thick plate, high tpi gents saw

[marcros]

Does anybody know of a gents type saw with as thick a plate/kerf as possible? The race seems to be for thinner and thinner plates.

I am looking for something to cut splines into mitred joints on a box (1/2"-5/8" sides). I was planning on using a piece of either veneer, constructional veneer or shop cut bandsaw veneer. Is there anything else that would do the job by hand?

 

[woodiedonald]

My saw, https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/cockerill-gents-saw-t71675.html only 12 quid!

 

[marcros]

Could you make a cut ans measure the kerf for me?

 

[Jacob]

Hack saw blades? Or a bit of bandsaw blade in a frame?

 

[devonwoody]

I use Japanese saws these days, they do one very similar to a gents saw appearance, and mine have now being going for years.

 

[MIGNAL]

You won't get much of a kerf from a high TPI gents saw. If you are looking for a wide Kerf there are a few options. Put more set on the saw. That's probably fine for up to 0.9 mm's. After that the saw becomes increasingly difficult to control, you usually end up with a slightly wavy cut. You could make your initial cut with a gents saw and then place a veneer into that cut. Make another cut right at the side of the veneer. The saw will tend to follow the veneer. Width of the kerf will depend on the particular saw and it's set. 1 mm + . The veneer has to be a snug fit into the first cut.
The other alternative is to laminate two saw plates together using epoxy. Open up the Brass back so that it can be used to hold the laminated blades. I've done this on cheap back saws and pretty much any Kerf above 1 mm is possible if you use veneers between the plates.

 

[nanscombe]

Hack saw blades? Or a bit of bandsaw blade in a frame?

For something wider could you mount two hacksaw blades together?

ETA:
Just tried mounting two hacksaw blades side-by-side.

Different blade manufacturers so the blade depth, hence the slot depth, was slightly different.

Worked Ok and got a kerf of about 2mm (measured by eye with a metal rule).


Mind you, Norm Abram would probably use a radial arm saw with a dado stack. :lol:

 

[bugbear]

Does anybody know of a gents type saw with as thick a plate/kerf as possible? The race seems to be for thinner and thinner plates.

I am looking for something to cut splines into mitred joints on a box (1/2"-5/8" sides). I was planning on using a piece of either veneer, constructional veneer or shop cut bandsaw veneer. Is there anything else that would do the job by hand?

You might consider (if the idea appeals) making such a saw. Just find an old, knackered handsaw, with a thick plate, cut out a plate, and recut small teeth on it.

BugBear

 

[marcros]

I will try some of those suggestions out. The other one I wondered about was an edge float, which i think may work, and i could make to the width I desire.

A table saw and jig would do the job by machine, but I dont have one at the moment.

 

[mickthetree]

made the mistake of using some burr veneer myself. All I had (and I had a lot of it!). This doesn't give much strength as I discovered when I dropped the box and it broke apart at the joints.

Probably obvious, but hadn't considered it myself.

I used my gents saw and the veneer fitted perfectly.

If they are just a hair too thick you can bash em a bit with a metal hammer and they will swell back up when glued into the joint.

You could use a fine router bit and sled? Might be a bit of a faff making small height increments so you don't break the cutter though.

HTH

 

[marcros]

I might resort to a jig on the router table. If I was to do that I would be less concerned about veneer thickness splines, so could use a slightly larger cutter, albeit still pretty small. I could even use a dovetail cutter, which I believe somebody did in the recent competition. There is always the biscuit jointer too I guess. Personally I am not that keen on splines (asthetically)- each to their own- but it is a reasonably easy way of reinforcing the joint.

 

[AndyT]

I guess you want a fine saw to get a smooth cut. You can't have a lot of set on a fine saw; the teeth are too small.
You could use a bigger, coarser saw - but then the cut would be a bit rougher.

So how about this?

Make your first cut with a very fine saw. Then put a guide block in the cut to exactly position the saw for the second, parallel cut. This guide block would be a scrap of wood with a rebate to sit over the corner of the box. Very near one end you have sawn a kerf and inserted something - a sliver of veneer, card, plastic or metal - which is a snug fit in your saw kerf. This locates in your first cut on the box. The end of the wood acts as a guide and should be the exact right distance from the first one, so you can rest the saw against it for the second cut.
Get the spacing right by sanding down the spare end.

You will need to have a suitable very fine chisel to clean up the sliver of wood left between your two fine cuts.

 

[baldpate]

Hi marcros,

I've just experimented on the long-grain corner of a scrap of (softish) hardwood and managed to cut a decent slot about 1.6mm wide using a Eclipse HSS power hacksaw blade (10tpi). I first cut the slot with an ordinary backsaw, then widened it by going down the pre-cut slot with the hacksaw blade. I just held the hacksaw blade in my gloved hand for this experiment. You can see from the pic that the bottom of the slot is rather rough from the coarse teeth of the hacksaw, but I imagine a thin file would soon sort that out. The wood was some sort of mahogany - not desperately hard, but not a softwood.

The blade is 3/4" deep &12" long, and the label claims it is made of 18 gauge plate (i measure is to be about 1.3mm), so it is quite stiff enough to use unframed for this purpose.

Blades like this are available in various sizes & thicknesses (have a look at ebay). Not dirt cheap though. I was lucky and got the remains of a pack of old-stock fairly cheap a while ago in an auction listing : I'm slowly using them up for scratch stock.

Still got a few left - if you think it might work for you, I could pop one in the post for you. Send me a PM if you're interested.

PS: I use a home-made powered device for the purpose (based on my old black & decker kit see pic below) but I'm limited to a 2.4mm slot. I think I may try the hacksaw method myself for the next box which calls for a narrower spline.

 

[MIGNAL]

This has all been done before. My earlier advise comes from practical experience and of course centuries of experience of others. Widening a saw cut is a technique that has been used for at least a hundred years in Guitar Neck joints. You just need to insert a Veneer of the correct thickness in the first cut. Saw immediately to the side of that Veneer and you will be left with a wider kerf.

 

[marcros]

thanks all. I will try the method above first and take it from there.

 

[woodbrains]

Hello,

As mentioned by Jacob and some others, hacksaws work very well and can be grouped together on the frame. I once cut 12 feet or so of dentil mould with 3 hacksaw blades on the frame, and this worked great, the bottoms of the grooves were smooth and flat and they were consistent thickness.

Mike.