Chicken Run

[tim]

Did anyone watch this last night. Prog about rearing Chickens in battery vs freerange conditions. Second part tonight.

Its filmed in Axminster (Hugh F-W's nearest town) and they showed the APTC canteen - seems customer service doesn't apply to staff: frozen omelette anyone?

Big shame that the supermarkets/ poultry industry aren't prepared to comment. Seems its because they are worried about being portrayed negatively. If it was my industry, I would want to make sure that at least part of my story was told by me.

For those that did watch it I would pass two comments:

1. I think the stockman is going to back down - I think he wants or will need a job inside the industry in the future.

2. The spokeswoman for the housing estate chicken experiment complained that they were struggling to get by on the amount of money they had for food each week. Really??

Cheers

Tim

Ch4 9pm.

 

[wizer]

I watched, being a HFW fan. I think this format has been done before a few times. Will it change the consumer's habits. I doubt it.

Was a bit disappointed that we didn't even see one tool at APTC! Oh well.

 

[Waka]

I watched bits of it, we have been buying free range chicken for years. It is stocked by most supermarkets but not in huge quantities.

 

[gidon]

Got it on my Sky box - will check it out later.
Cheers
Gidon

 

[mr]

My issue with his proposal that we should all buy free range chickens etc is based on cost and the average man on the estate's financial reality. Tescos are selling two birds for a fiver as opposed to one freerange bird for £7? It makes sense for the average mum in tescos with a couple of kids and not much cash to go for the cheaper option. Personally speaking I can't afford the freerange option and I don't think I'm an exceptional case. I find it bordering on the offensive that he should preach the virtues of the more expensive route when his own "situation" is far from the reality of majority of people in the country. Of course the target audience for his TV program will mostly agree with him, the rest who can't afford his virtues probably weren't watching in any case.

Cheers Mike

 

[tim]

My issue with his proposal that we should all buy free range chickens etc is based on cost and the average man on the estate's financial reality. Tescos are selling two birds for a fiver as opposed to one freerange bird for £7? It makes sense for the average mum in tescos with a couple of kids and not much cash to go for the cheaper option. Personally speaking I can't afford the freerange option and I don't think I'm an exceptional case. I find it bordering on the offensive that he should preach the virtues of the more expensive route when his own "situation" is far from the reality of majority of people in the country. Of course the target audience for his TV program will mostly agree with him, the rest who can't afford his virtues probably weren't watching in any case.

Cheers Mike

Not a lot to disagree with there. These ideas fall flat when they aren't able to provide a zero net cost alternative. I am of the opinion though that it isn't right to provide chickens at £2.50 each especially if those animals have lived a miserable life as a result. Do I blame the consumers for buying them - no, unless they have a choice. Do I blame the retailers - yes, absolutely.

Cheers

Tim

 

[Paul Chapman]

I haven't eaten chicken for years. I think it's quite revolting and disgraceful the way much food is produced today. That is compounded by selling it on the basis of value for money. A lot of it is diseased and full of chemicals and it's all done with Government approval. Edwina Currie spoke up about the state of eggs when she was a Minister so they threw her out - let's hope Hugh and Jamie have a bit more luck........

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Maia28]

I agree with you Paul. It was the way chickens are produced that sent me veggie for 10 years. I haven't eaten chicken since 1991. I think that food is generally too cheap and undervalued along with those who produce it. Many people will now spend more on alcohol and fags than on proper meals and much of the food they do eat is of poor quality. I guess that I am a bit biased as I spend much of my time working in diabetes and obesity, but it does seem strange that people are prepared to pay £50+ a month for Sky tv but will not feed their children decent food. I'd like to see a subsidy on home-grown seasonal fruit and vegetables and properly produced meat products and a withdrawal of the buy 1 get 10 free offers on high fat and carbohydrate processed foods. In other words incentivising good eating habits so we can all eat well. Given the increasing prevalence of (costly) conditions resulting from poor lifestyle this could prove to be a much cheaper option for improved long-term health.

Sorry if I'm ranting

Andy

 

[Anonymous]

Didn't see that one but did see 'kill it, cook it, eat it'. Was all about slaughtering, cooking and eating pigs. Very strange debate in the studio where people seemed to be trying to justify eating meat.

I loved it when they said that some pigs had good deaths and others had bad. Never thought I'd hear that dying could be good. (yeah, yeah, I know what they meant).

Other amusing comment was about the pigs shaking after they'd been stunned. Supposedly entirely natural. How natural can stunning a pig be? (yeah, yeah, I know what they meant again!)

Dave

 

[Anonymous]

I think it's quite revolting and disgraceful the way much food is produced today.
Paul

Today? It has improved immensely since I stoppd eatig meat as a sort of personal protest against factory farming 27 years ago

 

[Matt_S]

I think anything that will change even some people's minds on this is great.

We only buy fruit and veg from the local butchers and farm shops....the only acception being the odd lemon, lime and clementine at Christmas! Haven't bought meat from a supermarket in about 2 years. Now before anyone comments on cost we don't spend a lot on food....between £50 and 60 a week for two and when at uni we survived off £25 for both of us and in large avoided cheap meat.

The key is quantity, do you need to eat meat every day? If so what size portion and how many meals can you get out of a chicken? We don't really eat chicken much but an equivilant we eat lots of rabbits. One of these as well as a roast meal would then do a casserole bolstered with lots of veg. In the program it looked like one of the guys carved a whole chicken onto his plate!!! I wonder if he used the bones the next day for soup? Hence halving the cost per meal of the bird, and being a lot more respectful of its death.

I'm only 24 but think some old school thrift would go a long way in all aspects of every day life but especially food production.....Don't get me started on the amount of food my family throw away!!! :evil:

 

[rjrl101]

Up here, I find that local shops are often cheaper than the supermarket and supply better quality produce when comparing their respective free range/standard products. For example, I can't get a 20kg sack of Maris Pipers for £8.50 in the supermarket, nor will they sell me 5lbs of beef mince for £5 and tell me which cow on which farm it came from. FR Eggs are still cheaper too despite recent price rises. Milk is the most obvious exception to me.

It's only the basic/essentials/white label ranges that are much lower priced than the local shops, and having tried to eat lumpy anonymous potatoes, rubbery chicken and bacon that disappears into a puddle of water and icky white stuff when it's fried, I'd rather pay a bit more for a degree of quality and support local businesses at the same time.

Also, as Matt_S says there's a lot to be said for thrift and planning your meals. I will buy an oversized joint of meat and, after the meal it is roasted for, it will provide cold cuts for sandwiches/meals for two or three days afterwards. Cheaper and nicer than buying packs of sliced, cooked meat. I use cheaper cuts in curries or stew and something non-meaty like macaroni cheese or pasta will make an appearance once or twice a week.

I'm also shocked by the amount of food waste that it is claimed that the average family produces. 1/3 of the total quantity of food purchased each week, apparently, is thrown away. Just what is this average family doing? It's not all potato peelings, is it? That's the same as saying that people could reduce their weekly shopping bill by about 30% - or alternatively - spend the same, but buying only what they need and of better quality.

 

[Anonymous]

I think that a lot of people are missing the point of this program. It is not suggesting that "real" people spend £7 on a chicken, rather that the supermarkets stop forcing farmers to produce livestock at this pricepoint. Rather the supermarkets should use another non livestock product to have a price war over, the example used in the program was baked beans. Whilst this probably isn't an alternative product that forms a significant part of enough families weekly shop there must be alternatives to chicken.

In my opinion, things probably wont change, money needs to be made and chickens bring people in through the door. Its all very well educating the masses and I for one applaud Ch4 and HFW for doing it but we all know information that we could act on but we don't. We are lazy, until something easier comes along we dont change.

 

[mr]

I think that a lot of people are missing the point of this program. It is not suggesting that "real" people spend £7 on a chicken, rather that the supermarkets stop forcing farmers to produce livestock at this pricepoint.

I think that the suggestion is very much that the supermarkets be forced into this action by means of the general public taking direct purchasing action. While persuading the supermarkets to cease treating farmers in the way they do is laudable, the reality is that the economic imperatives faced by suppliers, retailers and consumers dictate otherwise and I'm afraid I find HFW 's willful disregard for the reality of the situation to be lamentable at best and at worst verging on the offensive.

Cheers Mike

 

[Matt_S]

Saint, I'm not sure whether the supermarkets have picked a product to have a price war on, more that C4 have picked one of all the products supermarkets sell as everything is beaten down on price

 

[Matt_S]

economic imperatives faced by suppliers, retailers and consumers dictate

do they? why should animals suffer? I'm sorry if this is confrontational but on this basis your happy for child labour to enable cheap clothes on the High street?

 

[Digit]

I regret to say that, IMO, you are wasting your time!
25% of school children apparently think that potatoes come from Cows and are unable to relate crisps to potatoes.
With its feathers on they probably wouldn't relate to what's on their plate.
Too much of modern regulation is pushed through by people with no practical knowledge of what they are talking about.
An example. Grey Squirrels are classed as vermin and may be killed by the land owner, then the do gooders step in. They may be shot or humanely trapped.
So you have now caught your Squirrel, so what next, short of dumping it on a neighbour. The law states that you can now humanely destroy it by hitting it on the head, not more than twice!
So if it's squirmed enough for you not have have killed it outright, and you have used your ration of blows, what the hell are you supposed to do?
Also of course, you can hunt a Fox with a bird of prey but not with hounds.
The Fox no doubt appreciates the distinction!

Roy.

 

[tim]

economic imperatives faced by suppliers, retailers and consumers dictate

do they? why should animals suffer? I'm sorry if this is confrontational but on this basis your happy for child labour to enable cheap clothes on the High street?

Matt

Its funny you say that - I was thinking along the same lines as I watched the enormously fat, gobby one complain about the amount of food money she has. She is clearly not denied calories!

I imagine that there was similar resistance 150 odd years ago when child labour was prohibited in this country. 'but we need the money the 7 year old brings in.........'

Cheers

Tim

 

[Matt_S]

I know! She certainly looked like she got enough chicken!

Off topic slightly was it just me or was she in the chicken run....in a paramedics uniform?! I hope it went in the wash that evening!

 

[Jake]

I don't see how it can be offensive or lamentable. The point is that very few people think about or know how intensive chicken sheds are run. If they did, the point is that fewer would eat the stuff, irrespective of price or their wallet - how many fewer is the interesting point.

Those who are in favour of having cheap industrially produced protein in chicken shapes can't object to a programme which sets out to start a debate as to how that is achieved - ultimately from that perspective everything in the programme should be pretty much irrelevant, because the ends justify the means.