Chems
Established Member
They are priced the same, whats the difference?
European Ash vs American Ash
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rileytoolworks
Established Member
One's from America, one's from Europe.
Hat, coat, door.......
:wink:
Hat, coat, door.......
:wink:
ByronBlack
Established Member
From the pieces i've worked with, american ash seems to have straighter grain and is slightly whiter than european ash which was creamier. I paid less for american ash.
Chems
Established Member
Thanks Bryon, I'll have a good look on monday. Planning to finish with Hard Wax Oil, shouldn't yellow it should it?
ByronBlack
Established Member
I'm not au-fait with hard wax oil, so I can't be sure. I used danish oil and had some strong yellowing. My next project just used a beeswax finish and it came up a treat.
I have just finished a couple of projects on which I used hard wax oil. It looks the same as danish oil so I presume would have the same, or very similar, colouring effect, at least it seems to on oak. I have used danish oil on ash before and I do not have a problem with it, although there does seem to be a number of people on here who do not like it.
I used the new Chestnut hard wax. This was the first time I have used wax oil so I have no idea what other makes are like. I do like the finish though.
Bob
I used the new Chestnut hard wax. This was the first time I have used wax oil so I have no idea what other makes are like. I do like the finish though.
Bob
wizer
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I ave used Osmo on Both US an EU Ash and it very much did yellow it! I'd be very wary of using any oil on Ash. Make sure you do a test piece and leave it in the place the finished furniture will live, for at least a month. The baby walker I made for my daughter only went a lovely shade of urine about a month after I finished it. If you want to keep it light the it's got to be either Ultra Blonde Shellac or some sort of water based lacquer IMHO.
ByronBlack
Established Member
I'm with Tom on this one - if you don't want any colouration, a spray or brush on lacquer would be good. I used a spray can Behlens nitro product that was clear white and could give either a matt or glossy finish depending on how much sanding/polishing you want to do.
Something like this (aerosol can - but other types also available)
http://www.behlen.co.uk/Merchant2/m...Product_Code=B104-1406&Category_Code=MUSICFIN
Something like this (aerosol can - but other types also available)
http://www.behlen.co.uk/Merchant2/m...Product_Code=B104-1406&Category_Code=MUSICFIN
devonwoody
Established Member
The American ash I have used (kiln dried) is not as coarse a grain, so I prefer American.
woodbloke
Established Member
I agree with Tom here...don't on any account use oil on ash - Robwizer":1g3zvapi said:
BradNaylor
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Not log after I started out on my own, I got a big job supplying ash door casings, skirtings, and archs for a new build house. I bought in a pack of American ash.
It was all a uniform very pale, almost white colour. The customer was so delighted that he ordered some more.
I couldn't get any more American ash however, so not knowing any better, I ordered some European.
Big mistake! The colour raged from white to dark brown, encompassing green along the way. Half of it was almost indistinguishable from oak.
I've still got some of that batch of European ash - ten years later. Slowly it is disappearing into our wood-burner!
Cheers
Brad
It was all a uniform very pale, almost white colour. The customer was so delighted that he ordered some more.
I couldn't get any more American ash however, so not knowing any better, I ordered some European.
Big mistake! The colour raged from white to dark brown, encompassing green along the way. Half of it was almost indistinguishable from oak.
I've still got some of that batch of European ash - ten years later. Slowly it is disappearing into our wood-burner!
Cheers
Brad
OPJ
Established Member
I've found that European ash is a little easier to work than the American species, which tends to feel a bit tougher when you're planing it by hand.
About four-years ago, I put a couple of coats of Danish oil (it was either Rustins or Liberon) on some European ash and it didn't seem to darken it much at all! :roll:
In my experience, Osmo's hardwax oil doesn't darken (English) ash as much as Danish can but I would personally try it on a couple of offcuts, first of all. If you don't fancy a lacquer finish, you could always brush on a coat of sanding sealer, denib it and then coat it with wax. :wink: A water-based sealer (such as Chestnut's Acrylic) won't darken the ash as much as some others might... Though, I wouldn't expect any sealer (spirt, cellulose, shellac etc.) to have quite the effect that Danish oil can have.
About four-years ago, I put a couple of coats of Danish oil (it was either Rustins or Liberon) on some European ash and it didn't seem to darken it much at all! :roll:
In my experience, Osmo's hardwax oil doesn't darken (English) ash as much as Danish can but I would personally try it on a couple of offcuts, first of all. If you don't fancy a lacquer finish, you could always brush on a coat of sanding sealer, denib it and then coat it with wax. :wink: A water-based sealer (such as Chestnut's Acrylic) won't darken the ash as much as some others might... Though, I wouldn't expect any sealer (spirt, cellulose, shellac etc.) to have quite the effect that Danish oil can have.
Just to put my two cents in, even tho it may be repeating some thing that have already been said...
American ash is far superior to Euro, for all the reasons already stated. Also the straightness of the grain means it doesnt move much, making it ideal for drawer boxes.
In terms of finishing, hard wax or danish oil will defo yellow any ash. A lacquer (pre-cat in cans is always a handy thing to have in the home shop) will be much better, although remember you'll need to 'seal' first. White polish (sallac) would also work well.
One other thing to say about danish oil tho... Although it will yellow the ash, a well refined one will also darken the grain a fair bit compared to main body of the wood. Almost giving it the look of olive ash. I think it can look very good, so it could be worth doing a sample like this and seeing what you think.
Also the 'osmo' hard wax oil comes in a matt finish option. This one doesnt yellow anywhere near as much, and if you only put a couple of coats on it actually gives a virtually un-finished look to the wood, while still giving it some protection. Not my favorite, but some people like it.
Luke
American ash is far superior to Euro, for all the reasons already stated. Also the straightness of the grain means it doesnt move much, making it ideal for drawer boxes.
In terms of finishing, hard wax or danish oil will defo yellow any ash. A lacquer (pre-cat in cans is always a handy thing to have in the home shop) will be much better, although remember you'll need to 'seal' first. White polish (sallac) would also work well.
One other thing to say about danish oil tho... Although it will yellow the ash, a well refined one will also darken the grain a fair bit compared to main body of the wood. Almost giving it the look of olive ash. I think it can look very good, so it could be worth doing a sample like this and seeing what you think.
Also the 'osmo' hard wax oil comes in a matt finish option. This one doesnt yellow anywhere near as much, and if you only put a couple of coats on it actually gives a virtually un-finished look to the wood, while still giving it some protection. Not my favorite, but some people like it.
Luke
Chems
Established Member
Thanks guys, I'll defiantly get American ash as its the same price as European but sounds a lot better.
I only have melamine lacquer in stock, is the morells stuff water based?
I only have melamine lacquer in stock, is the morells stuff water based?
Mike H
Established Member
European has more character and variety.
It can be white, olive, etc... but also we can obtain in Europe some srtiking ripppled Ash which I have never seen in imported american.
American is kiln dried and we can obtain air dried european Ash which will make machining and hand working much more pleasant.
European ash is easier to find to match with, say Oak, for a project.
I tend to pay nearly the same price but there is much less waste in the bland straight grained Am. Ash.
If you want to see some splendid Euro ASh, I recommend Tyler's Harwoods near Hungerford, knowledgeable and helpful people.
I hope this helps, I have used Ash for about 50 years on many projects.
Mike
8)
It can be white, olive, etc... but also we can obtain in Europe some srtiking ripppled Ash which I have never seen in imported american.
American is kiln dried and we can obtain air dried european Ash which will make machining and hand working much more pleasant.
European ash is easier to find to match with, say Oak, for a project.
I tend to pay nearly the same price but there is much less waste in the bland straight grained Am. Ash.
If you want to see some splendid Euro ASh, I recommend Tyler's Harwoods near Hungerford, knowledgeable and helpful people.
I hope this helps, I have used Ash for about 50 years on many projects.
Mike
8)
Doctor
Established Member
BradNaylor":d8ngfeif said:
What was the bet here "how many toilet words can I accidentally post" :lol: :lol:
For all the reasons already described i much prefer European Ash, it has lovely varied colour and character, it has lots of defects which make it hard to work but give it much more life than the American version.
Horses for courses i suppose.
Horses for courses i suppose.
Chems
Established Member
Now you've confused me, I need to start a poll!
Chems":13fe71d4 said:
Sorry. My point was i really like some of the natural charecteristics/faults which are more predominant in native timber (probably because they wouldn't bother importing anything with common faults).
It all depends on the piece you are making, ie- if your making a slick cutting edge cabinet then you probably want pristine blemish free timber.
Chems
Established Member
tbh I want a slick looking piece which will be accented with some ABW of the style of the famous mattty's alter piece.
