Strictly for the birds

[RogerS]

This video of an Su-30 almost defies belief. The pilot almost seems to be flying backwards at one point. http://www.crazyaviation.com/movies/CA_SU-30.wmv

 

[Steve Maskery]

Yes Roger, very realistic. SU has really come on since Google took over. Mind you, I'm still on level 6, I must upgrade more often.

Cheers
Steve

 

[mel]

some good handbrake turns and demos of airbrakes :lol: :lol:

just wondering how much of the tax payers money went into that :shock:

 

[StevieB]

If you mean British tax payers, then not alot, its not a British plane. Its a modification of a Russian SU-27UB and currently used by the Russian, Indian and Malasian Air Forces among others. Certainly look manouverable, but ask yourself in this day and age of missiles rather than dogfights, would you rather be in something that can dance like a butterfly or something that can be undetectable by radar? :lol:

Steve.

 

[woodbloke]

Steve - you mean an aeroplane or aircraft, I think :wink: ...'planes' are what we use in the 'shop - Rob

 

[RogerS]

If you mean British tax payers, then not alot, its not a British plane. Its a modification of a Russian SU-27UB and currently used by the Russian, Indian and Malasian Air Forces among others. Certainly look manouverable, but ask yourself in this day and age of missiles rather than dogfights, would you rather be in something that can dance like a butterfly or something that can be undetectable by radar? :lol:

Steve.

Spot on there, Steve. I was at Farnborough one year when this plane was being out through its' paces and I was standing behind an energised Rapier system ....that kept its' lock on the plane throughout.

But...still is some seriously good flying

 

[RogerM]

But...still is some seriously good flying

Yep. I used to drive Hawker Hunters around for a living (seriously good fun!), and it would be a mistake to underestimate that guy's skill. However, whilst the low speed maneuverability is impressive from a technical perspective, it has little practical use in high speed combat. When the American F15 Eagle first came out, an independent test pilot criticised how the huge airbrake that came out of the fuselage behind the cockpit obscured the view to the rear. The designers response was that any pilot who deployed the airbrake when an enemy was on his tail deserved to be blown out of the sky. They had a point!

 

[RogerS]

But...still is some seriously good flying

The designers response was that any pilot who deployed the airbrake when an enemy was on his tail deserved to be blown out of the sky. They had a point!

But wasn't that how the Harriers managed to winout in some dogfights? By effectively reversing thrust so that they came to a sudden halt as there opponent shot past them and into the firing line?

 

[RogerM]

But wasn't that how the Harriers managed to winout in some dogfights? By effectively reversing thrust so that they came to a sudden halt as there opponent shot past them and into the firing line?

The technique used by Harriers was "VIFF"ing (Vectoring In Forward Flight). Essentially, the engine nozzles would be rotated downwards so that the aircrafts turn would suddenly tighten without the apparant attitude of the aircraft changing. Very off-putting for a pursuing foe, but I believe they would still be on full power - which was generally the normal position for the throttles of an aircraft maneuvering in combat. But remember this was 25 years ago and with "fire and forget" missiles techniques may have changed.

 

[MrJay]

But wasn't that how the Harriers managed to winout in some dogfights?

Too right. You can only shoot stuff if it's in front of you. Going really fast isn't a big advantage if you want to be behind someone. Neither is not being able to see.

I do find the differences in understanding what can be done with aerodynamics between Russia and US/Europe kind of interesting in a nerdy sort of way; we don't make planes that can do that. The practical advantage in a dogfight is that those things don't stall and drop out the sky if you turn too quick. They are the aeronautic equivalent of a weeble.

 

[newt]

All dog fighting involves energy management, therefore if you are slow and low you do not have very much, but a lot when you are high and fast.

 

[RogerM]

All dog fighting involves energy management, therefore if you are slow and low you do not have very much, but a lot when you are high and fast.

Absolutely! Just as you will never hear a woodworker say he owns too many clamps, you'll never hear a fighter pilot say that he has too much power at his disposal!

 

[newt]

All dog fighting involves energy management, therefore if you are slow and low you do not have very much, but a lot when you are high and fast.

Absolutely! Just as you will never hear a woodworker say he owns too many clamps, you'll never hear a fighter pilot say that he has too much power at his disposal!

We had a Hunter at Boscombe Down until recently, it was used by ETPS to teach students inverted spining, sadly none of the aircraft in the current fleet can spin inverted. A great aircraft.

 

[CHJ]

Well if you want a flight in an SU 30then it can be aranged for 13500 USD.