Wadking Bursgreen ags 10 spindle Disassembly help

[Skiik]

Hello everyone,
I bought a ags 10 saw the other day here in Germany. It is in pretty good shape apart from the cast bracket the rivin knife mounts onto (It is the riving knife that is in the parallelogram style). It is a newer modell being from 78(if I read the Machine Number correctly). The bracket for the riving knife which mounts to the saw arbor is broken into two pieces. I would like to fix it and for that I have to get it off the arbor which turns out to be harder than I tought it would be. I pulled the pulley off (with quite a bit of trouble) only to realize that there is some sort of lockin ring which is secured on the spindle with two locking screws. The whole locking ring sits in the hole for the bearings (see pictures). I just do not get how I would reach the screws without drilling a hole into the casing and have no idea how they assembled it like that. I tried pulling of the saw flange but it didn't go anywhere and I am afraid to damage something if I use much more force. I also tried heating it a bit, didn't help either. Any tips on how to get the locking ring off?
thanks in advance,
Lukas

 

[MusicMan]

I have the older version so I can't be definite, but I am fairly sure that the spindle (and bearings) pushes out from the pulley side, after releasing the spindle clamp nut and collar.

You know there is an exploded diagram on the Wadkin Library? Yours is:

http://www.wadkin.com/uploads/files/Wad ... (10%20inch)%20Sawbench%20Manual%20&%20Parts%20List.pdf

Others on here have the same model as you, so can be more definite.

Keith

 

[Skiik]

The link doesn't seem to work even if I coppy it. I have the manual printed out tough but ir is for a different year off the saw so there are quite a few differences one of them being the riving knife.

 

[Vann]

...It is a newer modell being from 78(if I read the Machine Number correctly)...

Hi Skiik, welcome to the site.

I can't help with your problem, but I believe Wadkin issued test numbers in the 77000 and 78000 range in 1968. However, after the merger with Bursgreen, Wadkin numbers sometimes got a bit murky - on yours it's not obvious whether 78361 is the serial number, or a combined serial/test number. If it's the latter then your saw ten years older than you thought.

If you get no help here, try the Canadian Woodworking forum https://forum.canadianwoodworking.com/f ... wer-Tools= a lot of Wadkin enthusiasts ("Waddies") hang out there :wink:

Cheers, Vann.

 

[Skiik]

I still think it is a newer saw since it has the different riving knife and hand wheels. I will ask the canadians for help aswell. Thanks for the Tip!

 

[wallace]

It looks to me that you need to get that flange off on the right of your last pic.

 

[Skiik]

yes, it is the only way I can see without drilling a hole. I tried and didn't get it off so I tought maybe it is fixed somehow. I will try and get it off again.

Edit: Didn't move a bit. I heated it up and cranked it as hard as i could. Only bend the steel holding my pull of jig.

 

[wallace]

Does the flange have a gib key? Is there a dimple in the end of the shaft for positioning a puller on it? What does the big circlip lock.
I recently rebuilt a wadkin chop saw and I ended up bending the flange trying to get it off. In the end I ended up heating it and using a sledge hammer to get it off. I measured it afterwards and the flange was nearly 0.4mm smaller than the shaft it went on.

 

[SammyQ]

Whoa! Whoa! That big thick 'flange' is the one the blade sits against. Those two hidden set screws are VERY odd...they are where the bearing rings should be? The arbour and shaft slide out, left to right, bringing two bearings with them. That hole in the green housing is to have a bolt go through it and hold a tapped collar in place inside the housing, between the two bearings. The collar helps centralise the shaft inside the housing. I have the older AGS presently dismantled, and will post photos of MY arbour etc later tonight. What bothers me slightly is the obvious circlip just behind the blade flange, SURELY it has to come off in order to release the shaft?

Sam

 

[Skiik]

1) Circlip: Holds the broken bracket for the riving knife in place so that it can't slide into the spinning flange
2) Gib key: I don't think so. I can't see a cutout for a key on neither the flange nor the locking ring on the other side
3) There is a hole which I assume is for a puller (see picture, it has the same hole on both sides)
4) Hidden Screws: Yes I have no idea how it got there either I assume someone swapped the bearings and put different ones in. I still have NO idea how he got the locking ring in there tough.
5) I also can't get the bearings out by taping with a hammer but I haven't hit it too hard yet because I don't want to ruin the bearings.
also: the piece between the bearing which is held in place with a screw usually can move a lot and is much more narrow than the one in the plans. Looking at the plans it looks like it should bee tight between the bearings

edit: looking at the plans it seems like only part number 90 is between the bearings which is probably also the reason why the "spindle locking collar" was able to move in there

 

[SammyQ]

Right, here is what help I am confident to give:

This is a screenshot of the manual for my saw. You can see on it a spacer, No7, which keeps the bearings at a designated distance apart. No8 is the tapped collar, into which a bolt locates from outside No14. This bolt is missing in your photos. On my spindle, items No10 and No9 were fused by rust and cut off. The Woodruff key, No5, located the pulley No10 with a key slot cut into its bore. Items 2,3 and 4 are visible in your photos, backing onto the broken bracket.

EDIT EDIT!! I know what the set screws are on yours! No11! They will only be accessible after pushing the shaft out.

Here is my arbour, from two angles to make sense of the above:

The collar on yours that is broken, that on mine has two small holes, is free to rotate around the spindle housing. It locates onto a parallelogram plate that bears the riving knife.

When I renovated mine, I managed to get a pulley extractor inbetween the main spindle housing and the rotating collar, it was then a case of winding in the pointed end of the extractor and it simply pushed out the spindle. If you bash the threaded end of the shaft, just above the Woodruff key housing, you will 'peen' the threads. I did, and I only just managed to restore them - see photo. As I was NOT replacing the triple pulley, but was instead installing an expanding bush pulley, I cared little.

Hope that helps.

Sam

EDIT: If you manage to move the shaft, the bearings wil be ruined. They only cost me £17 in this backwater part of U.K. - and they were freely available off the shelf!

 

[Skiik]

Thanks! Your help is verry much appreciated! I Got the whole assembly out of the housing bearings and locking ring without removing the locking collar as you said. I heated the housing and hit the shaft for quite a while. Everything on that whole assembly seems to be super stuck tough. The bearings are a major pain to get off aswell since there is close to no space between bearing and spacers so I can't really get a hold of them. I might just cut them off. Do you know if the bearings are regular ball bearings or are they something fancy?

 

[SammyQ]

Nope, ball races. Look at the housings on each side of the bearings, there are numbers on them. Your bearing supplier can use the numbers to provide a modern equivelant. USED SEALED BEARINGS. Otherwise, fine sawdust wrecks them.

Cheers, Sam

EDIT: Try this to date your Wdakin:

http://www.wadkinrestorations.co.uk/wad ... ating.html

This was put together by a bloke called "Wallace" (a.k.a. Mark) who has done quite a collection of marvellous restorations. He posts regularly on here.

S.