Making Bread Board Ends to a cabinet top

[Charlie Woody]

I am making an oak TV cabinet which my good lady wants to look substantial. So after much discussion she said the top should be 45mm thick. However when I showed her the dimensioned timber she said it weighed too much (...... I had pointed this out originally ) She still wants the edges to be thick, so I have suggested the outside edges should be 65mm wide x 45mm thick with the centre boards 18mm thick.

My original plan was to breadboard the ends which would have been simple enough with the same thickness material. However I am now wondering how I should do it using the different thicknesses; do I (a) create a 6mm tongue 6mm down from the top edge of both thicknesses, which will be 6mm from the bottom of the thinner pieces and 27mm from the bottom of the thicker pieces; or (b) do I need to centre the tongue on the thicker pieces?

As usual your considered advice would be much appreciated.

 

[AndyT]

A simpler way of achieving the same thing is what was called 'lining up' - you make the full size top with your thin boards but make it look thicker by mounting a frame of wood around it, on the underside. Rather than trying to blend the joint in, make a chamfer along the top edge of the frame to give a shadow line along the joint. Join it on with screws up into the top, making sure that the holes are oversized or slotted to allow for movement.

It's quite a common technique on old table tops and similar. If the piece is to stand against a wall, it only needs three sides.

 

[katellwood]

What about a 9mm tenon set down 9mm from the face which will in effect create a bare face tenon on the thinner boards and an ordinary tenon on the thicker outer boards.

any way will do if you set out from the face/top side of the top.

In addition I personally would not groove it I would tenon it with haunches in the tenons to strengthen the breadboard ends.

 

[gasman]

Hi Charlie
I have just done exactly what you are suggesting with a big teak table 2100 x 1000
I mostly only had 18mm teak though so I joined 5 boards to make a top 1850x1000x18mm. Then got 2 of 1850x50x18mm pieces and glued them under the edges to make 36mm thick sides to the whole table. Then I used up some surplus teak cut off the ends of the long boards to create 2 of 900x 50x18mm pieces with the grain running across the short dimension and glued them under the ends of the table top so now I have a 50mm width of 36mm thick table top going all round all 4 sides. Finally I put breadboard ends 1000x150x36 on each end so unless you look closely under the table you have no idea the table top is really only 18mm. Does that make sense?
It is a stunning table - never worked in teak like this before. I can dig out photos if you like? I may have some
BW
Mark

 

[Chems]

Just to throw another option into the mix Charlie as well as the other good ones here.

If you decide to go without the breadboard ends I've done this in the past to fake a thick top:

Glue up a load of offcuts to make the ends, then trim with the table saw after glueup to remove the mess.

Make a 3 sides table top:

And put it all together it looks pretty real:

This was much easier than I thought it would be, one of those nice reversals where you think it will be hard but actually was easy. Rather than the usual that'll be a 5 min job but still on it 4 weeks later.

 

[Charlie Woody]

Thanks for all the helpful replies guys.

What I did n't explain clearly at the beginning was that I have already prepared the four 45mm x 65mm pieces so I don't need to add extra thickness to the 18mm stock. Therefore I think katellwood's suggestion will suit my needs best.

So if I mortice and tenon with haunches to join on the end pieces where should I apply the glue? To allow for movement I guess it should be only in the center? As the center board is 50mm will the be enough glue surface to keep the ends on?

What would you suggest please?

 

[AndyT]

I think you could still simplify this.

Haunches are used at corners or when a tenon goes into a piece which has had to be grooved. For your top boards the tenons only need to be stub tenon length - about 10 mm - so you just need to make a groove in your thick end pieces, and rebate the ends of your top boards to make their whole width fit into it.

You don't need to cut several separate mortices.

As for expansion/contraction and gluing - I would think that the most important thing is that the top boards stay stuck together as a unit, without having gaps along their edges, so glue them together along their edges. (Add biscuits if you want to do but a plain glued joint should be fine.)

I'd then glue the front board only, at the ends and along its front edge.

That way, any gaps that do appear if the top shrinks in its frame will be at the back of the unit, hidden behind the TV. The part you can see - the front of the frame and the first thin board - will be united together tidily.

 

[katellwood]

Have a look at this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXhwntyBg98

 

[Charlie Woody]

Have a look at this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXhwntyBg98

Wow wish I could work that fast!!!!

Some good ideas .... thanks.