Strange firmer chisels

[Jackthejoiner]

Hi guys, so I got dragged to a car boot sale this weekend and found some handle-less firmer chisels with the old pointed tang. On further inspection they looked pretty unused and had the price tag of a mere £3. Needless to say it didn't take much persuading and I was the proud new owner of 4 old chisels, a nice little handle project to keep me busy. Turns out two of the chisels are I H sorby, 1 is a ward, and the other is a fenn castlegate.

What I can't understand is that these former chisels have no bolster section for the handle to butt up to, I have never seen a firmer without the bolster section. Any ideas guys, unless these are meant to be paring chisels. I have a feeling that these have never had handles let alone been used before.
I'm going to try and upload a picture for you all to see,
What I don't want is to make new handles and have them split quickly as am I right in thinking I would be only relying on the ferrule to prevent this.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

No signs of the bolsters having been ground off?

 

[Jackthejoiner]

No obvious signs of the bolsters being ground off, I'm wondering were they always part of the original cast, or were they sometimes added on later.

 

[D_W]

Lathe chisels?

Though if they're lathe chisels, not sure what the narrow ones would be for.

 

[Jackthejoiner]

I'm thinking you may well be correct D_W about them being turning chisels. I'm struggling to find anything similar through research and it's starting to send me mad

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Fenn and Co were a London firm noted for their ornamental turning lathes, but they were located in Newgate Street for most of their existence - http://uphill.org.uk/pages/ot/Fenn/about_fenn.htm - which I mention because those chisels do look quite like the lighter pattern of turning chisel you'd associate with a treadle or similar lathe. I've no idea where 'Castlegate' comes into it though, so that might be a blind alley!

 

[Jackthejoiner]

Great information. Sorry you are quite right it does say Newgate, my bad!

 

[AndyT]

Fascinating!

I'm sure that they are turning tools.

Here's a page from the 1928 Marples catalogue. It shows unhandled turning chisels in two styles - the default, ordinary style, and also the "long and strong​" variant. I think yours are probably the ordinary smaller type.
As you can see, the range of widths was from 1/4" to 2".

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I've used the Marples catalogue as it was handy, but tools such as these were very standardised and the name found on them was a warranty of quality rather than a set of special characteristics.

What's really striking about your four is that although they bear three different marks, they look as if they come from the same maker, using the same steel. They match in colour and shape.

My guess is that they do indeed come from the same maker. Most Sheffield firms relied on a network of skilled, specialist outworkers - the "little mesters". They would have been provided with various marks to use on their work, according to which company had an order for them. Somehow, these four never got sent their separate ways and presumably never got handled or used.

It's a lovely bit of Sheffield history. If I were you I'd keep them just as they are, for the story.

 

[JohnPW]

I would think they are turning chisels which have long tangs and no bolster because the forces are different compared with normal chisels.

You push a chisel along its length and the bolster resists that. But the force on a turning chisel is sideways, therefore you need a long tang and there's no need for a bolster.

 

[Jackthejoiner]

Thanks for the info guys I can now sleep at night . The steel in each one looks identical, they are ground to identical angles, without the different makers names you would think they were from the the same factory...... so maybe they are......

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I'll go along with the consensus - the photo was not there when I posted.

 

[Caruso]

Apparently turning chisels. If you would like to use them as normal chisels I would suggest a thick steel washer with the hole filed to fit the tang at a suitable location along the tang in order to serve as a bolster.