Banking Industry

[Travis]

I have heard all this talk of money or the shortage thereof.
I am ready to do my part.
Just tell me when enough is enough.

Travis

 

[Rich]

Without wishing to be critical, one cannot "live" in a car, A place of residence is a MUST for any family, but a car is not a necessity for everyone, understandably, self employed and the like need wheels, if push came to shove, I could walk to work and get the shopping at the weekend using the local buses, this would be a nuisance but is do-able.

I must say, that is a splendid dissertation by Stevieb, the way he put it in laymans terms make it easy for ME to understand, thanks for that steve, and no offence taken anyway mate, I don't think you are the type to offend.

Different folk lead different lifestyles and have different priorities, I was referring to my own circumstances earlier and think we lead a prudent lifestyle in this household, we don't want medals, but then again we don't have worrying letters on the doormat.

Regards,

Rich.

 

[Losos]

Thought i would just pop back and would especially like our American cousins to respond to this:-

Dick FULD the ex CEO of Lehman Brothers has been hauled up before a finance committee to explain how he allowed his firm to go bust. The chairman of the committee put up a slide which showed that since the year 2000 he has pocketed .......................wait for it....................................


almost half a billion dollars the American billion of course :!:


yes, that's no typo, not million but billion :shock:

I believe the exact figure was 480 million but whose worried about the odd 120 million :lol:

That is more than some very small third world countries and certainly more than anyone on here would likely earn in a lifetime

 

[Losos]

I must say, that is a splendid dissertation by Stevieb, the way he put it in laymans terms make it easy for ME to understand, thanks for that steve, and no offence taken anyway mate, I don't think you are the type to offend.

Yes, thanks for taking the time to write that Steve.

The only thing I would add is that each time the 'debt is sold on' (and it can happen many times as Steve said) the recovery tactics tend to get heavier. So people who have no idea about lending find that the loan from their friendly high street bank (Where they always had a nice customer service lady to speak to) becomes, after a few years, (and maybe some missed payments) that they have a couple of heavies in black suits and sunglasses to deal with on the doorstep

 

[BradNaylor]

Interesting piece in today's Independant by Andreas Whittam-Smith.

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/co ... 52488.html

Basically makes the very good point that our current financial woes are the fault of the directors of the major banks and that they should all go to jail.

There's not much I can add.

Dan

 

[RogerS]

Thought i would just pop back and would especially like our American cousins to respond to this:-

Dick FULD the ex CEO of Lehman Brothers has been hauled up before a finance committee to explain how he allowed his firm to go bust. The chairman of the committee put up a slide which showed that since the year 2000 he has pocketed .......................wait for it....................................


almost half a billion dollars the American billion of course :!:


yes, that's no typo, not million but billion :shock:

I believe the exact figure was 480 million but whose worried about the odd 120 million :lol:

That is more than some very small third world countries and certainly more than anyone on here would likely earn in a lifetime

No it wasn't that much. Not even close. A lot of money..yes...was it excessive...most likely but suggest maybe a lot of us could stop reading the Daily Mail?

 

[Digit]

I think that when you deal on a daily basis with large sums of somebody else's money it just loses its meaning.
I'm not a great lover of regulation and control but it looks as though that is way things will have to be.
They should certainly be made to explain their actives, and if needs be, justify them.

Roy.

 

[RogerS]

Interesting piece in today's Independant by Andreas Whittam-Smith.

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/co ... 52488.html

Basically makes the very good point that our current financial woes are the fault of the directors of the major banks and that they should all go to jail.

There's not much I can add.

Dan

Accurate reporting maybe?

Shouldn't it read "Basically makes the very good point that our current financial woes are the fault of the directors of the major banks (Independent) and that they should all go to jail (Dan Tovey)". At least that was my read of the article.

It's all well and good slagging off the bank directors but we also should point the finger at ourselves (OK OK I know that some of you never ever borrow, built your own house, never had a credit card, whatever but for the 99.999999% remaining part of the population it applies) as we've all fed from the trough.

 

[Rich]

As a matter of interest, what papers do the forum members read? myself? I read the Express and the Times.

Rich.

 

[Digit]

Express, and dare I say it The Sun! (I like the clueless crossword and like to see how Hagar is getting on with Eddie)
Weekends Sunday Telegraph and Sunday Express plus some local papers as well.

Roy.

 

[BradNaylor]

Sorry Roger,

The article was titled 'Time to put some bankers in the dock'

So I think my interpretation is just as accurate as yours.

I think you've missed the point entirely. Of course we need a banking system that allows credit to oil the wheels of commerce and for people to make major purchases such as houses and cars. No-one to my knowledge is seriously suggesting that the banking system should either be scrapped or nationalised.

What many of us are suggesting however, is that the banks have been behaving in an irresponsible, greedy, and fraudulent manner.

If some of the directors of banks who have brought the world to the brink of financial collapse were hauled before the courts and held to account then there would be less chance of it happening again.

Dan

 

[BradNaylor]

As a matter of interest, what papers do the forum members read?

It depends what is in the rack at the coffee shop when I pop in for my morning Americana and pain-au-chocolat.


Dan

 

[ByronBlack]

I'm making that judgement based on the massive screw-up that over-borrowing has lead us to, and it's a greed society that feeds that borrowing/lending

I have borrowed, and I say that in my post, but by the end of the year I would have got rid of any outstanding debt, barr the mortgage, but then I was sensible when I got my mortgage and saved for the best part of 5 years to afford a decent enough deposit so that I wouldn't be in the poop if rates went up.

The problem we have with unnessacary borrowing is the 'want it now' attitude, if we all just had a little patience, or some enterprise we could afford the things we wanted without having to laden ourselves with unnecessary debt.

A frugal/sensible lifestyle that isn't driven by status or greed, in my humble opinion is the way to avoid massive financial melt-downs like we are seeing.

Roy - really no need for that comment just because you don't agree.

So what is the difference between borrowing the money to buy a house and borrowing the money to buy a car? There isn't any.

There isn't any difference in itself, but where it goes wrong is when people start to borrow for the sake of it and run up massive debts which they are unable to payback due to negligence on the lenders part, or through ill-fortune by losing a job, going bankrupt etc.. if we as a society can reduce our reliance on running up massive debts for consumer items (and a house doesn't come under this category) the better we'll all be.

I can understand where you are coming from, and I'm not preaching a backwards cave-like existence, but there has to be some restraint when it comes to borrowing and lending consumer debt for the lastest gadget/car/lifestyle accessory.

Also, the less borrowing for said items will result in people have more money coming in which can be used to afford a bigger deposit on a mortgage (if they wish to buy a house) and be more secure against interest rates.

 

[Digit]

Roy - really no need for that comment just because you don't agree.

What am I supposed to have done this time?

Roy.

 

[ByronBlack]

Roy - really no need for that comment just because you don't agree.

What am I supposed to have done this time?

Roy.

The little snipe at me using your 'common sense' comment, but hey, lets stick to the subject at hand?

 

[Digit]

Wrong end of stick I'm afraid BB, I was saying that common sense should have been applied by those who seemed to think that they could borrow, borrow, borrow and keep on borrowing.
No offence was intended against anyone!

Roy.

 

[Grinding One]

Thought i would just pop back and would especially like our American cousins to respond to this:-

Dick FULD the ex CEO of Lehman Brothers has been hauled up before a finance committee to explain how he allowed his firm to go bust. The chairman of the committee put up a slide which showed that since the year 2000 he has pocketed .......................wait for it....................................


almost half a billion dollars the American billion of course :!:


yes, that's no typo, not million but billion :shock:

I believe the exact figure was 480 million but whose worried about the odd 120 million :lol:

That is more than some very small third world countries and certainly more than anyone on here would likely earn in a lifetime

No it wasn't that much. Not even close. A lot of money..yes...was it excessive...most likely but suggest maybe a lot of us could stop reading the Daily Mail?

This poor guy says he got no pension from his bussiness or parashute...but he does have a few houses in Florida and New York worth millions...Poor Guy.I got a cell he can live in...Oh Poop I`d have to feed him and house him :roll: lets just sell his houses an pay some of the debt back.

 

[RogerS]

Thought i would just pop back and would especially like our American cousins to respond to this:-

Dick FULD the ex CEO of Lehman Brothers has been hauled up before a finance committee to explain how he allowed his firm to go bust. The chairman of the committee put up a slide which showed that since the year 2000 he has pocketed .......................wait for it....................................


almost half a billion dollars the American billion of course :!:


yes, that's no typo, not million but billion :shock:

I believe the exact figure was 480 million but whose worried about the odd 120 million :lol:

That is more than some very small third world countries and certainly more than anyone on here would likely earn in a lifetime

No it wasn't that much. Not even close. A lot of money..yes...was it excessive...most likely but suggest maybe a lot of us could stop reading the Daily Mail?

This poor guy says he got no pension from his bussiness or parashute...but he does have a few houses in Florida and New York worth millions...Poor Guy.I got a cell he can live in...Oh Poop I`d have to feed him and house him :roll: lets just sell his houses an pay some of the debt back.

Right on, dude. He's been paid way too much money..just like movie stars, TV chat show hosts, UK footballers, US footballers, pop stars. Hell, that bloke across the road has got a better car than me. That's not fair.

Certainly one can argue that they get paid whether they make money or lose it but why single them out for opprobium? What about the regulators? How about the politicians and their inability to implement Basle 2, let alone Basle 1. And as I've said before, unless you've been a saint and not used a credit card, have a mortgage, no loans then take a look in the mirror as you (that's the generic You and not aimed at anyone specifically) didn't complain when you got that loan at 5% or whatever.

For a more reasoned and less emotive 'hang 'em high' argument then search google for "Basel II capital adequacy provisions". Here's a good one to start with

 

[RogerS]

I'm making that judgement based on the massive screw-up that over-borrowing has lead us to, and it's a greed society that feeds that borrowing/lending

I have borrowed, and I say that in my post, but by the end of the year I would have got rid of any outstanding debt, barr the mortgage, but then I was sensible when I got my mortgage and saved for the best part of 5 years to afford a decent enough deposit so that I wouldn't be in the poop if rates went up.

The problem we have with unnessacary borrowing is the 'want it now' attitude, if we all just had a little patience, or some enterprise we could afford the things we wanted without having to laden ourselves with unnecessary debt.

A frugal/sensible lifestyle that isn't driven by status or greed, in my humble opinion is the way to avoid massive financial melt-downs like we are seeing.

Roy - really no need for that comment just because you don't agree.

So what is the difference between borrowing the money to buy a house and borrowing the money to buy a car? There isn't any.

There isn't any difference in itself, but where it goes wrong is when people start to borrow for the sake of it and run up massive debts which they are unable to payback due to negligence on the lenders part, or through ill-fortune by losing a job, going bankrupt etc.. if we as a society can reduce our reliance on running up massive debts for consumer items (and a house doesn't come under this category) the better we'll all be.

I can understand where you are coming from, and I'm not preaching a backwards cave-like existence, but there has to be some restraint when it comes to borrowing and lending consumer debt for the lastest gadget/car/lifestyle accessory.

Also, the less borrowing for said items will result in people have more money coming in which can be used to afford a bigger deposit on a mortgage (if they wish to buy a house) and be more secure against interest rates.

I don't have any disagreement with the basic tenet of what you are saying but I don't agree with your statement

So what if you can't buy a BMW, you'll have to settle for a Fiesta instead, and so it goes for all the rubbish that people waste their money/credit on (big screen TV's, Sofa's, biggers houses, flash cars etc..)

That implies a value judgement which is not on. One mans' sofa is another mans' Lie-Nielsen plane.

 

[ByronBlack]

Wrong end of stick I'm afraid BB, I was saying that common sense should have been applied by those who seemed to think that they could borrow, borrow, borrow and keep on borrowing.
No offence was intended against anyone!

Roy.

I do apologise Roy, the way I read it, with you quoting Rogers reply to me, it looked like it was aimed in my direction, I suppose this is a problem with forums, it's sometimes difficult to read correctly the intentions of the poster. Sorry!