Energy price saving 'con'

[stuartpaul]

I shop around for almost everything so I don't need the current publicity to make me keep doing it.

My current (get it!) deal ends in May but I thought it useful to have a look round sooner rather than later. So off I trots to one of the comparison sites and after pumping in all the necessary information I'm told I can save £180 a year. Not masses but very nearly a new plane!

I had problems on the site so picked up the phone to speak to a human. They confirm all details including the saving and then inform me my 'new' monthly direct will be £119 when compared to my current (I did it again!) £86.

Now whilst I only have a grade 2 CSE in maths 119 is bigger than 86 so where the heck does the 180 saving come from?! Apparently all comparisons are based on the full tariff and not the one you're currently on. I went round in circles trying to get the young lady to agree that I wasn't actually going to make a saving at all (in fact pay more) and she point blank refused to accept it! I even asked her if 119 was bigger than 86 and in the context of the conversation she refused to provide a straight answer.

I refused to up my direct debit as I'm always in credit so went to my existing supplier and managed to change to a tariff that would at least allow me to maintain current direct debit.

It left me feeling rather exasperated and wondering if this whole 'you can save £xxxxx' is a bit of a con when many people these days aren't on full tariff.

If you're paying full tariff you need your bumps felt but I do accept that there are those who need help in achieving reduced payments (quite how you do that I don't know).

Rant over!

 

[paulrockliffe]

Ignore the Direct Debit price and always go straight to the price per unit and the standing charge. That way you cut through the waffle and bullshit and can work it out for yourself.

I recently had a price comparison site tell me I could save about the same as you, I'd told them my exact usage for the last year too. But the unit price was a fraction of a penny cheaper, with more expensive standing charges, so the saving was complete rubbish. No idea what they do to work out their figures, but it's fairly easy to work out whether it's a better deal if you compare the unit prices instead.

 

[finneyb]

' Energy price comparison sites should compensate customers who were not given the cheapest deals, MPs have said. 'http://www.bbc.com/news/business-31661858

(must be an election coming up :shock: :shock: :shock: )

Brian

 

[lurker]

Ask yourself this: are comparison sites charities ?
They have to make their money somehow that buddy meerkat does not work for nothing.
They are in bed with the big six. Who clearly operate a cartel

 

[RobinBHM]

I'm sceptical about this constant advise to switch. A cheaper price is great in theory, but what happens when the switch isnt smooth and admin errors mean a double direct debit gets taken, or a refund is never issued, or the new direct debit actually is more. I see lots of horror stories about these type of problems and then any potential savings are lost and a whole lot of hassle ringing call centres ensues.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Martyn Lewis on the radio the other day -
A while back the Govt. were annoyed that we couldn't hunt for the best deal from our suppliers, so they changed the system.
Roll on the clock.
The Govt. are now annoyed that some people are paying more than others.

What did they think would happen?

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I generally fix my price every two years or so and often switch to do so. Every time I do it the monthly DD gets smaller. You compare apples with apples ie the unit price and standing charges. It's not rocket science! This time because of the deflation in oil/gas prices there will be bigger savings.

Competition is usually a good thing. Conspiracy theories are usually wrong!

 

[LeeElms]

The thing that's missing is a web site that lists the unit prices and standing charge amounts for all the companies / tariffs -- even better if the site allows you to enter your annual usage and show you the total cost ... but do you expect this to even happen?

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Electricity is fine, but anyone ever mastered the intricacies of their gas bill?

 

[stuartpaul]

I'm fully capable of working out when something is cheaper or not.

What winds me up is this consistent 'you can save this much' when clearly that isn't true! The way comparison sites work (those I've used anyhow) tend to make the unit price/standing charges a little less easy to find to make that direct comparison.

Being lead up the garden path by people who should be helping makes me feel for those less able to make some of those decisions objectively and rely on the headline figure.

This is going to become more important with the current push to change.

 

[Richard863]

Hi Phil.p

If you have a old imperial gas meter. You will need to go on a weekend residential course for mathematics and magic
to work out the actual kWh especially as the calorific value seems to change every day.
Why do you think the big 6 dislike changing the meter. Its not on the basis "If it works don't fix it". More to the point so you will never fathom out why your equation never matches theirs.
Who's being taken to the cleaners? :roll:

Richard

 

[Silas Gull]

I am always resentful of the way they project your estimated annual usage, and then spread the whole lot equally over 4 quarters for you to pay by DD.
Why should I assist a multi billion pound business with its cash flow over the lean summer months?
More to the point, why should I be penalised for NOT doing so?

 

[Richard863]

Sorry I forgot to enter this MY ACTUAL POWER USE FOR THE YEAR ECONOMY 7 DAY 3359 NIGHT 2768 & GAS 201 kWhs
If the following will help. I submitted my economy 7 and gas figures to all in my letter via their websites and worked the totals out for myself. Oh forget the Government tariff comparison its a minefield.
Then settled for 1st Utility, OK if I break off before March 2016 I have to repay the £60 bonus.

Richard

Power estimate on all companies based on Economy7 and gas inc standing chg with online and direct debit but no termination charges


OVO gas £362.72 elect £796.14 with £60 discount for online, total = £998.86
corrected

EXTRA gas £135.52 Elect £811.21 total = £946.73 corrected

EDF gas £172.60, Elect £808.75 total = £981.35 corrected

N Power gas £108.63 elect £753.73 total = £862.36

First Utility gas £145.77 Elect £677.17 total = £822.95 -£60 = £762.95 bonus isave March 16 v44

EON age £79.95 monthly fixed iyear v14 £69 monthly
Gas £156.51, r1 465.14, r2 177.75 +sc = £702.83
total = £859.34 corrected



Scottish current gas £217.72 elect elect = £701.55 total = £919.27 to date

their estimate 2015/16 gas £196.02 elect £927.13 total = £1123.15

my estimate gas = £159.72, elect £741.97, total = £901.69 based on New rate .pdf




Their usage r1 3644.527, r2 3147.166, Gas 2577.862 kWh ???

 

[ChrisR]

Relax the whole home energy thing is just one big government con.

Electric supply/Gas supply is the same and comes down the same cable or pipe, irrespective of the so called service provider, if one is cheaper than the others, why don’t all consumers use that provider ?, simple answer, each provider use clever marketing tactics to make you believe that they are the cheapest.

I have never switched providers, and never will, until one provider emerges as the cheapest in the whole country and that will never happen, because as said at the start, the whole thing is one big government con, to make you believe that there is open market competition for home energy supply.

Take care.

Chris R.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Sorry Chris to be rude, but you obviously have more money than sense. Energy companies rely on exactly that reluctance to change. I've just changed mine - 1.5p per unit difference at night (no mains gas) and over 5p per unit difference by day (plus 5% vat). About £340 p.a.
That's competition enough for me.

 

[mseries]

Sorry Chris to be rude, but you obviously have more money than sense. Energy companies rely on exactly that reluctance to change. I've just changed mine - 1.5p per unit difference at night (no mains gas) and over 5p per unit difference by day (plus 5% vat). About £340 p.a.
That's competition enough for me.

Yup, personally I don't care if my provider is not the cheapest for the whole country, each time I have switched I have saved money. Last time I switched tariffs with the same provider and saved £18 per month. No really. No one conned me.

 

[ChrisR]

Sorry Chris to be rude, but you obviously have more money than sense. Energy companies rely on exactly that reluctance to change. I've just changed mine - 1.5p per unit difference at night (no mains gas) and over 5p per unit difference by day (plus 5% vat). About £340 p.a.
That's competition enough for me.

Then why is everybody not on the same provider that you have just signed up too ?, if they are really the cheapest. No you can’t convince me that it is not a big government con trick.

If it was genuine the governments duty is to advise all home consumers which is the cheapest provider, but they can’t do that because there is not a cheapest provider, if you don’t pay on the tariff, then you pay on hidden charges.

The only true way to save on enginery costs is my method.
Keep a tight/close control on the energy used.

I don’t have more money than sense, I just have a reduced state pension.

Why reduced, yet another government con trick when I was working. To convince workers to part contract out of national insurance to pay for a private/works pension, which in a lot of cases like mine, was pilfered by company bosses. :evil:
Great say the government we don’t now have to pay him a full state pension. :evil:

Take care, don’t turn your back, as they are out to get you.

Chris R.

 

[mseries]

Sorry Chris to be rude, but you obviously have more money than sense. Energy companies rely on exactly that reluctance to change. I've just changed mine - 1.5p per unit difference at night (no mains gas) and over 5p per unit difference by day (plus 5% vat). About £340 p.a.
That's competition enough for me.

if you don’t pay on the tariff, then you pay on hidden charges.

hidden charges ? they are very well hidden, they don't even show on my bank statement

 

[Phil Pascoe]

"Then why is everybody not on the same provider that you have just signed up too?"
I can only assume because they are happy to pay more.

 

[Eric The Viking]

I switched earlier in the year. I've calculated about 400/year savings, although that's a forecast presently.

I'm with Chris in that I detest this false market - it's inefficient and wasteful, and has led to our energy provision being very badly managed - but there is no doubt sticking with one supplier is foolish at the moment.

In the long term, like the railways, it should all go back into public ownership (but be run properly!). Energy provision is too strategic to be left to market forces. We know they're not investing enough now, and realistically they can't be forced to all the while they're profit-driven. Unless someone gets the industry to put money into new plant and infrastructure brownouts and blackouts at times of peak demand are pretty likely.