what so ever. Just check the feedback of the seller, see if they have too many negative feedback. Also see if they sell/sold similar items before.

The only issue i had was down to lack of research on my part.
All my hand planes are the old USA made versions, in fact i think they all pre-date 1927 My bad was not researching enough. I assumed ( wrongly ) all 5 1/2's had the 2 3/8" blades.
Not my one as it is the earlier type that takes the 2 1/4" blades. Not sure if this is the same with all 4 1/2 planes, but the mouth on mine is smaller than my newer No 5. So much so i had to buy a tiny file to fettle the front of the mouth.

 

[jimi43]

Since you have been searching for years...you may as well search further or put a watch on seach for ANCHOR PLANE on Fleabay....

I picked this up at random at a bootfair and it is one of my favourite Bailey type planes.

I have shown this before and my comment then was that I believe the key to this being so good is the Swedish steel...

And since it was only a couple of quid if I remember correctly...shaving oak like this....

...is even more satisfying!

That being said...I hadn't heard of them before and haven't seen one since....sorry! :mrgreen:

Jim

 

[Dangermouse]

Happy New Year all.

I've been searching for a couple of decent secondhand hand planes for ages ( years in fact ), unfortunately with little success.
quote]

Well , boot sale and go to , comes to mind.

 

[katellwood]

The Stanley 51/2 on ebay looks similar to one I acquired some time ago, it appears to have a plastic/bakerlite depth adjuster

If it is the same than there will be no mouth adjusting screw in the plane body and no small yoke in the frog. This makes mouth adjustment quite difficult to get it just right

With the amount of old tools kicking around in peoples sheds that they've inherited and will never use, why not place a wanted ad on freecycle you never know your luck

 

[MIGNAL]

I think it's a US wartime plane, type 17. As shown here:

http://home.comcast.net/~rexmill/planes ... typing.htm

Interesting to note that he mentions a thicker body, making them 'sought after as a user'.
I have an English made No.4 that was made at a similar time. That too has a thicker body but it does have the frog adjuster.

stanley-refurb-t14049.html

This plane came to me in a very similar condition to the Ebay example. I guess the thicker casting gives one leeway to remove the pitting! Anyway, I wasn't suggesting that any of the Ebay examples are a good buy. It probably makes far more economic sense to buy one fettled and in good condition. Then again if you like restoring things. . .

 

[AndyT]

I'm not sure which bit of the M1 Mordor is near, but if it's anywhere near Leicester, you have a very easy way out of your years of searching.

Go to the next David Stanley general auction, near Leicester on 25 January. Alongside the auction (which will include hundreds of planes) will be a room full of knowledgeable, friendly second hand tool dealers who will be able to fulfill all your needs for ready cash!

http://www.davidstanley.com/auction dates.htm

I'm just frustrated that Leicester is such an un-handy location if you start from Bristol!

 

[Phil Pascoe]

If I were going there, I wouldn't start from here either.

 

[Tom K]

I'm not sure which bit of the M1 Mordor is near, but if it's anywhere near Leicester, you have a very easy way out of your years of searching.

Go to the next David Stanley general auction, near Leicester on 25 January. Alongside the auction (which will include hundreds of planes) will be a room full of knowledgeable, friendly second hand tool dealers who will be able to fulfill all your needs for ready cash!

http://www.davidstanley.com/auction dates.htm

I'm just frustrated that Leicester is such an un-handy location if you start from Bristol!

Well it's all Middle Earth so can't be far :wink:

 

[Vann]

Hang on a minute :!: :!:

Middle Earth is here in New Zealand. It's a very long drive from here to the M1 or Leicester... :mrgreen:

Cheers, Vann.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Hang on a minute :!: :!:

Middle Earth is here in New Zealand. It's a very long drive from here to the M1 or Leicester... :mrgreen:

Cheers, Vann.

The Auckland - L.A. flight is plenty long enough!

 

[Vann]

The only issue i had was down to lack of research on my part.
All my hand planes are the old USA made versions, in fact i think they all pre-date 1927 My bad was not researching enough. I assumed ( wrongly ) all 5 1/2's had the 2 3/8" blades.
Not my one as it is the earlier type that takes the 2 1/4" blades. Not sure if this is the same with all 4 1/2 planes...

It's only the #5½ that had the 2¼" irons. Up until the 1930s all Stanleys #5½s had 2¼" irons - the #5½ Bailey; the #605½ Bedrock; and the #27½ transitional.

According to Blood & Gore, Stanley changed to the "standard" 2⅜" width in 1939. However I wonder if it might have been earlier. The introduction of the type #16 in 1933, with a redesigned frog and lever-cap, would have been an opportunity to "standardise". Stanley UK began making planes around 1936-37, based on the Stanley USA models of the day, the type #16, and I believe UK Stanley #5½s were always 2⅜" from day one.

Record, on the other hand, based their planes on the Stanley USA type #14, and early 05½ planes had 2¼" irons (until around 1937-39 - according to David Lynch's website).

Cheers, Vann.

 

[digitalbot]

Thanks for all the responses guys.
I shall peruse the links asap.
Silly money to me is probably over about 35 quid. If it's in bad shape but do-able then it's quite a lot of work in my spare time and that's in short supply. I don't mind doing it for a minute ( in fact I probably enjoy it if i'm honest ) but without anywhere to work in the winter months it proves difficult.

And this "Mordor" is nearer to London then anywhere else.
As for car boot sales round here, you can forget it. They are nowhere near as common as they once were ( all going on ebay? ) and the things you do find are utter junk.

I'll keep looking armed with my new information.

thanks.