Any Veritas Wonder Dog/Pup owners out there?

[Jamesc]

I am looking to make myself a couple of these as I have access to the metal working machinery but sadly not hte funds for the real thing.

I can see how everything goes together except the fixing of the pressure pad, I have looked at every photo I can find but they are all from the side. Would any kind sole be able to describe the fixing for me please?

I can of course work it out for myself but as I only intend making a couple I would prefer not to have to go through too many trial and errors to get it working well.

Just in case anyone is worried I hasten to reassure you that I am only making a couple of similar items for my own use, no finacial benifit other than saving me a few £

Thanks

James

 

[marcros]

yes, i have one of the dogs. i will be in the workshop this afternoon and can have a look if you want, take a few pics etc. alternatively, do you just want to borrow it?

 

[ColeyS1]

Theres a circlip and a small groove on the end of the threaded bit :wink:

 

[Jamesc]

Absolutly briliant thank you, I must be getting better at this design malrky as that is exactly what I came up with.

Thanks for your quick response and taking the time and trouble to take yours apart and photgraph it.

I will post photos of my progress but it will not be rapid, I am making these at the local college and the next session does not start until mid March.

James

 

[marcros]

have a look at your bench. whilst they are usable on a flat surface, i find them to be much better if possible for the handle to be in free air over the edge of the bench. if you have existing dog holes, chjeck the thread length that you are proposing is long enough.

 

[Jamesc]

yes, i have one of the dogs. i will be in the workshop this afternoon and can have a look if you want, take a few pics etc. alternatively, do you just want to borrow it?

Marcros That is a very kind offer of a loan but I think that the photo already posted will suffice. I will keep you all posted but as I say it won't be rapid progress.

James

 

[Argus]

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I bought five similar Veritas dogs intended to clamp boards end-on for gluing between two battens about 15 years ago. Loooking at the LV site the don't do them listed any more, but the dog-end construction is the same.

Anyway, a couple in the batch came with the little cir-clip and the rest had round spring clips. The cir-clips soon fell off after a bit of use, as did one of the spring clips.

I have never needed to take them off for any reason so I did contemplate drilling and tapping a screw into the end, but the quick fix was to peen over the end to stop it coming away from the brass pad. Which is how they have been working ever since.

Apart from the flimsy fixing, it's an excellent tool; the pressure pad only needs to be free to swivel, so I would advocate a more positive way of retaining the brass pad than spring clips.

All best

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[Jamesc]

Thanks Argus,

That is food for thought, I quite like the idea of a screw fixing as i find the quality of circlips that are readily available from the likes of screwfix somewhat suspect and I cannot justify ordering 1000 from an engineering supplier.

James

 

[Argus]

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James, the brass pad is free to swivel and rock side to side a little to accomodate an uneven clamping position.
Mine have had a lot of use and that was my only gripe.
I said that I had intended drilling and tappin; there isn't much meat on the end of the Veritas version, but If you are making your own, you can make the spiggot a bit fatter. A screw and spring washer will do the trck.

I said that I thought that Veritas had discontinued the excellent panel clamps.....

Dieter Schmid has them listed:

http://www.fine-tools.com/G307970.htm

... gone up a bit in the past 15 odd years though. :shock: :shock: :shock:

All best

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[Jamesc]

Thanks Argus,

I may well add a couple of those clamps to my list as they should be relatively simple once I have the machines set up. I think a little experimentation is called for regarding the pad fixing as increasing the spigot will reduce the step that presses against the pad and this after all is what is actually doing the work. I will try out a few drawings and see what I can come up with, obviously Veritas have to factor cost and ease of manufacture into their equasions which I have the luxury of not having to follow.

... gone up a bit in the past 15 odd years though. :shock: :shock: :shock:

That was what promped me to make them in the first place (that and being a skinflint )

James

 

[WandrinAndy]

I said that I thought that Veritas had discontinued the excellent panel clamps.....

Dieter Schmid has them listed: http://www.fine-tools.com/G307970.htm

... gone up a bit in the past 15 odd years though. :shock: :shock: :shock:

If I was able to make my own, I wouldn't bother with making pups.... Would only follow the panel clamp design as these clamps can just as well be used as pups also.

 

[Giff]

Hi James
I use these as well and they are really useful and can exert a lot of pressure. I use mine for a couple of specific uses where I screw a piece of shaped hardwood onto the brass block to seat into a curve. I find you do need a wooden spacer to stop cramp marks so I wonder if you need the brass block or whether you could just tap the end of the threaded screw and fit different blocks...I am not sure if you knew but the uprights are angled at about 3 degrees ( I think ) which probably helps the force applied in the dogs holes. Geoff

 

[ColeyS1]

Glad to be of help james I wouldn't recommend others taking there apart like this. One removal and the circlip lost all springiness- I had to squeeze it back together to get it to stay on :-? Axminster were selling a big veritas one in the sale for half price but i was too slow. You may have inspired me to dust the lathe off !

Coley

 

[AES]

Gents,

This is a very interesting thread. Being very much a newbie and a "wood-ignorant" to boot, I had no idea what this dog/pup thing was until if looked at the thread and saw the photos. A I still wasn't sure what they were for/how they were used until I following the link provided for the Fine Tools web site. All is now clear, thanks to all.

Now I don't want to hi-jack your thread but some of us have been suggesting for some little time to the Mods that a Metalwork section would be welcome on this Forum. Now I maybe (read "am") a "wood-ignorant" but from what I've seen I reckon I could make a couple (or 4) of those pretty easily. NO, I'm not offering to make them for anyone (my list of WIPs and Roundtoits is over long already) but WHEN I get round to it I will have a go at knocking a couple of these things out and am prepared to do a WIP with pix. So I'm going to copy the text of this message over to "Next Moderator on line" to see if this stirs any more interest in setting up a Metalworking section here.

Again thanks to all for posting this thread - I really have learnt a helluva lot on this Forum and learn new stuff almost daily.

Cheers

AES

 

[jasonB]

Just out of interest what is the thread form for the screw? Square, Acme or just a regular 60degree?

J

 

[Argus]

.

If you are referring to the ¾” shank, it is not a thread – just a series of rings around the shaft.
The adjusting bolt is some sort of American fine …… it’s about 3/8” diameter. I’ll measure the diameter and pitch exactly when I get out to the workshop.

All best.



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[AES]

@Jason,

I was surprised to hear that the "thread" on the main body is rings and not a thread - but should be no problem to do on a small lathe (like mine).

As I'm sure you know already, normally for a "vice" the thread should be Acme (which could be a bit more of a problem) but looking at those Fine Tools web site illustrations I wouldn't think that one needs to apply a helluva lot of vice pressure - that could even be counter-productive. So if/when I have a go at making a couple I think I'd just use a standard thread, i.e. Whit (55 deg) or Metric (60 deg). Any thoughts?

Krgds
AES

 

[jasonB]

AES, I think you will find most vices are square theread or occasionally butress rather than Acme or the Metric trapisoidal.

As its just a standard 60deg thread I would assume most people having a go at making some would just machine the ends of some M10 studding. Though its not too hard to screwcut a square thread and make a suitable tap like this.

J

 

[AES]

Yup, thanks Jason, I see now. Thanks for the extra pix.

"Normal" vices often have a square thread just as you say, but vice-type devices which need only their main strength in one direction often have Acme. Anyway, as you say, though I've never tried it I guess cutting a square thread on the lathe is pretty easy - just a question of grinding up the correct form tool I guess, just like the form tool for a Whit or Met is used. As said however, I would have thought that for the - I'm guessing - fairly limited pressures required here, a normal thread would be quite workable I guess (as you say, a length of threaded studding would be fine).

Krgds
AES

 

[DTR]

I would have thought that for the - I'm guessing - fairly limited pressures required here, a normal thread would be quite workable I guess (as you say, a length of threaded studding would be fine).

I wonder how necessary a square thread is for woodworking vices in general. After all, wooden screws with "V" threads seem to survive ok.