Crazy grain. Scraper? Which scraper? Other options?

[HeathRobinson]

Hi all,

I'm trying to smooth over some reversing grain on reclaimed mahogany and a piece of walnut. The mahogany is particularly bad having long stripes of reversing grain running in parallel to one another. Is a scraper the answer here? The results of my forum searches seem to imply so.

If a scraper is required, I'm quite partial to the various Lee Valley offerings as they have quite a range and my bevel up bench planes are from there. Has anyone an opinion and/or experience of the following products:

- small scraper
- scraper plane
- cabinet scraper
- scraper holder
- scraping plane insert
- scraping set

Any other options? Perhaps putting a different angle blade in one of the bevel up bench planes would do the trick?

Thanks,
Simon

 

[MikeG.]

Scraping is your answer, but you don't have to use a scraper. You can perfectly well do it with a plane blade or a wide chisel.

It is much better if you can form a hook, but it works pretty well without. Just drag a sharp plane blade by hand at about 80 degrees or so (it isn't critical, and you'll soon get the feel).

Here's a heretical suggestion. I would use a belt sander first, and maybe a random orbital sander next........getting very close to your final finish. The scraper then finishes it off beautifully, incising the grains, pulling out the saw-dust forced in by the electric sanders, and leaving quite a polished surface.

I am now ducking for cover........

Mike

 

[Paul Chapman]

Hi Simon,

A scraper is usually the best option with troublesome grain, although you could try a back bevel on your bench plane to give a higher effective pitch. I have the Veritas #80-style scraper

and the scraper plane

both of which give excellent results. I wrote a piece about sharpening scraper blades which you might find helpful https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/view ... sc&start=0

There are also a couple of pieces about scraper planes by Deneb Puchalski on the Lie Nielsen channel which are good http://www.youtube.com/user/LieNielsen# ... WzPPGprW88

http://www.youtube.com/user/LieNielsen# ... eE-9pC5jyc

If you ever find yourself over this way, you are welcome to try out mine.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

PS Alf did a good review of scrapers here https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1976

 

[woodbloke]

Paul's right, a scraper is usually the way forward with rowed or interlocking grain. I've got the LV No80 as well... it's a very good piece of kit and probably ideal for the size of timber you're trying to surface. Mike G's idea has merit as well if it's a much wider piece of timber, but with narrow stuff there's not enough room to balance a bigger sander.
If you have LV BU planes, set the mouth very fine and try a higher honing angle on the blade (60deg or thereabouts) and you ought to be able to get pretty close to a finish with just a plane.

Off now to prepare the stake and kindling for the heretic :lol: :lol: - Rob

 

[Saint Simon]

As I have posted before, I bought the Veritas No.112 style scraping plane and have used it very successfully, initially for where I had foolishly jointed boards with the grain running in opposing directions. I have learnt not to do this but still find it very effective on the difficult knotty pine I often have to use.
I hope I am not going off thread but I also have question for Paul about the blades for this plane. So far I have only used the thinner blade that the plane came equipped with. However, because at the time I had more money than sense,I also bought the thicker A2 blade and would like advice on for what work it has advantages over the thinner and more flexible one?
thanks
Simon

 

[Paul Chapman]

I also have question for Paul about the blades for this plane. So far I have only used the thinner blade that the plane came equipped with. However, because at the time I had more money than sense,I also bought the thicker A2 blade and would like advice on for what work it has advantages over the thinner and more flexible one?
thanks

Hi Saint Simon,

I've only ever used a thin blade in mine so I can't answer your question from experience. I think you can use both blades for the same purposes, the main difference being how you use them. The thin blades can be bowed whereas the thick ones can't. Also, if you look at those links to Deneb's demonstrations, the thick blades seem to be useable with or without a hook. The Lie Nielsen scraper planes all come with thick blades and, unlike the Veritas scraper plane, have no provision for bowing the blade.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[HeathRobinson]

Thanks to all for the prompt responses and Paul for his very detailed response. It is an interesting little avenue we've found ourselves in discussing the thick vs. thin blades. If there is anything more to be wrung out of that discussion please keep it up as it is something I immediately wondered about myself when I saw that LV sell both thick and thin blades.

 

[Modernist]

As I have posted before, I bought the Veritas No.112 style scraping plane and have used it very successfully, initially for where I had foolishly jointed boards with the grain running in opposing directions. I have learnt not to do this but still find it very effective on the difficult knotty pine I often have to use.
I hope I am not going off thread but I also have question for Paul about the blades for this plane. So far I have only used the thinner blade that the plane came equipped with. However, because at the time I had more money than sense,I also bought the thicker A2 blade and would like advice on for what work it has advantages over the thinner and more flexible one?
thanks
Simon

I think scrapers come into their own on hard woods and I would be inclined to think you could overcome your difficulties on knotty pine better with a finely set smoother. With a slight curve on the cutting edge and used skewed you woul get a better finish than a scraper, more quickly and with less effort.

 

[martin99]

Hi all,

I'm trying to smooth over some reversing grain on reclaimed mahogany and a piece of walnut. The mahogany is particularly bad having long stripes of reversing grain running in parallel to one another. Is a scraper the answer here? The results of my forum searches seem to imply so.

If a scraper is required, I'm quite partial to the various Lee Valley offerings as they have quite a range and my bevel up bench planes are from there. Has anyone an opinion and/or experience of the following products:

- small scraper
- scraper plane
- cabinet scraper
- scraper holder
- scraping plane insert
- scraping set

Any other options? Perhaps putting a different angle blade in one of the bevel up bench planes would do the trick?

Thanks,
Simon

Mahogany and walnut are both easy to work so I suspect it is your technique which is at fault. Any plane - but sharp, fine set and with slight camber. Set it to zero cut and wind it up slowly as you go.

 

[Alf]

Um, I reckon higher angle with a BU first, assuming you've already covered sharp and fine cut. Cutting wood is generally preferable to scraping it. Sounds to me as though you have the same stuff I used in my review of the Veritas LA jack, (Sapele? I'm notoriously bad at wood identification) in which case a higher bevel angle will sort it out in short order.

 

[David C]

Then there are always back bevels for conventional planes :wink: but Alf's answer is probably better.

If the scraper plane insert is the same one I reviewed many years ago, it seemed very awkward to set up and has had zero use.

The cabinet scraper is good and the large scraper plane even better.

I have a marked prejudice for thicker scraper plane blades. Ron Hock does a 1/16" blade for the Stanley 80 and a 3/32" 2.4mm blade for the 112. Both are superb.

Ron has a new book on sharpening with lots about steel. I am looking forward to its arrival.
best wishes,
David Charlesworth