Console table
- Thread starter ScottGoddard
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Brentingby
Established Member
Not a bad start. I'd like to see more of a 3D view of it.
I think that, for a small piece like this, the thickness of the timber matters a lot. Although the legs look nice and slender, the drawer boxes look a bit thick. I'm guessing that they are about 19mm? Try redrawing it at 15mm or even less and see what you think. They'll be plenty strong enough.
I agree with Andy's comment about the proportions of the top structure. I believe that in the matter of proportion of sections there are two categories that can work well; refined and chunky. In between lies clunky which is so often seen in woodworking magazines aimed at the beginner. I think it often arises from a wish to use commonly available standard timber sizes. Judging by the underframe you are going for refined, and I think you may be surprised by the transformation smaller sections may bring about.
Purely personally, I'm not entirely convinced by the reduced depth of the centre section compared with the drawer cases. I think it would be worth redrawing it with equal depths to see if you prefer it. You may find it confers a sleeker less fussy look.
Jim
Purely personally, I'm not entirely convinced by the reduced depth of the centre section compared with the drawer cases. I think it would be worth redrawing it with equal depths to see if you prefer it. You may find it confers a sleeker less fussy look.
Jim
ScottGoddard
Established Member
AndyT":28lovou3 said:
thanks, any tips how I can edit the thickness without redrawing the draw boxes? (they are currently 22mm)
ScottGoddard
Established Member
Brentingby":1ckrsw0g said:
Not sure how to upload a 3d model as it wont allow the ext....
Brentingby
Established Member
ScottGoddard":wyojruyr said:
I was only thinking of a 3D view of it instead of straight on from the front but you could share the model in the 3d warehouse and provide a link to it.
custard
Established Member
You've got side stretchers running between tapered legs (so angled mortice and tenons with angled shoulders), and then a long stretcher running between them which also joins at an angle (so more of the same).
I guess it depends how experienced and how fussy you are, but if you're looking for professional gap free joinery, then you'll need to be a fairly experienced furniture maker to get this one right. You can't assemble "by the numbers" and expect it all to pull up tight, inevitably thin legs move slightly, so that long stretcher will definitely need individual fitting, and you'll probably have to scribe several of the other tenon shoulders as well. The other hurdle you'll have to overcome is cramping it all up. It's certainly do-able, but with angles it's never as simple as slapping on a couple of Besseys.
Here's an illustration of some of the practical problems you'll face. This is a stool that's a standard item for apprentices at the Barnsley Workshop (so these are guys who have already completed two or three years of City & Guilds training, plus most of them have also worked as cabinet makers). Okay, it's got the added complexity of wedged through tenons, but believe me, everyone struggles on this project. The stretcher at the bottom is similar to the stretcher you're planning, but fitting it with absolute precision is a technical process involving hand planing an MDF template to fix the dimensions and angles. You can't just lift the measurements straight from the rod or plan and expect a really good fit. Cabinet makers use a phrase, "going from the paper to the wood" to describe the moment where you have to progressively leave the plan dimensions behind and be guided instead by the item that's on the bench in front of you. To make your design really well will require going several steps beyond the paper!
And once you've completed all your joinery you then have to plan the glue-up. As soon as angled components enter the equation the cramping challenge gets a bit more complex,
By all means give it a go, but there's every chance the results will be disappointing and that you'll end up disheartened.
If you're fairly new to all this I'd suggest you design something where all the joinery is at 90 degrees. You can still have tapered legs, just commence the taper below the level of the lowest joinery. In fact even with slender legs you don't really need stretchers on a console table, they never have to support any real weight. If you're a bit more experienced and determined to push yourself, then you can even have straight through tapers plus angled legs, just restrict the joinery to the apron rails at the top and forget about stretchers.
One last point, don't drop below 32mm x 32mm for your legs, you can taper much smaller than this, but you'll need that meat at the top of the leg to joint the aprons rails in. Go smaller and you're looking at joinery solutions like interlaced stub tenons, which is no way to begin your furniture making career!
Have a read through this article, I don't agree with everything he says, but there's some good stuff in there and modifying the dimensions will take you to a relatively straightforward console table.
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/wp-co ... 4-Seg2.pdf
Good luck!
I guess it depends how experienced and how fussy you are, but if you're looking for professional gap free joinery, then you'll need to be a fairly experienced furniture maker to get this one right. You can't assemble "by the numbers" and expect it all to pull up tight, inevitably thin legs move slightly, so that long stretcher will definitely need individual fitting, and you'll probably have to scribe several of the other tenon shoulders as well. The other hurdle you'll have to overcome is cramping it all up. It's certainly do-able, but with angles it's never as simple as slapping on a couple of Besseys.
Here's an illustration of some of the practical problems you'll face. This is a stool that's a standard item for apprentices at the Barnsley Workshop (so these are guys who have already completed two or three years of City & Guilds training, plus most of them have also worked as cabinet makers). Okay, it's got the added complexity of wedged through tenons, but believe me, everyone struggles on this project. The stretcher at the bottom is similar to the stretcher you're planning, but fitting it with absolute precision is a technical process involving hand planing an MDF template to fix the dimensions and angles. You can't just lift the measurements straight from the rod or plan and expect a really good fit. Cabinet makers use a phrase, "going from the paper to the wood" to describe the moment where you have to progressively leave the plan dimensions behind and be guided instead by the item that's on the bench in front of you. To make your design really well will require going several steps beyond the paper!
And once you've completed all your joinery you then have to plan the glue-up. As soon as angled components enter the equation the cramping challenge gets a bit more complex,
By all means give it a go, but there's every chance the results will be disappointing and that you'll end up disheartened.
If you're fairly new to all this I'd suggest you design something where all the joinery is at 90 degrees. You can still have tapered legs, just commence the taper below the level of the lowest joinery. In fact even with slender legs you don't really need stretchers on a console table, they never have to support any real weight. If you're a bit more experienced and determined to push yourself, then you can even have straight through tapers plus angled legs, just restrict the joinery to the apron rails at the top and forget about stretchers.
One last point, don't drop below 32mm x 32mm for your legs, you can taper much smaller than this, but you'll need that meat at the top of the leg to joint the aprons rails in. Go smaller and you're looking at joinery solutions like interlaced stub tenons, which is no way to begin your furniture making career!
Have a read through this article, I don't agree with everything he says, but there's some good stuff in there and modifying the dimensions will take you to a relatively straightforward console table.
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/wp-co ... 4-Seg2.pdf
Good luck!
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ScottGoddard
Established Member
custard - thanks for the reply! all very helpful.
I have only really milled (down to 16 mm) the wood for the boxes and shelf....and this has taken me a while. I have been holding off because of the complexity you have raised and my lack of experience. I might look at re drawing the legs to be tapped but remove the angle and leave them square to reduce the possible issue. The challenge with this is probably going to be the overall look and would it de track from what i am trying to achieve.....not sure.
Other challenges I have are how to attached the legs to the boxes? do you have any suggests? I was thinking of some kind of (not sure what to call it) wooden bracket that i would screw into the box, i suppose i could have a sliding dove tail joint (similar to the pic below(. Or i would have the top of the leg through the bottom of the box and wedge it - as your stool.
I have only really milled (down to 16 mm) the wood for the boxes and shelf....and this has taken me a while. I have been holding off because of the complexity you have raised and my lack of experience. I might look at re drawing the legs to be tapped but remove the angle and leave them square to reduce the possible issue. The challenge with this is probably going to be the overall look and would it de track from what i am trying to achieve.....not sure.
Other challenges I have are how to attached the legs to the boxes? do you have any suggests? I was thinking of some kind of (not sure what to call it) wooden bracket that i would screw into the box, i suppose i could have a sliding dove tail joint (similar to the pic below(. Or i would have the top of the leg through the bottom of the box and wedge it - as your stool.
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custard
Established Member
15mm is a bit too thin for "staked" legs (i.e. legs that tenon directly into mortices cut in the carcass). As you correctly identify with your example, you need a beefier cross member to stake or joint into.
On the example you give, I'd bet a pound to a penny that the surface is veneered to ply or MDF. Therefore it's stable, therefore the two members can run across the grain without suffering timber movement problems. But if you're making from solid timber you'll have to cut the members cross grain, so the grain on the members and the grain on the carcass all align. That's okay, that's not technically demanding, and it will work. For a console table I'd aim for about 40-45mm of total thickness (member plus carcass), if you can make the mortice cylindrical, and put a corresponding section at the top of your legs, then you can just drill the joint which is of course much simpler.
Good luck!
On the example you give, I'd bet a pound to a penny that the surface is veneered to ply or MDF. Therefore it's stable, therefore the two members can run across the grain without suffering timber movement problems. But if you're making from solid timber you'll have to cut the members cross grain, so the grain on the members and the grain on the carcass all align. That's okay, that's not technically demanding, and it will work. For a console table I'd aim for about 40-45mm of total thickness (member plus carcass), if you can make the mortice cylindrical, and put a corresponding section at the top of your legs, then you can just drill the joint which is of course much simpler.
Good luck!
custard
Established Member
This table illustrates the process. The top is actually relatively thin, but it has apron pieces glued around all the edge. The apron pieces on the sides are long grain, but at the ends they're cross grain. Therefore the grain for the entire top section is all aligned throughout. The legs joint straight into these apron pieces with substantial M&T's.
I didn't make this table, but it was made by the craftsman on the next bench to mine, so I can vouch it's as solid as the rock of Gibraltar!
Good luck!
I didn't make this table, but it was made by the craftsman on the next bench to mine, so I can vouch it's as solid as the rock of Gibraltar!
Good luck!
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ScottGoddard
Established Member
Much appreciated custard. Will make me a couple of months to complete, but will update this forum with progress.
