Common sense...

[Steve Maskery]

...has prevailed.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-43676359

It's not a terribly flattering photo of him, but he got up one morning ready to go about his business, found he was being burgled, and ended the day in a police jail cell on suspicion of murder.
No-one should have to go through that.
He is not a villain, he is a hero. One less bad man in the world.
I live in a high-burglary part of the world. I just wish it was the automatic end of every such misery-creating criminal.

 

[Distinterior]

Well said Steve..!

 

[Adam9453]

I’m so relieved to see he’s been released, must have been harrowing for him to think he might end up in prison for protecting himself and his wife

 

[Rorschach]

I agree but I am glad proper procedure was followed. Social media has been awash with idiocy. The police handled things properly (for a change).

 

[Steve Maskery]

I agree that proper procedure was followed, and promptly, too. Just as it should be.
I don't agree with the sentiment that it is a rare occurrence. I think that, by and large, the police do a fantastic job with far too little in the way of resources.
I've not had many dealings with the police over the years, but living here, they are more common than they used to be, unfortunately.
Whilst not universally so, my encounters with them have been overwhelmingly positive.

 

[Bm101]

Few months ago with scaffold up the Mrs woke me up. No mean feat. Turned out there was someone on the scaff trying to break in. I faced him out not knowing if he was tooled up and desperate. Half asleep and suddenly awoken with what I judged to be a threat to my kids I went a bit garrity. It was outside the house so I was lucky he got away from me tbh legally. If I'd have managed to get hold of him properly I wouldn't have stopped. I got a few proper digs in but not enough. It was a hurried affair. He ran for his life lets put it that way. My blood was up. Police stoppped my van as I was driving round looking for him and studiously ignored the canoe paddle (it was close to hand) and delicately advised me to go home. I have no issues with the police. Generally they do a fantastic job. Any wronguns you have to put down to statistics.
I have no regrets other than he got away and I knew my Mrs had called the police which ironically would have ruined my day in court in the manner of 15 years and missing my kids growing up.
In a moment I went from Happy Family man who bothers noone to someone who would have quite happily cable tied this fella and dropped him in the River Lea after stuffing a large sponge in his mouth.
I'm a good guy. I work, I look after my kids. I'm a considerate and polite member of society (mooooostly ). I'm a good neighbour although the fat lass at 42 is a bit of a pita. I do my bit. You get me.

30 seconds mad rolling round on the driveway at 1pm and a lost grip on the fellas throat and that all would have changed.
Great news the fella has been released.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

"The family of Vincent, who was on a police most wanted list when he died, have complained about the release. His cousin, who spoke anonymously, told the BBC she was angry that the pensioner had been bailed.

She said: “I don’t know what happened in that home. But all I do know is that my cousin is dead today. The Henry I know, he was such a loving person, and it’s probably something which just went wrong but he shouldn’t have died out of it.”"

Such a loving person ...

 

[Steve Maskery]

Well he obviously didn't love his neighbour, did he?
I just don't get some people's values.

 

[stuartpaul]

Such a loving person ...

Yeah, - he loved other peoples tellys, dvd players, jewellery, laptops ..............

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Just on the news - the police have said the pensioner will not be charged with anything.

 

[n0legs]

As my father would say "the law is the law".
He would go on to explain in the absence of some kind of all seeing eye, until the facts have been established some arrests, and with them the possibility of charges being brought, have to be made.
The police in this matter acted correctly and I'll be honest if I was in the old fellas shoes i would have been glad of it.
With the police being able to carry out a proper and correct investigation the result for the old guy is worth its weight in gold.
Let's hope he gets left alone to pick up the pieces and carry on with his life. I expect the opposite though. I can see reporters, newspapers , tv channels and most probably a few undesirables getting in his way for some time.
Poor beggar. There by the grace of God go I.

 

[Jonzjob]

And that is the best part of it!

He should get a medal!

I have a nice little spray in my bedside cabinet and if some thug broke in to our place I would not hesitate to use it.

I was once in a situation where I used to cross paths with a . with a nasty doberman dog. It came at me about 3 times when I was walking to work and stopped short barking and snarling. I shouted at the 'owner' that of he didn't control it I would be on to the cops. He was quite rude in the way he told me to go away, something off if I remember correctly? I phoned the cops and told them about it and got the reply of what did I expect them to do about it? The copper said that they didn't know where the dog lived. I gave them the address and was still told the same that they wouldn't do anything. I then told them that from then on I was going to carry a 10" carving knife and if it did attack it would get it. and I knew it was illegal but I would rather face a copper with it on me than that dog without it!

I didn't see the dog or the owner again. Not the same situation, but what do you do when you are faced with a very dangerous situation?

 

[Some bloak]

I used to work in a very rough part of North London and kept such a spray under my desk. We'd experienced several instances of desparate crackheads just pushing their way in to the building intent on grabbing anything they could.

However, a friendly family connected copper pointed out to me one day that a full on pepper spray comes under Section 5(1) (b) of the firearms act 1968, and could lead to me being in more trouble than the low life it was used on.

So be careful. There is actually an effective alternative spray that doesn't come under the act and is legit to be in possession of. A bit of net research finds it easily.

 

[Eric The Viking]

My sister and brother-in-law have both recently retired from a rural police force after decades.

I well remember her telling us about an occasion, some years ago, when she was still in uniform: she had to search an isolated farmhouse, on her own and without any protective gear, nor backup, knowing there was a man inside with a 12-bore. Civilian lives could have been at stake (it was a domestic disupte) and she was forced to act on their behalf. Fortunately the person concerned was not aggressive, she found him and disarmed him and she's still with us.

She describes it as the most frightening occasion of her life. After the chap was in custody, her inspector agreed with her decision, and that was where it was left - no commendation, nor bravery award. Her colleagues knew what she did, but for the official record it was just the 'normal service' of a committed police officer.

Rural firearms incidents are fairly common for two reasons: there are a lot of guns legitimately held by the farming community, but there are also a lot of wealthy villains who have 'escaped to the country', spending the proceeds of inner-city drug dealing, etc., on lives as rural 'gentry'.

I have nothing but respect for the vast majority of police officers, especially the older ones. It has to be said though that many forces seem to be run by silly person yes-men, who cow-tow to the politicians when they really shouldn't. And "Police and Crime Commissioners" don't help. The best policing seems to be when individual officers have considerable discretion and are backed by their management, as it used to be.

It always strikes me as wonderfully ironic that "crime commissioner" is synonymous with "criminal".

E.

 

[Rorschach]

As my father would say "the law is the law".
He would go on to explain in the absence of some kind of all seeing eye, until the facts have been established some arrests, and with them the possibility of charges being brought, have to be made.
The police in this matter acted correctly and I'll be honest if I was in the old fellas shoes i would have been glad of it.
With the police being able to carry out a proper and correct investigation the result for the old guy is worth its weight in gold.
Let's hope he gets left alone to pick up the pieces and carry on with his life. I expect the opposite though. I can see reporters, newspapers , tv channels and most probably a few undesirables getting in his way for some time.
Poor beggar. There by the grace of God go I.

My thoughts exactly!

 

[Jonzjob]

I was mistaken about the pepper spray. It is CS gas :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

And it was bought quite legally from a hunting shop when we lived in France! From what I have just read Cs Gas is against the Geneva convention. NATO has agreed that it's Inhumane. Don't you just love the French and their regard for the la of the land?

Errrrr, I do believe that I will get shot of both the one in the draw by my bed and the one in the car!!! :? :? :?

 

[rafezetter]

When I was a kid I read a Sci-fi book by Robert E Heinlein - part of the long story was about a guy whom had taken part in a diaspora of humanity to settle on a new world and how it was basically like the old wild west despite the technology required to get there - and there is one part that always struck a chord with me with me, and that was how they treated criminals - especially, robbers of properties.

Was it not only not punished for taking action, but it was written into the towns laws that it was their civic duty to A) make sure they kill the person by whatever means was to hand, and B) remove the head and put it on the pike that is outside every building as a warning.

Some might consider that a step too far, but it's clear that the "deterrant" for burglaries and associated crimes is in no way effective.

How the family and friends of the burglar has the front to post on facebook how displeased they are, and that comment by the cousin "he was such a loving guy - something must have gone wrong" just takes the cake - what was wrong was the pinapple was in someone elses house uninvited while already under suspicion of burglary. Anything you say after that about the robber as though he was a "victim" makes you look a total pinapple (with a w).

If I knew anyone of the family members who've been posting comments that are not condemning the burglar - I'd distance myself from them as fast as possible - as far as I'm concerned if you don't condemn burglary etc then you are part of the problem.

What no-ones mentioned yet is the old fella might yet get retribution from family and friends - which to my eyes should be treated by the police as no less than the crime of burglary in the first place - because someone got away, someone knows where the old man lives. The police should have made a statement that any retribution will be investigated and the penalties for any persons charged, will be harsh.

With all the stabbings and everything else going on in london with seemingly no results thus far - it's small wonder most criminals treat the police as little more than a minor nuisance.

I'm not saying it's the police's fault - far from it, but it's clear our current systems just don't work when you get family members of burglars baying for the blood of the homeowner doing what they would have done had the situation been reversed.

Edit - PS - I've been burgled twice - I'm certain one was an "inside job"; a mate of a mate of one of the other house residents where I was living - the other was a "honey trap".

 

[HappyHacker]

I disagree with the police charging him with murder while they establish the facts of the case. Murder is defined as 'the unlawful killing of a human being in the Queen's peace, with malice aforethought'. Meaning that he intended to kill the burglar.

In addition the law was changed to allow the use of disproportionate force to defend oneself against an intruder. The guidance says: “You are not expected to make fine judgments over the level of force you use in the heat of the moment. So long as you only do what you honestly and instinctively believe is necessary in the heat of the moment, that would be the strongest evidence of you acting lawfully and in self-defence. This is still the case if you use something to hand as a weapon.”
Grossly disproportionate force, such as a “calculated action of revenge” would not be covered, it says.

I think that while the police needed to investigate what happened, arresting him for murder was disproportionate. If I was arrested under similar circumstances all they would get from me would be "No comment"

 

[Rorschach]

The police didn't charge him with murder, they arrested him on suspicion of murder. Someone died, what else would they arrest him on?

They followed the exact procedure I would expect and want. Man is found dead, circumstances unknown (at the time). Arrest the suspect, question him, investigate. Investigation finds man died during attempted burglary, suspect defending himself, suspect released without charge.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Many moons ago my shop was burgled. At midnight on Monday evening, the police rung my mother and she picked me up from a birthday party as she knew I would have been drinking. I found out who did it courtesy of a lad with Downs whom all the local thugs thought was stupid so didn't button their lips in front of - for a few cigarettes and a Mars bar I could find out anything. The police weren't interested until I told them who it was and where to find the stuff, but he was taken to court for 43 offences. I asked if two of the charges were mine (he'd done my car as well) and was told no, he was up on another 44 the following week. He used to get gaoled for six months, his wife would go to social security (they had six kids) and get the house refurnished then when he came out after three he'd sell the contents of the house again and go burgling again, repeating the cycle. If I knew what (and the people) I know now I'd have had his legs broken.
The irony of this was that the "investigating" officer tried to do me for drinking and driving, despite having seen my mother drive up and park, then when he failed with that he tried to do me for parking on the pavement - despite it being on the forecourt of the shop (which was mine) and not on the pavement. :?