Versachuck ? a good choice ?

[Rhossydd]

I'm looking at buying a 4 jaw chuck for my Tyme Avon lathe. The headstock has a very unusual thread, so I'm limited to only two choices the Versachuck or Axminster Evolution sk114. (I really don't want to try using thread adaptors in other chucks and both chucks can be refitted with new backplates should I change lathe in the future).

The Versachuck is cheaper, both for the chuck and all it's accessories, so might be first choice at the moment. However if the Axi is significantly better I might be able to find extra investment and/or wait for a deal to bring the price down.

The problem is without having used both it's a difficult decision to make. Anyone been fortunate enough to have used both and have any insight they'd like to share ?

 

[Spindle]

Hi

No direct experience of either chuck but the Axi does not utilise a backplate, I'm not sure how they cater for the differing threads advertised, I guess it's via directly threading the body or via inserts. Any owners care to advise?

Regards Mick

 

[Rhossydd]

I'm not sure how they cater for the differing threads advertised, I guess it's via directly threading the body or via inserts.

From the photographs on the web site; It looks like they use a threaded insert that has two fixing points. In theory it should be possible to buy a new insert for a different lathe.
Not really very different to using a backplate assembly, but keeps the overall length shorter which seems a good feature.

EDIT:
That's wrong, given the following information from Chas.

 

[CHJ]

As far as I'm aware the new Axi Evolution Chucks are direct threaded, no changeable inserts.
One of the most annoying aspects of the new design, the two threaded holes you can see are the grub screw locations for the weird locking system first designed into the chucks that locks the chuck to your lathe spindle.
Later superseded by the introduction of versions with rear extension collars to mimic an ISO back plate to allow adequate lathe spindle nose clearance on some lathes and an alternate locking system that allowed locking of chuck and removal with piece still mounted.

The Versa chuck is a sound chuck, not quite up to the old Axi precision chuck build standard but runs it a close second, it has the advantage of taking standard ISO backplates and is easily adapted to changing lathe spindle standards.

I use one in the mix with a couple of the old Axi precision versions and in use there is little difference other than chuck key size when it comes to selecting one or the other for a particular task or jaw set.

Just as a personal opinion if you go for the Versa Chuck I would recommend that you have the Axi compatible jaw carriers version, this then gives you a wide choice of accessory jaws with a long standing pedigree that are readily available and unlikely to change standards.

 

[Rhossydd]

Thanks for that Chas, some interesting and useful points there.

the two threaded holes you can see are the grub screw locations for the weird locking system first designed into the chucks that locks the chuck to your lathe spindle

Not sure that sounds very desirable, given I'm taking my present chuck off and on a lot.
If the chuck has a fixed thread that makes it a LOT less appealing anyway. A shame I liked the idea of stainless steel in my less than perfectly dry workshop.

in use there is little difference

I think that's the key factor. If they both work the same, save the money and buy more accessories/wood/wine.

I would recommend that you have the Axi compatible jaw carriers version, this then gives you a wide choice of accessory jaws with a long standing pedigree that are readily available and unlikely to change standards.

That was the plan I was working to. I like the look of the Versachuck's own jaws that are Axi compatible anyway.

Looks like a trip to Didcot will be on the cards soon

 

[Spindle]

Not really very different to using a backplate assembly, but keeps the overall length shorter which seems a good feature.

Hi

Using a backplate will add approximately the same extension to the chuck as would an insert thread adaptor - the only way to reduce the total length is to use direct threaded chucks. Personally I wouldn't restrict my choice of chucks based on their total length unless my lathe bed dictated it, an additional 10mm introduced by either a backplate or insert adaptor is not going to make any appreciable difference to wear or operational characteristics.

If the intent is to purchase only one chuck then the capability of the Versachuck to accept all other manufacturers jaws would swing the decision for me.

Regards Mick

 

[CHJ]

The versa chuck has different carriers available to suit other makes of accessory jaws, if you are visiting in person make sure you pick the chuck set off the shelf that has the Axi compatible carriers and also make sure you get the correct back plate to suit your lathe. (you may have to ask for the set to be made up for you anyway as your thread version may not already be boxed up)

This is the construction of the Evolution, as you can see there is not sufficient material in the central core diameter to accommodate thread adaptors.

 

[Spindle]

Hi Chas

Not sure I understand your point there - why could you not buy the M33 x 3.5mm chuck and fit industry standard thread adaptors to it?

Regards Mick

 

[CHJ]

Hi Chas

Not sure I understand your point there - why could you not buy the M33 x 3.5mm chuck and fit industry standard thread adaptors to it?

Regards Mick

No reason at all if currently readily available adaptors come with a 33 X 3.5mm male thread, my only experience of using chucks with changeable inserts some years ago was that they were not 33 X 3.5 internals.

 

[Rhossydd]

Using a backplate will add approximately the same extension to the chuck as would an insert thread adaptor - the only way to reduce the total length is to use direct threaded chucks.

Mick, I think you've missed my error in assessing the photo on the APT site. I'd wrongly assumed that the centre part was a threaded insert held in my the two threads on the side on the insert. If that had been correct the chuck would have been thinner and I considered that to be a good feature.
Chas has pointed out my assumptions were wrong and that the stainless thread centre isn't removable, but part of the main part of the chuck. As shown in the previous exploded diagram.
As my OP stated, I really don't want to go down the route of threaded inserts. So that rules out the sk114 for me.

 

[Spindle]

As my OP stated, I really don't want to go down the route of threaded inserts. So that rules out the sk114 for me.

Hi

I think we're both confused now

The SK 114 comes in M25 x 2 option, (which I believe is the spindle thread on a Tyme Avon), and therefore will not require an insert.

If you consider a thinner chuck to be advantageous why add 10mm by using a chuck fitted with a backplate and how is that any different to adding 10mm by fitting an insert?

Regards Mick

 

[dickm]

Not sure why you are so set against threaded adaptors, although there may not be any available off the shelf for the Avon - certainly not now that it's been discontinued for so long. Less overhang than with a backplate and no reason to be less precise for a given quality of engineering. One of the chucks on my Mystro, which is another odd thread, actually has a home made adaptor and works fine. Its Avon predecessor relied on re-threaded Craft supplies chuck bodies, though it's not a course to be recommended.
If the OP has a friendly model engineer, they would probably be able to produce an adaptor and since several of the chucks use the same female thread for adaptors, this could offer more choice and versatility.

 

[petercharlesfagg]

For what it;s worth!

I have been using a Versachuck for the last 4 years on my ancient Record lathe and I can recommend for its versatility! (Strange that!)

It may not be the most up to date or refined chuck but it does what is intended to do.

As for utilising all the jaw sets, I do feel that all the rivalry and competition amongst makers of others chucks makes the individual chuck rather an expensive item whereas the Versachuck is so much easier in using others jaws to achieve exactly the same results as other makes.

I used to have (4) chucks but now I need only (2).

Please try and see one in use it makes any choices that much easier.

Regards, Peter.

 

[Rhossydd]

I think we're both confused now
....
The SK 114 comes in M25 x 2 option, (which I believe is the spindle thread on a Tyme Avon), and therefore will not require an insert.

I'm not confused at all. If you read the OP, I originally thought, wrongly I now know, that the sk114 could have the thread inserts changed, so would be easily adaptable if I change lathe at some future time.
I was wrong.

I don't want to buy a chuck with a 25mm x2mm fixed thread as it would be unable to be upgraded and the resale value would be pretty poor given how few Avons are still in use.

 

[Rhossydd]

Not sure why you are so set against threaded adaptors,

I've had too much experience of trying to deal with thread adaptors (in different industries) that are stuck. If I don't have to use that system I won't.

It looks like the Versachuck won't be any worse than the alternatives in real use, it's upgradable, it's cheaper and I can get a backplate to fit. What's not to like ? choice made.

 

[Dalboy]

I have the patriot chuck with two inserts one for a 3/4" x 16 and the other for 1" x 8 I have owned it since I began some 5 or more years ago and have never had a problem in changing them. Like any chuck with regular cleaning and removing the insert at regular intervals then whichever chuck you go for you should not have any problems.

 

[finneyb]

Do you need or want indexing? Evolution has it, I don't know about the VersaChuck.

Brian

 

[CHJ]

Do you need or want indexing? Evolution has it, I don't know about the VersaChuck.

Brian

VersaChuck:-

 

[Rhossydd]

Do you need or want indexing?

No

 

[gregmcateer]

Versa definitely has indexing - I've got two. One new, one secondhand. Both in great condition. I'm no pro turner, but am very happy with them.
Greg