Face frame units

[chippy1970]

I am about to build some framed vanity units for a client with shaker style doors and corner bead detail around the frames.

I have the doors off to a tee as I have made loads but I would appreciate any advice or links to websites about making framed kitchen units.

I have a corner bead router cutter for the frames and was thinking of fixing the face frames with a Kreg jig maybe the standard £50 one, anyone know much about the Kreg ones ?

 

[neilc]

Hi Chipp,
I recently completed my own face frame kitchen for our new house. This is the link to the orignal thread. Unfortunately as we're fairly rural now, at the moment I can't get broadband to post the completed pictures. Anyway I started off trying to use a beading bit too but I found the level of accuracy required on every single piece of face frame just too time consuming. In the end I machined the beading and attached it after. It worked out great.
I presume you mean the Kreg pocket hole system. I used this and found it to be great. Not one joint opened up. One tip on any pocket hole system though is when screwing the face frame together clamp the joint because when it pulls together it will tighten too much and create a slight step. I use one of these. Hope I explained that right.
Best of luck with it.
Neil

 

[tsb]

Hi Neilc, Just seen pictures of your kitchen and intending on making something simular, using pocket screw system to connect faceframe as well. How have you hidden the holes which are on the inside of the cabinets

 

[Chris Knight]

tsb,
Pocket holes will normally be placed on the outside of the cabinets so they won't be seen when cabinets are placed next to one another, except possibly at the ends but a separate cosmetic panel or other arrangement will normally be used there.

 

[RogerS]

One question that intrigues me about face-frames is this.

Isn't it inevitable that the bottom of the face-frame forms a lip and so the floor of the cabinet isn't flush with the 'hole' (if you see what I mean?). Which makes dragging stuff out awkward as you have to lift it over the lip?

or maybe I've misunderstood face-frames.

 

[George_N]

One question that intrigues me about face-frames is this.

Isn't it inevitable that the bottom of the face-frame forms a lip and so the floor of the cabinet isn't flush with the 'hole' (if you see what I mean?). Which makes dragging stuff out awkward as you have to lift it over the lip?

or maybe I've misunderstood face-frames.

Roger, why not just make the bottom rail of the face frame flush with the floor of the cabinet?

 

[chippy1970]

Neil c,

You have done a great job there the face frames are exactly what I want to do and as the units I have to build are only small (3 doors wide) I think I will make one long frame with 3 openings.

The ones I am doing will be painted also so screw holes can be filled the Kreg jig I looked at is http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp? ... e=1&jump=4 or http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.asp? ... e=1&jump=0 what one did you have ?

 

[jasonB]

Although not beaded I made this small vanity as one unit, faceframe is fixed with kregs (2000) through the base and top rail with glued biscuits in the verticals. The joints in the frame are also held with pocket screws in the back of the frame.

I prefer to make the face frame to cover a full run of units rather than separate frames for each carcase as the joints in the middle look wrong.

Jason

 

[neilc]

Thanks Chipp,
I have the one in your first link and highly recommend it. As Jason says and which I think you intend to do, it looks much better to make the frame to cover a full run of units.
As to fixing the frame to the units, as Waterhead points out, I too placed the pockets where they wouldn't be seen. Top and bottom fixings completely hidden on the outside of the unit. Side fixings as much as possible the same way. I think just once I had to fix on the inside and as it was on a hinged side I didn't bother filling them.
Neil

 

[chippy1970]

I bought the standard Kreg kit £49.95 from D&M tools only down the road from me. Anyone else shop there ?. Great shop but the staff are so un-helpful ask a question and you get a couldn't careless answer.

Really annoys me because I have spent thousands in there over the years. :x

 

[Nigel]

I have found the same attitude Chipp and it gets even worse if you wish to exchange something,

Now I only go to their shows and don't bother with the shop,

Cheers Nigel

 

[chippy1970]

I bought a Trend T5 router there a few years ago took it back because it was rubbish they said they had sent it away and gave it back to me it was still rubbish so took it back again but they just didn't care. I rang trend direct arranged a collection they then sent me a new one which is still rubbish but I just don't bother using it anymore waste of money.

I bought an Elektra Bekum TS in there £500 but wasn't allowed to see it running same with the record extractor couldn't plug it in and hear how noisy it was. I was told it was against health and safety yeah like an extractors gonna kill ya. :lol:

Its probably the second best tool shop for looking around that i have ever been in but the service is diabolical

 

[chippy1970]

UPDATE

Just a few pics of the units, made the face frame and doors out of Mahogany as its being painted anyway. Units are 18mm MR MDF.

I didn't need to bead mould the inside of the face frames after all as when I went back to fully measure up I realized the kitchen units that I am copying didn't have the bead mould anyway, they are just plane frames.

Saved me a bit of work

First time I have used the KREG jig and they are great so easy to use. Only one problem D & M Tools strike again :x . I bought the jig from them but they don't stock many screws only coarse thread and I wanted fine thread as thats whats recommended for hardwood.

Why is it shops will sell the jig but not sell a complete range of accessories ? :x

Anyway I bought the coarse ones and they seem to have worked ok.

I will post some more pics when doors trimmed and fitted.

 

[tim]

Brimarc are the best source i've found for kreg screws. I don't use coarse at all - I use fine or HiLo thread ones.

Thats going to be a heavy box to move!!

Cheers

Tim

 

[Bodrighy]

Could someone point an ignoramus towards a site explaining how these pocket screws work? Looked at the jigs on Axminster and think I know but any explanation would be useful.

Pete

 

[Smudger]

Does this help?

http://www.rd.com/content/openContent.d ... ntId=17686

I've got the Trend jig and it works fine, but I haven't used it much.

 

[Bodrighy]

Thanks, all is now clear. I have a load of shelves that I need to create quickly & simply and this looks like a good strong way to do it.

Pete

 

[chippy1970]

Not too heavy theres less than a sheet of 18mm there its 1500 wide by 720 high and only 480 deep.

Having fun this morning trying to get some 65mm zinc coated butts cant find them anywhere. I might just use flush hinges instead.

The kitchen people had used 65mm butts but I noticed a lot of play in the hinge so might use something better.

 

[Shultzy]

Chipp, what's the size of the frame members. Is it usual to have the middle members to run from top to bottom instead of the inside, or is it just personal preference?

 

[chippy1970]

I dont quiet get what you mean shultzy.