A newbie plunge jumper

[greybeard]

My first leap into the world of scrolling - some very very limited experience from schooldays (junior schooldays, so was not allowed to get too intimate with machinery!).

So, here I am - just a bit puzzled - advice/guidance/commiserations all very welcome. I have searched here, but couldn't find anything that seemed to be the answer to my prayers/questions - apologies if I missed it.

I've just acquired an early, or rather, a not-to-recent Hegner - a Multi-cut 2 to be more precise (I think it's called the 14" one?)

It came with a clamp key and just 1 blade (the usual 'selling for someone else problem!), so I'm waiting - patiently! - for some blades to be delivered, and a couple of spare clamps, and the dust extraction doohickey looks handy........this could be the start of another very slippery!

But of course I couldn't resist just a quck burst so to speak. And I have to say that I'm somewhat surprised by the amount of vibration that there appears to be.
I do have what I think is probably the 'supplied from new' manual, but that's rather basic, and offers very little in the form of troubleshooting guidance/advice.
It does have a very detailed exploded drawing, with all parts numbered, but no legend!
In fact it doesn't actually say very much about how it all works and which bits can/cannot be adjusted....which leads me to think that there is probably not too much scope for such 'tuning'?

It's not clamped/bolted/nailed down at present, but it is nestling on a fairly thick 'sticky' mat (the kind you hold your awkward shaped workpiece with when freehand routing etc.) - just held down by it's own weight.
But a judicious laying on of hands makes me think that there probably is rather to much a-hopping and a-jumping going on.

My particular questions at the minute (I'm sure there'll be more!) are as follows ;-
1 - so how much vibration is to be expected?
2 - will incorrect blade tension dramatically affect the vibration? (can't see how it can, especially if it's a bit slack!)
3 - will/should serious clamping/bolting fix some/any/most vibration?
4 - is there a P Spielman book covering this kind of detail? (he seems to get some good press here and elsewhere)

Any help/advice etc v v welcome

 

[Gill]

Owning a Hegner that vibrates is like having a chicken that quacks. Disturbing.

A good way to check how much vibration is natural to a saw is to put the machine on a concrete base such as a concrete driveway and then switch it on. Get down on your hands and knees, and touch the saw's table; if there's still lots of vibration then the chances are that the saw needs to be returned to the UK agent in Hailsham for a service.

Assuming the saw passes the concrete floor vibration test, the next point to consider is the rigidity of the position where you operate the Hegner normally. I used to operate mine on top of an old computer desk which was on a wooden floor. As a result, the vibration was noticeable. There's no point having the smoothest saw in the world if it's mounted on something which isn't solid.

The big factor here is mass. The more mass you can add to a saw, the less it will vibrate. Some people do this by building a sandbox as a plinth for their saw with bolts passing through the bottom of the box to the top lid. The idea is that the box lid is able to press down on the loose sand when the saw is operated. The vibration from the saw tamps down the sand and the bolts which pass through the box can be gradually tightened. It's a much better system than 'anti-vibration' matting which actually reduces the mass of the saw by separating it from the mass of of its resting place, thus exacerbating the problem!

I didn't build a sandbox for my machine. A friend kindly let me have a slab of marble which I put on top of my computer desk and found that operating the saw on top of the marble eliminated all vibration. The principle was the same, though - I'd added mass to my saw. In fact, the effect was so dramatic that I didn't even bolt my saw down.

You don't tend to find slabs of marble hanging around freely available but I've heard that paving stones make good alternatives.

So I think I've addressed two of your questions . You also asked about blade tension. Incorrect blade tension will increase vibration marginally but the tension would have to be so loose as to be tantamount to not having a blade fitted at all for it to be noticeable.

Pat Spielman has written some very good scroll saw books but his real strength was as a pattern designer. My preferred manual for scroll saw operation is Zach Taylor's Scroll Saw Bench Guide. This isn't a book with lots of patterns but it does explain how scroll saws work and is well worth acquiring.

Gill

 

[scroller frank]

Morning Greybeard,
welcome to the wonderful world of scrolling ccasion5:
I think Gill has covered most if not all vibration problems.
i don't have a Hegner , but my Delta sits on a concrete paving slab and has very little vibration, and is not fixt down.
Tip:--- buy good quality blades, and make shure they are not fitted upside down !! yes it is easy to get them in the wrong way, the more teeth they have the easier it is to get them upside down.
i hope you get it sorted ,and are able to "get scrolling soon"
but be careful it gets addictive

 

[greybeard]

Thanks Gill, four out of four of my questions answered!

And my mind put at rest - much appreciated.

You probably heard the huge sigh of relief as I tried out the concrete base test? Suffice it to say that it is obviously switched on, but that the amount of vibration is in fact minimal.

So I tried it again on the bench top, just to confirm, and sure enough it was leaping about again. Maybe I have a previously unknown talent for constructing bouncy benches! I learn something new every day!

Levity aside it was quite a relief to hear it almost purring. I've just added "buy a large paving slab" to my Monday list.

Ta too for the book info - that sounds like exactly what I'm after.

And thanks Frank too - the blade upside down early warning will I'm sure be recalled in the not too distant future! I've done it with a bandsaw, and that's a huge blade by comparison, so I'm quite sure I'll achieve it for a scrollsaw with no effort!

I'll keep you posted on progress!