Worktop Woes

[Adrian80]

Hi all,
(newbie post)
I am a bit of a novice, but fitting my new kitchen.

My main issue is the worktop and the mitre.

I bought one of those mini trend jigs, and have cut both the male and female ends.

however when i push it together i have a 1mm gap in the long straight bit if i get the fronts to nicely join, or a 1mm gap at the very front edge if i align the straight bits.

Im not quite sure whats gone wrong?

I scribed the male joint from underneath, with the worktops lifted up on some off cuts.

I have measured my b&q worktop and i recon its more like 599mm than 600 it supposed to be, and therefore the stops are in the wrong place?

I left the male worktop a bit long so i can have another shot at it.

any advice greatly appreciated.

Adrian

 

[Rhossydd]

i have a 1mm gap in the long straight bit if i get the fronts to nicely join,

Is that actually going to be a problem once it's fitted ? I doubt your walls are going to accurately straight to 1mm over the length of a worktop and a small error will be masked by an upstand at the back of the worktop.

i recon its more like 599mm than 600 it supposed to be

I think you've answered your own question there ;-)
I suspect that Trend will build the jig for the 'perfect' 600mm and tiny errors in user's materials aren't that significant in the real world of installation against walls.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Surely the 1mm gap is in the mitre, not along the back? Incidentally, I notice one of the online suppliers of worktops recommends that mitres aren't used - they recommend butt joints (this for solid wood - I don't know that there's a difference).

 

[Adrian80]

Hi,

I am not sure if i have explained myself properly.

I have upstands on the back so am happy to have a gap here. However i cant adjust the worktop so the fronts align and there is no gap on the top bit of the work top.

If it is really 599mm should i get it all square using the lugs, mark the top up, take the lugs off, slip the jig back 1mm, clamp and recut.

All i can say is what a ball ache.

#-o

A

 

[Graham Orm]

Is it a butt and scribe or a mitre?

Sounds like the bush on the router may be the wrong one?

 

[Adrian80]

the 1mm gap, is in the mitre. The worktop is gold old nasty chipboard with formica top.

I will get some pics uploaded when i get home.

A

 

[Graham Orm]

Which is it??

(Random pics nicked from Google I should add)

Butt and scribe

Mitre

 

[Graham Orm]

Check the size of the bush on the router against the one required in the instructions with the jig. Usually 30mm.
Did you centre the bush properly?

 

[Adrian80]

Its a but and scribe joint.
and the one in the pic looks perfect.

When my internal edges meet perfectly, there is a 1mm gap, on the straight bit on the top of the worktop.

if it push the male piece back that gap disappears, but i then end up with a gap on the leading edge where i can see the chipboard.

However i am still not sure if i need to slide the jig forward or backward?

A

 

[dann]

Im my experience as long as the template guide is seated correct the only way of not getting the male and female masons mitre to fit is if you havent got the jug square to the top, make sure both the push through pegs are hard up to the edge of the worktop after you clamp the jig, you coudl even put a square on it to check, or 3/4/5 it to make sure the jig is at 90* to the front of the worktop.

 

[Adrian80]

The bush is a 30mm, at the flange, but there is a slight taper to 29.5 at the very front edge. i realise it will be 0.25mm error but i think i can live with that amount of misalignment.

Not sure how i would centre the bush, just screwed it in the holes.

Its a a cheapo mcalister router but it spins very smoothly and doesnt vibrate, so i think its running fairly centre.

A

 

[Rhossydd]

on the straight bit on the top of the worktop.

Just to clarify this; You do mean the back edge of the worktop, not the actual 'top' surface ?

 

[Adrian80]

No i mean the top surface. Sorry difficult to explain without photos.

 

[dann]

AHHHH i get you! the melamine surfaces dont line up?.... probably bowed tops, you need to biscuit joint it. If you dont have a jointer or cutter for your router you could smear both edges with silicone to seal them screw an off cut to the bottom at the front once its lined up so it doesnt move then line the back up, (block of wood on the surface and belt it with a hammer till it lines up then leave it all to set and it should stay where it is.

 

[Graham Orm]

The bush is a 30mm, at the flange, but there is a slight taper to 29.5 at the very front edge. i realise it will be 0.25mm error but i think i can live with that amount of misalignment.

Not sure how i would centre the bush, just screwed it in the holes.

Its a a cheapo mcalister router but it spins very smoothly and doesnt vibrate, so i think its running fairly centre.

A

Unplug first! Stand the router on it's head with the router bit projecting through the bush. Loosen the bush screws and measure from the cutting edge of the bit to the bush. Twist the bit by hand a couple of times and re-check, sliding the bush around on it's screws to get it spot on. When you are happy re-tighten the screws.

I can almost guarantee it's a bush or bit size problem. Have you checked the long cut's for square after cutting? This will tell you if the jig was out.

 

[Adrian80]

Nope,

Its like when the postformed edge is nicely together you can get a penny down the join on the top bit of the worktop.

So on the picture its the back section of the visible scribed line that has the gap.

A

 

[Adrian80]

Thanks for the tips on squaring the cutter and bush, will check that when i get home.
As for it being out of sqaure, the wall is everso slightly oblique, so am hoping the flat (straight ) bit of the cut is not 90 degrees.

Will take some pic and upload tonight.

 

[Rhossydd]

Sorry, but this really poorly explained.
Earlier you suggested that the surfaces don't align vertically, now you suggest there's a gap in the along the joint.

A photo would REALLY help here.

 

[Adrian80]

Okay, the red line is where my gap starts, and it runs all the way to the back of the worktop, and the gap is even all the way across the worktop.

except where it joins at the front which it fits nicely.

any clearer?
A

 

[Graham Orm]

Thanks for the tips on squaring the cutter and bush, will check that when i get home.
As for it being out of sqaure, the wall is everso slightly oblique, so am hoping the flat (straight ) bit of the cut is not 90 degrees.

Will take some pic and upload tonight.

If the straight bit of the cut is not dead on 90 the joint won't work. If the walls are out (edit) you will have to either chop into the plaster or scribe the back of the worktop to fit. The joint HAS to be exact.