micro bevel on plane backs

[chippymart]

Hi all,
Just brought a Veritas honing guide and in the instructions it talks about putting a micro bevel on the back of a plane iron. Notice on Lie Nielson sharpening guide that they also put a bevel on the back using a rule placed on the stone to create a small angle.
Is this something that only the north americans do as I was always taught that it should be kept flat.
Is there any benefits from doing it this way? Be good to hear people's thoughts on this.
Cheers

 

[Harbo]

Over here it is commonly known as the David Charlesworth ruler "trick"?
Though he always says he never really invented it?

Rod

 

[woodbloke]

Over here it is commonly known as the David Charlesworth ruler "trick"?
Though he always says he never really invented it?

Rod

If you can find the very thinnest steel rule that you can...something less than a mm (mine is an old R&C one) and have the plane edge about 50mm away and parallel to it, the angle on the back, if you care to work out the trig, is about 0.3deg or thereabouts. This makes no effective difference to the honed angle on the bevel but it means that you don't have to flatten the entire back, merely a strip which is around 2mm wide on the back of the blade - Rob

 

[David C]

Rod,

I do say I invented it, as a regular method of sharpening plane and other blades, on Japanese waterstones. (NEVER FOR CHISELS !!).

There are a few old timers who say it was a method used for rescuing badly pitted blades, and I don't doubt they are correct, though it was not a technique which I knew about.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth

 

[Jacob]

.....
There are a few old timers who say it was a method used for rescuing badly pitted blades, .....

Not just a "few" it's just one of those things that anybody would hit upon as the obvious way to deal with a pitted blade if they were desperate to get on with the job. I don't suppose many would use a ruler though, as it's easy enough freehand.
The most common face/flat bevel is of course the "nano" bevel achieved by flattening the face on a stone but maintaining more pressure towards the edge, even putting upwards pressure on the other end. I think almost everybody does this without thinking about it at all - to see the result you only have to look at the face of most old plane blades to see that they get shinier towards the edge. "Nano" bevel is also how chisels are always sharpened with the same result - shinier towards the edge (visible on old chisels, you might not see it on new ones.)

 

[Paul Chapman]

Just when you thought you'd heard of everything, along comes the "nano" bevel :lol:

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[bugbear]

Rod,

I do say I invented it, as a regular method of sharpening plane and other blades, on Japanese waterstones. (NEVER FOR CHISELS !!).

There are a few old timers who say it was a method used for rescuing badly pitted blades, and I don't doubt they are correct, though it was not a technique which I knew about.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth

Speaking as someone who reads a LOT of older material, I've never seen this technique described prior to DC.

Of course, it's very difficult to prove a negative.

BugBear

 

[Paul Chapman]

Speaking as someone who reads a LOT of older material, I've never seen this technique described prior to DC.

You obviously didn't know about the "nano" bevel........ :lol:

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Jacob]

Just when you thought you'd heard of everything, along comes the "nano" bevel :lol:

Cheers :wink:

Paul

Femto bevel coming along shortly.

Can't have too many bevels!

 

[Harbo]

Nano - a very modern term?

Rod

 

[Jacob]

Rod,

I do say I invented it, as a regular method of sharpening plane and other blades, on Japanese waterstones. (NEVER FOR CHISELS !!).

There are a few old timers who say it was a method used for rescuing badly pitted blades, and I don't doubt they are correct, though it was not a technique which I knew about.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth

Speaking as someone who reads a LOT of older material, I've never seen this technique described prior to DC.

Of course, it's very difficult to prove a negative.

BugBear

I've never seen a description of nose-blowing techniques. Doesn't stop a lot of people doing it.

 

[Paul Chapman]

I've never seen a description of nose-blowing techniques. Doesn't stop a lot of people doing it.

http://indianapublicmedia.org/amomentof ... your-nose/

 

[dunbarhamlin]

Where's the fun in that, Paul? Far rather trumpet like one of Hanibal's pets.

 

[woodbloke]

I've never seen a description of nose-blowing techniques. Doesn't stop a lot of people doing it.

http://indianapublicmedia.org/amomentof ... your-nose/

That's just blown me away! :lol: - Rob

 

[Eric The Viking]

It's all that wood dust.

 

[Jacob]

I've never seen a description of nose-blowing techniques. Doesn't stop a lot of people doing it.

http://indianapublicmedia.org/amomentof ... your-nose/

Well blow me down!

This could be useful for anybody struggling. Instruction books can be surprisingly ancient.

 

[RogerBoyle]

Rod,

I do say I invented it, as a regular method of sharpening plane and other blades, on Japanese waterstones. (NEVER FOR CHISELS !!).

There are a few old timers who say it was a method used for rescuing badly pitted blades, and I don't doubt they are correct, though it was not a technique which I knew about.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth

Speaking as someone who reads a LOT of older material, I've never seen this technique described prior to DC.

Of course, it's very difficult to prove a negative.

BugBear

Back in 1975 i was instructed by my grandfather in this method. the reason he gave was it simply came down to speed when he was on site and its something i have always done.But I have always just done it free hand with a few passes on an oil stone

 

[bugbear]

Rod,

I do say I invented it, as a regular method of sharpening plane and other blades, on Japanese waterstones. (NEVER FOR CHISELS !!).

There are a few old timers who say it was a method used for rescuing badly pitted blades, and I don't doubt they are correct, though it was not a technique which I knew about.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth

Speaking as someone who reads a LOT of older material, I've never seen this technique described prior to DC.

Of course, it's very difficult to prove a negative.

BugBear

Back in 1975 i was instructed by my grandfather in this method. the reason he gave was it simply came down to speed when he was on site and its something i have always done.But I have always just done it free hand with a few passes on an oil stone

Are you talking about having a nano-back-bevel, or creating it in a controlled fashion via a metal ruler (or some mixture of the two) ?

I'm not quite clear on what you (and your grandfather) are/were doing.

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

I'm talking about controlled fashion but without the ruler. I guess Roger is too. You just lift the blade a touch. It should be clear - it's bleedin obvious!

 

[RogerBoyle]

Are you talking about having a nano-back-bevel, or creating it in a controlled fashion via a metal ruler (or some mixture of the two) ?

I'm not quite clear on what you (and your grandfather) are/were doing.

BugBear

Lifting the blade up in a controlled fashion....Sorry but What is hard to understand about that ??
Prior to setting up my Kitchen business I used to make my living working mainly on sites however Unlike some I did take pride in my work, Even though virtually all my work was carried out on a price..
Things like Sharpining planes and chisels were done on a constant basis but they were done quickly and by hand on an oil stone
any tricks like putting a slight back/micro/nano and any other kind of bevel were employed to speed the process up


Roger