Newcomer to Woodwork: Questions on projects and tools

[Paul Chapman]

Question time: Is it best to get a Try-square or a Combination Square?

I would always buy a decent engineers square - something like this http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/Eng ... 150mm.html

The traditional woodworkers squares with a wooden handle and the combination squares tend not to be very accurate. With an inaccurate square you will get cumulative errors in your work which will end up causing you problems.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Jelly]

When I buy the likes of Hammers/Mallets/Squares/Knives can these items be bought from the likes of B&Q, Wickes etc. or is it best to buy from Axminster and other reputable sites?

Where in your opinion is best to buy tools from? I don't mean boot sales or ebay or anything like that yet, I don't have the knowledge to buy safely from these places so must stick to online, DIY stores.

Have a look on http://www.toolbank.com, if you note down the order numbers and go into almost any timber/builders merchants they'll be able to order exactly what you want or need within 48hrs or so. A really good range of gear and usually cheaper than b&q and the like.

Screwfix and (to a lesser extent) Machine Mart are worth checking if you're looking for relatively common tools, sometimes they have stuff cheaper than anywhere else...

For more specialised tools, axminster, workshop heaven and the like are undoubtedly king, but it's well worth checking to see if there are any specialist shops in your area, always good to shop local!

For planes, other than the obligatory No.5 or similar do-it-all I reckon its worth waiting and aquiring that little bit of extra knowlege required to buy second hand... In general modern metal bodied planes are either Iffy* or Very Expensive, wheras the older ones tend to be quite affordable for their high quality. The older wooden bodied planes are IMO superior again, but they're somewhat different (most notably, they're set with very gentle taps with a hammer or mallet, not adjustment screws).

*I've had good experiences with cheap planes, but they're not consistent: you might get one that's perfect or you might get one which is not quite so and needs a good fettling

Does anyone have any sites that they know of with good projects for the beginner using mostly hand tools?

I've had a good look around myself, many projects seem to lead on to sites that require you to part with $50 or whatever first. Or require you to have more machinery than Rolls Royce.

I don't have a direct answer... but as you learn how all the joints are made (if you have some scrap wood, just practice different joints on it till you have developed a technique that works for you) then its usually possible to follow plans written with powertools in mind just substituting the powered techniques for appropriate manual ones as you go along...

The only exception to that is when it would entail hand ripping thick sections... Which is possible, but takes an inordinate amount of time and energy.

 

[TheWizardofOdds]

When I buy the likes of Hammers/Mallets/Squares/Knives can these items be bought from the likes of B&Q, Wickes etc. or is it best to buy from Axminster and other reputable sites?

Where in your opinion is best to buy tools from? I don't mean boot sales or ebay or anything like that yet, I don't have the knowledge to buy safely from these places so must stick to online, DIY stores.

Have a look on http://www.toolbank.com, if you note down the order numbers and go into almost any timber/builders merchants they'll be able to order exactly what you want or need within 48hrs or so. A really good range of gear and usually cheaper than b&q and the like.

Screwfix and (to a lesser extent) Machine Mart are worth checking if you're looking for relatively common tools, sometimes they have stuff cheaper than anywhere else...

For more specialised tools, axminster, workshop heaven and the like are undoubtedly king, but it's well worth checking to see if there are any specialist shops in your area, always good to shop local!

For planes, other than the obligatory No.5 or similar do-it-all I reckon its worth waiting and aquiring that little bit of extra knowlege required to buy second hand... In general modern metal bodied planes are either Iffy* or Very Expensive, wheras the older ones tend to be quite affordable for their high quality. The older wooden bodied planes are IMO superior again, but they're somewhat different (most notably, they're set with very gentle taps with a hammer or mallet, not adjustment screws).

*I've had good experiences with cheap planes, but they're not consistent: you might get one that's perfect or you might get one which is not quite so and needs a good fettling

Does anyone have any sites that they know of with good projects for the beginner using mostly hand tools?

I've had a good look around myself, many projects seem to lead on to sites that require you to part with $50 or whatever first. Or require you to have more machinery than Rolls Royce.

I don't have a direct answer... but as you learn how all the joints are made (if you have some scrap wood, just practice different joints on it till you have developed a technique that works for you) then its usually possible to follow plans written with powertools in mind just substituting the powered techniques for appropriate manual ones as you go along...

The only exception to that is when it would entail hand ripping thick sections... Which is possible, but takes an inordinate amount of time and energy.

Thanks, I agree about shopping locally, I've taken a look at some local antiques shops and one in particular has a load of old wooden planes but they look like they need a lot of TLC. I will keep an eye out in future for more. They have really old chisels etc. I think if you knew your onions so to speak it could be a very good cheap resource for a woodworker.

 

[TheWizardofOdds]

I have been thinking and thinking about what to do for projects and have decided upon a very simple small four foot by two bench to start me off. It's only now that I have managed to pick up a few tools at last. I looked locally at the likes of Wickes, Homebase and some local antique shops but decided that the tools were either too cheap, inadequate, or needed too much work done to get up to scratch. So yesterday I went to Bill's Tool Store in Glasgow's East End and it was thick with tradesmen buying whatever they needed. I came away with a bradawl for a quid, a marking knife for three quid, a 1991 Stanley hand drill for a tenner and a Record No. 4 plane for a score. I don't actually need the plane for this initial project but I took a chance on it in the hope that I can refurb it to a good usable condition. Most of the tools in the store are ex-MOD I believe. The plane is a 1982 one. It didn't have a screw at the front but was fitted with one from a Stanley No.5. I wasn't sure which plane to go for but since my Essential Woodworker book references a Record No.4 in the stripping and preparation of a plane I went for that instead. Now I need a tape measure, universal saw and a square and I'm good to go.

I went to all the aforementioned stores and also some local timber yards and priced my timber. Unsurprisingly, the timber yards are much cheaper. Still not what I'd call cheap really but there you go, everything's going up in price these days. I need some softwood mostly but for the top of the bench I was thinking 18mm thick Plywood, does that seem ok? I can't remember off hand what the cutting list states for the top. It is only a small bench but it should go together ok even for me. From there probably the horses, I just want to get a bench together quickly and get started on making projects.

Here's a poorly taken pic of yesterday's tool buy. Should I be putting these in a new thread in a Project thread or is here ok?

 

[TheWizardofOdds]

Question time: Is it best to get a Try-square or a Combination Square?

I would always buy a decent engineers square - something like this http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/Eng ... 150mm.html

The traditional woodworkers squares with a wooden handle and the combination squares tend not to be very accurate. With an inaccurate square you will get cumulative errors in your work which will end up causing you problems.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

I've taken a look at the engineer squares and have seen a Moore and Wright 150mm for twenty quid, think I'll get it. Thanks.

 

[adzeman]

I was in the market last year for a large tradtional square with a wood handle and was a prime purpose for attending the Bentley Wood fair. There were loads for sale all at very cheap rates. There were a number of engineers squares available also. It is simple to check if a square is true take a pencil with you and draw a line on the sellers table or a spare piece of wood. Turn the square over on the same point and draw a line. If you have one line showing its true if a v line dont buy.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

That assumes, of course, that the reference surface is dead straight.

 

[LJM]

Others have mentioned clamps in passing; assuming you get fully sucked into this, you may find yourself surprised by the number that you need for some jobs, meaning they can be a considerable expense. So it may be beneficial to keep an eye out for bargains, new or used, and slowly build up a stock of them. But as with other purchases, be guided by the work you wish to or are doing.

Good luck

 

[TheWizardofOdds]

I was in the market last year for a large tradtional square with a wood handle and was a prime purpose for attending the Bentley Wood fair. There were loads for sale all at very cheap rates. There were a number of engineers squares available also. It is simple to check if a square is true take a pencil with you and draw a line on the sellers table or a spare piece of wood. Turn the square over on the same point and draw a line. If you have one line showing its true if a v line dont buy.

I'm still a bit undecided about going for a try square or the engineers square. It's going to be another long month before I can get the rest of tools/timber I need for the bench so I'm weighing up whether to go for a relatively cheap 11/12 quid try or spend a bit more for the engineer square. Thanks for the tip.

Others have mentioned clamps in passing; assuming you get fully sucked into this, you may find yourself surprised by the number that you need for some jobs, meaning they can be a considerable expense. So it may be beneficial to keep an eye out for bargains, new or used, and slowly build up a stock of them. But as with other purchases, be guided by the work you wish to or are doing.

Good luck

:lol: ...Oh yes I'm well and truly sucked in and I haven't done a thing yet.

I completely agree that I should be guided by the work I'm doing as to the tools/materials I purchase. That's my aim, I've got a list of tools and timber I need for the bench/table(?) and I'm sticking to it. Well, I bought the plane thinking it was a decent price and I'll need one quite soon. I hope to add to my tool kit by the project picking up whatever I need in a trade off between quality and price.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Don't forget you can put a steel rule across something and use a good square to square the ruler. You don't always need to have the square reach right across, so a 6" engineer's is quite a sound choice.