Vintage British planes worth buying [metal]

[ED65]

I'd like to acquire a few older British-made planes to flesh out my collection and was hoping to get some help on what brands to look for, and I suppose just as importantly which are best avoided.

I knew about Record, Stanley, Woden and Marples but I'd read that back in the day there were actually quite a large number of clones knocking about. Had the devil's own time trying to find a more comprehensive list of names until I stumbled across one by accident just now in a thread here from early last year posted by member Job and Knock (thank you sir if you're still around).

So my list of possibles is looking a little healthier:

• Chapman (Acorn)
• Footprint
• Marples
• Mathieson
• Preston
• Record
• Salmen
• Sedgley
• I. Sorby
• Spear & Jackson
• Spiers
• Stanley
• WS
• Woden
• Whitmore

Any others I should have in the back of my mind on the off chance I spot one? Please note I am primarily interested in sizes 5 and above if that makes a difference.

Are there any vintage British brands I should Avoid At All Costs?

TIA!

 

[Mr_P]

I wouldn't touch I.Sorby if I was you they are total crud. I will revise my opinion when I have the full set and don't mind prices rising any more.

Loads more could be added to the list, not sure if any are worth searching out though.

I bought my Span no.4 purely for comedy value. Plastic handled Rapier get a bad press but just as good as plenty of the above and a darn site better than the Acorns I've seen and usually bin.

 

[AndyT]

You could add the Anglo Scottish Tool Company of Gateshead who made planes under the Rapier trademark in the 50s. Their copy of the little Record 043 plough is quite common, but apparently they made bench planes too.

I see Mr P beat me to it on that one.

I'll add one to the list of brands to avoid - GTL - Guaranteed tools Ltd - used to sell sets of tools on hire purchase and their range included a bronze/brass bodied no 4 with what looks like a Norris adjuster. It's widely said to be unusable as a plane, but it does look a bit attractive to some collectors!

 

[MIGNAL]

I have an Acorn, probably one of the better ones. Good blade but nothing else grabs me about it. Whitmore I had in the late 70's. Less said about it the better. In fact personally I'd aim for a Stanley and Record from the blades with the square cut corners - 40's/50's. The rest wouldn't interest me.

 

[yetloh]

If you want use them, I would avoid anything made from the 1960s on when Record and Stanley joined the race to the bottom that was the cheap diy market and none of the others saw any reason to make anything better.

Jim

 

[G S Haydon]

I wouldn't touch I.Sorby if I was you they are total crud. I will revise my opinion when I have the full set and don't mind prices rising any more.

Loads more could be added to the list, not sure if any are worth searching out though.

I bought my Span no.4 purely for comedy value. Plastic handled Rapier get a bad press but just as good as plenty of the above and a darn site better than the Acorns I've seen and usually bin.

What was up with the Sorby Mr P?

 

[Harbo]

He collects them!

Rod

 

[ED65]

I wouldn't touch I.Sorby if I was you they are total crud. I will revise my opinion when I have the full set and don't mind prices rising any more.

Not to worry, I was asking in relation to what I might see out in the wild so we won't ever be bidding against each other for one.

What do you consider good prices for an S4 or S5 in fixer-upper condition?

 

[ED65]

Thanks for the input gents, will revise the list accordingly.

 

[Jelly]

I have a footprint 4 and 5, they're pretty well made and work well.

A lot of footprint tools were made for the MOD and GPO on contracts going into the 70's as a result the quality decline doesn't seem to have happened in quite the same way as the Stanley/Record one mentioned above, (indeed from what I can tell, lots of the stuff like planes appears to have just stopped as a product line when the contracts to supply them ended, rather than trying to compete on ever lowering prices and standards).

 

[AndyT]

If you want use them, I would avoid anything made from the 1960s on when Record and Stanley joined the race to the bottom that was the cheap diy market and none of the others saw any reason to make anything better.

Jim

Just to pick up and echo Jim's point - as far as I can see, the real race to the bottom came about by developing 'value engineered' variant designs, aimed squarely at the diy user who wanted a tool that was cheaper to buy, even if it was inferior to the established pattern. So Stanley came out with endless versions of the 'Handyman' plane, some with replaceable blades; some with a tiny iron like that found in a spokeshave, with two thumbscrews for adjustment. All these are easily spotted and can be left in the car boot, rickety trestle table or banana box.

But the standard cast iron bench planes continued to be made with the same bodies and frog castings until well into the 70s and although those planes had hard brown plastic handles rather than stained beech, they can still perform as well as their older cousins.

Of course, one possible direction for a truly dedicated collector would be to seek out all those downmarket variants - limiting yourself to those that were still made in Britain would excuse you from gathering everything by Silverline, Anant etc - and it would let you add F Parramore and Sons to your list.

 

[lurker]

What amuses and annoys me in equal measure is folks coming here and saying I've got this really old plane (or other tool) and when you look at it, I can see it was manufactured after I was born.

 

[lurker]

If you want use them, I would avoid anything made from the 1960s on when Record and Stanley joined the race to the bottom that was the cheap diy market and none of the others saw any reason to make anything better.

Jim

Spot on!

 

[Mr_P]

I wouldn't touch I.Sorby if I was you they are total crud. I will revise my opinion when I have the full set and don't mind prices rising any more.

Not to worry, I was asking in relation to what I might see out in the wild so we won't ever be bidding against each other for one.

What do you consider good prices for an S4 or S5 in fixer-upper condition?

Well I've got two 4's both purchased on ebay for about £30 only bought the second as it had the original iron, sticker on the rear handle and the price was right. I've seen them fetch as much as £90 for no better than mine, probably just after Paul Sellars mentioned them.

My 5 was £40 from a stall at David Stanley tool auctions.

My 6 was the best bargain in a £40 job lot that also included the Record 05 1/2 which I also use.

So thats my collection 4,5 and 6. I have an unwritten rule about spending no more than £50 on a bailey type, think £40 is the most I've ever paid for a bailey, I was going to break it before Xmas as a treat for myself.

D.Barrons Mathieson 4 1/2
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MATHIESON-4-1 ... SwcOFWbZt-

Guess everyone else had the same idea so not this time.

 

[G S Haydon]

Heavens I'm thick! Carry on.....

 

[heimlaga]

I have a number 7 sized Rapier jointer plane in the attic and have seen a lot of smaller bench planes from that maker. Apparently they sold well in Finland.
The main fault on all of them is that neither the underside of the frog nor it's mating surfaces on the body are machined. This makes the whole frog rather wobbly. I would't recommend Rapier planer to anyone who hasn't got access to a milling machine and an operator who can mill those surfaces and make the plane ready for use. The castings are a bit rough but otherwise well made and there are allowances for machining.
A plane in kit form for the handy machinist;-)

 

[Vann]

I would't recommend Rapier planer to anyone...

I agree. They seem to be similar in quality to a Stanley era Acorn, or Stanley Handiman. They should be in a list of "Vintage British planes NOT worth buying (unless really really cheap)"

Cheers, Vann.

 

[Benchwayze]

What amuses and annoys me in equal measure is folks coming here and saying I've got this really old plane (or other tool) and when you look at it, I can see it was manufactured after I was born.

You and me too Lurker!


:lol:

 

[swb58]

Here's another not-vote for the Rapier, well not the model that I've got anyway. It's a No 4 size, wood handles, it looked OK until I realised it doesn't have a screw for moving the frog. Slacken the mounting screws and the frog instantly slops about in every direction.

 

[Peter Capon]

I have a Woden no6 which is a great plane and some later made in England Stanley and Record planes that are all very good. They are not the very latest as, all have the traditional frog adjuster at the rear of the frog. I do have a Stanley with plastic handles and no adjuster screw which does work surprisingly well. I use this a a semi scrub with slight camber on the blade.