Storage Bed Joints

[EatingSnakes]

Hey guys

I'm planning on making a storage bed out of 2x3 reclaimed timber as per the attached designs.
The platform and base will be joined by a hinge mechanism and gas strut.

Please can someone advise me on how to make the joints between each length of wood.
Will it suffice if I use wood glue braced with 100mm screws?
I dont have access to any sort of dowelling jig or kreg jig.

Cheers

ES

 

[Racers]

Beds need to fairly strongly constructed due to the forces involved in sleeping etc.
If the base is hinged with a strut the forces through the hinge and strut will be high so those areas need to be strong.
I would visit a few bed stores and have a look how it’s done then come up with a better design like a solid base.

Pete

 

[EatingSnakes]

Thanks for the reply buddy.

I've had a look at a couple of retail storage beds and all the hinges are screwed, I just need to know what type of screw. Hopefully the hinge mechanism comes with screws (eBay UK item number 282035085077)

I've had a look at a dozen or so DIY bed plans. They all have four legs and are made from 2x3, 2x4 or 4x4.
I've incorportated 9 legs in my design as it works out the same total surface area that the legs have in contact with the floor.

I just wasn't sure on how to join the wooden lengths. I've read a lot about dowel joints being strong, but I dont have any clamps to join them.
I was thinking of using Gorilla wood glue and bracing the joints with regular screws.

What do you think of this idea?

Thanks again

ES

 

[dzj]

What kind of tools do you have or are willing to purchase if necessary?

 

[morturn]

If I am understanding your question correctly, have you looked at using barrel bolts? They are used on a lot of commercially made beds. Easy to install, you just drill two holes.

You can use barrel bolts in conjunction with dowels

 

[MattRoberts]

I would avoid using regular screws in high use / high stress furniture. The threads will gradually loosen, causing the need to squeak and the joints loosen.

I'd either look into using bolts as suggested, or personally I'd use dowels. You don't need a jig, you simply use a drill bit the same diameter as the dowels, drill through and then hammer them home after applying glue.

 

[Racers]

I can't see the point of a storage bed with legs, I thought they had solid sides to stop the stuff spilling out, that's why I suggested a box.
If you make it with ply sides and battens at the top and bottom you could glue and screw it together.

Just because they are all made one way dosn't mean that's the best way of doing it, things are made to a price and only just strong enough.

Pete

 

[GeordieStew]

I don't think that the legs won't stand up well to lateral forces. Looks like it'll end up on the floor (to me).

Beds are usually fairly abused. Lots of body weight. Lots of movement (getting in and out of bed).

 

[OscarG]

Just to chip in, a word of warning about these gas struts. I remember my ex-gf had one of these storage beds, they were very clear that you shouldn't try to open it without the weight of a mattress on top.

I think the others are right, it would be better if the base of the bed was closed in. Keeps dust out and makes more sense as a storage element.

 

[EatingSnakes]

Thanks for the insightful comments guys.

Really appreciate it.

I was originally going to build a jig and use dowels and wood glue but then realised that I'd need some pretty beefy clamps which I dont have. Are you saying I can make it work without clamps?
Even if I had one, I'd need to clamp 27 joints. At 30 minutes per clamp, that becomes pretty burdensome to build.

I've been doing a lot of reading and learned that wood glue is actually stronger than the wood itself, the wood will probably splinter before the glue joint.
I understand that regular screws are pretty weak but I'm suggesting them as a kind of pseudo clamp to keep the joint braced long enough for the glue to take strength.
Besides I've seen plenty of DIY plans that use just screws. I'm trying to post links but I don't have rights.
What do you guys think?

As for the wall-less build. I'm planning on storing carboard boxes inside, so nothing will spill out. Furthermore, my wife wants to upholster it, so I'll just end up stapling some fabric onto the timber lengths to make it look pretty. The point of this project is to use up what I have. It'll put the truck load of 2x3 that I've got to use.

The legs may not stand the weight of us both, other DIY plans suggest that 6-8 legs should suffice (I have 9). I suppose I can always add more later if the legs are struggling.

Thanks again

ES

 

[GeordieStew]

Thanks for the insightful comments guys.

Really appreciate it.

I was originally going to build a jig and use dowels and wood glue but then realised that I'd need some pretty beefy clamps which I dont have. Are you saying I can make it work without clamps?
Even if I had one, I'd need to clamp 27 joints. At 30 minutes per clamp, that becomes pretty burdensome to build.

I've been doing a lot of reading and learned that wood glue is actually stronger than the wood itself, the wood will probably splinter before the glue joint.
I understand that regular screws are pretty weak but I'm suggesting them as a kind of pseudo clamp to keep the joint braced long enough for the glue to take strength.
Besides I've seen plenty of DIY plans that use just screws. I'm trying to post links but I don't have rights.
What do you guys think?

As for the wall-less build. I'm planning on storing carboard boxes inside, so nothing will spill out. Furthermore, my wife wants to upholster it, so I'll just end up stapling some fabric onto the timber lengths to make it look pretty. The point of this project is to use up what I have. It'll put the truck load of 2x3 that I've got to use.

The legs may not stand the weight of us both, other DIY plans suggest that 6-8 legs should suffice (I have 9). I suppose I can always add more later if the legs are struggling.

Thanks again

ES

It's not how many legs... Or even the thickness of the legs (although it actually does matter) but the joint between the leg and the frame. It's a butt joint by the looks of the drawing?

Give it a go. I reckon you'll end up on the floor though.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[novocaine]

at the very least I'd suggest a lap joint for joining the legs to the frame instead of a butt joint you appear to be using at the moment.
you'll also want to beef up the legs to provide stability, use 2 legs glued together for the middle legs to get you 4x3" foot print, full support beneath the frame and a half lap up the inside of the frame. use 3 legs glued together to give you 4x6" legs at the corners, same again to give you the stability your after. (you could most likely do this with just 2 legs to be fair)
keeps all your screws going cross grain and moves the stress from the screw to the wood.
end grain makes for a rubbish glue surface too, so whilst glue is stronger than wood on parallel joints it isn't as strong on end grain joints.
I'd then think about a pair of carriage bolts in each leg to really beef it all up instead of screws.
you can also use a better joint at the corners of the frame I don't know the real name for it but it's essentially a big box joint, I've seen it called a halve joint too.

this isn't fine wood working, but it's practical and doable if done right. what you have at the moment isn't right I'm afraid, as already said it will rack, snap and you'll end up on your back.

 

[EatingSnakes]

Thanks guys.
That makes perfect sense.
I now understand the inherent weakness in gluing onto the end grain.

What do you think will be the easiest way to assemble these joints?
Lap joints, cross dowels (barrel bolts), or wooden dowels?
I've only got a jigsaw, mitre saw, and drill in terms of tools.
I'm putting wooden dowels back on the list as I realise they are easier to fix than I originally thought, I didn't realise you could drill straight through and have visible through dowels.

Cheers again

ES