Buying sized timber - what to expect?

[Anonymous]

snip
If you take one board 10" wide and you want two 3" boards, youve lost nearly 30% already not taking into account saw cuts and machining.
snip

Right. Just a different view of waste. I'd see your example as giving two 3" boards for the job in hand, and one 4" board as stock. No waste at all so far!
For me it's only waste when it's un-useable, or unlikely ever to be used.
When I'm ordering for a job I also add usually about 10% but also tell the woodyard to round it up to the next length and not to cut anything. So a requirement for say 12M might arrive as 4no x 3.9M which gives me some extra stock. So I'm really ordering for stock, but with a view to how much I will need for the next job or jobs.

cheers
Jacob

 

[Noogoot]

Hi Everyone

Thanks for all the advice and the very kind offers of assistance. I will have a chat to the supplier and let you know how I get on.

Cheers

Rob

 

[Anonymous]

I must have missed this thread so sorry for being a little late!

The stock that is cupped was flat when it came off the machine - suggesting that the problem is in the selection of the boards before machining.

Unfortunately this will always be a problem when buying machined timber unseen. You are totally reliant on the operative who picks your boards. Normally he will simply use them as they come out of the pack without even looking at them. After all, your little job could be the twentieth he's done that day with another twenty to go!

This is just one of the many reasons why anyone even half serious about woodworking needs the basic equipment to machine rough sawn timber. An entry level planer thicknesser will pay for itself in no time and put you in control.

Your tulipwood was planed to 19mm. This suggests it was machined from 1" stock - probably in 15' lengths. Some 6mm has been lost in thickness in order to get a nice planed finish over the full length of each board.

You are using the timber for kitchen doors, however. You don't need long lengths - 750mm at the most. By buying sawn 1" timber and machining it yourself, cutting to length first, you would have been able to get 22 - 23mm of thickness - much nicer kitchen doors!

And by selecting the boards yourself at the timber yard you can go a long way towards eliminating problems such as the cupping you have experienced.

Rgds
Virgil

 

[Anonymous]

I must have missed this thread so sorry for being a little late!

The stock that is cupped was flat when it came off the machine - suggesting that the problem is in the selection of the boards before machining.

Unfortunately this will always be a problem when buying machined timber unseen. You are totally reliant on the operative who picks your boards. Normally he will simply use them as they come out of the pack without even looking at them. After all, your little job could be the twentieth he's done that day with another twenty to go!

This is just one of the many reasons why anyone even half serious about woodworking needs the basic equipment to machine rough sawn timber. An entry level planer thicknesser will pay for itself in no time and put you in control.

Your tulipwood was planed to 19mm. This suggests it was machined from 1" stock - probably in 15' lengths. Some 6mm has been lost in thickness in order to get a nice planed finish over the full length of each board.

You are using the timber for kitchen doors, however. You don't need long lengths - 750mm at the most. By buying sawn 1" timber and machining it yourself, cutting to length first, you would have been able to get 22 - 23mm of thickness - much nicer kitchen doors!

And by selecting the boards yourself at the timber yard you can go a long way towards eliminating problems such as the cupping you have experienced.

Rgds
Virgil

Agree with all that except about selecting the boards. The problem here is that you can't know how much sorting through the pile has already gone on - the best may have gone and you might be looking at everybody elses rejects.
My timber yard doesn't let you select - you have to take it as it comes which means that the quality should be average and representative of the grade you've ordered.

cheers
Jacob

 

[Anonymous]

My timber yard doesn't let you select - you have to take it as it comes which means that the quality should be average and representative of the grade you've ordered.

cheers
Jacob

Jacob,

I wouldn't use a supplier that didn't let me select my own boards. Of the 3 or 4 places I go to regularly they are all happy to leave me to it - so long as I leave everything tidy when I've finished sorting.

If I'm given a pack full of everyone else's rejects I just ask them to open a new one. And they do.

I can only assume you use Lavers in Chesterfield.

Cheers
Virgil

 

[engineer one]

not being a big buyer, nor a large user, i would have thought that before buying anything, you work out your requirements, then depending on the wood, over order by up to 50% depending on the lengths and widths you are buying, not least because if it is a wood with a decent grain you may not chose the same sections in each piece to match.

buying par is always going to cause problems, but raw wood has the same problem, and you then don't know what the grain is going to be. the advantage of p/t yourself is that you can as has been said end up with thicker wood because you can work on it in sections which are generally smaller than the woodyard would think of, unless you specify.

i guess you chose tulipwood because you wanted little or no discernable grain, or was there another reason? on a different wood, certainly grain would be important and lead you to be more careful in what you lose.

Paul :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

My timber yard doesn't let you select - you have to take it as it comes which means that the quality should be average and representative of the grade you've ordered.

cheers
Jacob

Jacob,

I wouldn't use a supplier that didn't let me select my own boards. Of the 3 or 4 places I go to regularly they are all happy to leave me to it - so long as I leave everything tidy when I've finished sorting.

If I'm given a pack full of everyone else's rejects I just ask them to open a new one. And they do.

I can only assume you use Lavers in Chesterfield.

Cheers
Virgil

No it was Lavers in Chesser or Gregories in Matlock where I wasted many hours sorting through piles when I started out. You'd see the same propellor shaped piece month after month until some desperate novice had bought it by mistake. I now use Handrahans in Huthwaite - order by phone, much better quality than I ever got by sorting, and no time wasted going to fetch it.
Where do you get your stuff? I must avoid it as you might have got there first and taken all the best bits :shock:

cheers
Jacob

 

[Benchwayze]

This is just one of the many reasons why anyone even half serious about woodworking needs the basic equipment to machine rough sawn timber. An entry level planer thicknesser will pay for itself in no time and put you in control. Rgds
Virgil

I am in full agreement with Virgil.

I accept these things cost money, when you are starting out. I empathise with you on your disappointment in the supplied timber.

I always order 15% more than I know I will need wherever I get my stuff from.

In the Midlands, I trust Sykes in Atherstone, Venebles at Stafford.
And for softwood (Which is mostly rubbish anyway) is less rubbish at Great Barr Sawmills and Birds at Rushall (West Mids).

Do your best to get an economy bandsaw or tablesaw and a P/T. (Even MachineMart will get you started.) Then buy waney edge timber. All you need then is a chalk line to mark the plank to BANDSAW to. Plane up that edge, and you have one straight edged plank to start from.

Maybe you can salvage some of your cupped timber by ripping it into smaller widths and edge jointing it after flipping alternate strips, to use for panels. Or you could use the outer edges for stiles and rails?
And find another supplier!
I've been there. Know how you feel.
HTH

John

 

[tnimble]

I've had problems with the delivered quality with the last batch of about 30m of maple. 1 piece had a wared end and about 10" of snipe on in. The rest of the wood had only a little snipe on only an inch or two. Some of the wood had a repetitive pattern of dark marks on it from the planer. After complaining I've accepted the wood because the warped end and snipe was well within the extra length I ordered and the dark marks should come out with a little sanding.

Well they where absolutely right about the marks despairing after a little sanding. However after making all the joinery and glue ups I started to seal the wood. All the dark marks reappeared! It took me very long to sand and scrape the wood thinner to have it not reappear. Thinning wood on a almost finished project with heavy decorated profiles is not an easy job.

The previous time I'd orded wood from them was about 50m of pine. There where no problem then.

 

[Noogoot]

Hi

Well, I am pleased to say that the supplier has offered to replace the wood or refund my money. I have opted for replacement in the first instance. They are sending a truck to pick up the offending timber so that they can check the moisture content etc. I have to say that they were actually very good about it - there was no argument at all - "If you're unhappy, sir, we'll sort it out for you." I'm not sure to what extent the fact that I mentioned that I'd sought advice from this forum helped :wink:. Thanks anyway guys (and girls, if some are hidden behind non-gender specific usernames!) for all the advice. I'll let you know how I get on with the next delivery.

Kind regards

Rob

PS Paul, I'll be in contact soon anyway!

 

[Mike.C]

Thats great Rob. Well done to the company too.

Cheers

Mike

 

[paulm]

No problem Rob, hope the next batch is better.

You're welcome anytime, just give me a call to check I'm in or drop me a mail.

Looking forwards to seeing some pics.......

Cheers, Paul.

 

[Noogoot]

Hi Everyone

As promised - an update. I received my replacement timber ten minutes ago and following a thorough check I can confirm that it is great - square and straight. I am pleased that I was able to resolve this issue with the supplier and given their level of customer service, I will use them again. For your information, the supplier was SL Hardwoods in South London.

Kind regards

Rob

 

[Mike.C]

Well done SL Hardwoods =D> =D>

Cheers

Mike