Marking gauges, update mortice gauge, update pencil gauge

[custard]

"I like lots of different gauges so I don't get them mixed up"

All the more reason to use only one or maybe two, I'd have thought. :?

I don't know if you're serious or not. If you're serious you're wrong.

It's almost impossible to re-set a gauge to precisely the same setting once it's been altered, you can get it nearly correct and that's maybe good enough for making a birdhouse or something similar. But for top quality furniture you need better, so if at any point during a job you need to remake a component or check a measurement then the original gauge is in the same position it was for the original gauge line. Hence you need lots of gauges. Ideally they're different styles or have different coloured tape around the handles so you can positively identify the gauge with the joint on your rod.

It's one of the areas newcomers to woodwork go wrong. They spend their money on the glitzy stuff. You don't actually need many tools, what you need is plenty of superbly functioning lay out, marking and measuring instruments, plus masses of clamps!

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I take your points. Ideal if you've different gauges, but I think I'd rather something a few thou out because I'd reset the gauge than an eighth of an inch out because I'd picked up the wrong one.

 

[Benchwayze]

Okay, i'll ask, why do you need 6 marking gauges?

Then again, in terms of repeatability of settings, I'm finding this is an interesting gauge,

http://woodworkersworkshop.co.uk/epages ... /IG_35-780

=D>

Thanks for that link Custard. It's payday tomorrow. I think I'll buy two of those! :wink:
I take it you know the joke about the 'Magic Bottle of Guiness ? :lol:

 

[Ed Bray]

Okay, i'll ask, why do you need 6 marking gauges?

I'll easily use six gauges or more on a job, I like lots of different gauges so I don't get them mixed up, and I'll leave them set to a particular dimension throughout the build.

Then again, in terms of repeatability of settings, I'm finding this is an interesting gauge,

http://woodworkersworkshop.co.uk/epages ... /IG_35-780

But I'm drifting off topic, well done Pete, they look smashing, really neat work!

=D>

Thanks, for the information.

I probably have about 6 marking gauges in various places, I tend to use a couple at a time if doing half blind dovetails, but never had the need for more. I do have one of those igaging ones though, I had it sent over from the US before they were available here.

 

[AndyT]

"I like lots of different gauges so I don't get them mixed up"

All the more reason to use only one or maybe two, I'd have thought. :?

I don't know if you're serious or not. If you're serious you're wrong.

It's almost impossible to re-set a gauge to precisely the same setting once it's been altered, you can get it nearly correct and that's maybe good enough for making a birdhouse or something similar. But for top quality furniture you need better, so if at any point during a job you need to remake a component or check a measurement then the original gauge is in the same position it was for the original gauge line. Hence you need lots of gauges. Ideally they're different styles or have different coloured tape around the handles so you can positively identify the gauge with the joint on your rod.

It's one of the areas newcomers to woodwork go wrong. They spend their money on the glitzy stuff. You don't actually need many tools, what you need is plenty of superbly functioning lay out, marking and measuring instruments, plus masses of clamps!

I thoroughly agree with Custard. I bought a bulk lot of gauges on ebay for a few quid and they were all good and others just seem to have found their own way to the workshop.

When I made my chest of drawers I did have a gauge for each dimension and labelled each one on a bit of masking tape. This meant that I could work in a random order when I felt like it rather than having to rigorously do all the thicknesses then all the widths. And when I did have to remake a component because I had cut a dovetail with the wood the wrong way up, I could still get the size right!

 

[Racers]

Finished!

Marking gauges by Racers, on Flickr

And I made 12 more pots of jam that's 38 pots in total.

Pete

 

[Jacob]

"I like lots of different gauges so I don't get them mixed up"

All the more reason to use only one or maybe two, I'd have thought. :?

I don't know if you're serious or not. If you're serious you're wrong.

It's almost impossible to re-set a gauge to precisely the same setting once it's been altered, you can get it nearly correct and that's maybe good enough for making a birdhouse or something similar. But for top quality furniture you need better, so if at any point during a job you need to remake a component or check a measurement then the original gauge is in the same position it was for the original gauge line. Hence you need lots of gauges. Ideally they're different styles or have different coloured tape around the handles so you can positively identify the gauge with the joint on your rod.

It's one of the areas newcomers to woodwork go wrong. They spend their money on the glitzy stuff. You don't actually need many tools, what you need is plenty of superbly functioning lay out, marking and measuring instruments, plus masses of clamps!

I thoroughly agree with Custard. I bought a bulk lot of gauges on ebay for a few quid and they were all good and others just seem to have found their own way to the workshop.

When I made my chest of drawers I did have a gauge for each dimension and labelled each one on a bit of masking tape. This meant that I could work in a random order when I felt like it rather than having to rigorously do all the thicknesses then all the widths. And when I did have to remake a component because I had cut a dovetail with the wood the wrong way up, I could still get the size right!

Yep more the merrier. It helps if they are all different so you don't get them mixed up. Stain them different colours Pete? Red orange yellow green blue indigo violet? That way you could sell them in boxed sets of 7.
It also helps that you can get them for pennies on ebay - particularly if you buy a big box of assorted dubious tools.
Start the rod at the start of the job and keep it to the end. Set the gauges ditto. Even use the same pencil from 1st notes to final marking. But use a biro for invoices!

 

[Cheshirechappie]

But use a biro for invoices!

A biro? What are you doing using this new-fangled modern rubbish? I'd have thought you'd have fashioned your own quill pens with feathers plucked from some poor unfortunate local goose, and mixed your own ink from egg-whites (poor unfortunate local goose again?) and lamp-black collected from your candle. :lol:

 

[Droogs]

What can I say Pete except, sweet on both count

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

They will have beveled knives so the flat side on the knife marks the edge with the bevel in the waste, so you need one for each side of the mortice.
If you where marking a base line for dove tails you would use the one with the flat on the outside.

Pete

There is a problem if you attempt to mark with the flat reversed on a knife - it will push the fence away from the side of the board (and the knife with it).

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

I hope this doesn't count as thread stealing, but I just wanted to share something I copied onto one of my bought cutting gauges.

Having seen a Stanley 70 1/2 for sale somewhere I used a bit of dowel and a wooden ball I had about my person to make a copy. When using a marking or cutting gauge I always pull on the sharp end against the fence and this modification, which probably took about 15 minutes to do, makes this much easier.



Sorry for jumping on the bandwagon of Pete's beautiful handmade gauges.
Simon

Simon, what is the knob for?

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Jacob]

To make it look like Mickey Mouse?

 

[Droogs]

I'd say that's a pretty good little mod to do for anyone who has arthritic fingers to help them hold and move the guide

 

[custard]

I'd say that's a pretty good little mod to do for anyone who has arthritic fingers to help them hold and move the guide

I don't have arthritis, but it runs in the family. As I intend to keep working wood for many years to come I always make a mental note of little things like that. There are a few superficially wacky looking ideas I've got filed away in case I ever need them, like a two handed saw! They may be almost comical but if they keep me in the workshop then I'm not sure I could care two hoots.

 

[Droogs]

Hi Custard,
when you say 2 handed saw, I'm guessing you don't mean in the style of an old fashioned felling saw (handles at either end) but more like the grip on a WWI/II vickers maxim machine gun. or is it something different, do you have any pics, just out of curiosity?

 

[David C]

It is logical for a thicknessing gauge, to have the bevel facing out. I use one of these all the time and regularly thickness component sized timber to better than +or minus 0.002" (on a good day!)

Now the tendency to be pushed towards the edge, causing a wiggle, may be overcome in three ways.

1. Use progressively deeper marks. With a traditional gauge the front edge is used as a pivot and depth of cut is controlled by rotating the stem. Kingshott recommended three passes, scratch, medium and full depth. I frequently use more steps.

2. Clamping the work allows great lateral force to be used. (Resisting and overcoming the wiggle danger).

3. A slight twist angle on the flat face of the pin or knife helps to grip the wood. I was surprised to see how much angle is built into both knives of my expensive Japanese gauge.

The pivoting function of the traditional wooden gauge, is a subtle point. It is missing from wheel gauges and even the Japanese gauge.

In the recent review of my "Secret Mitre Dovetail" DVD, F&C editor, Derek Jones picked up on my use of modified, cheapest, Beech, Marples gauges. I use them because they work better for me than all the glamorous examples which tend to live in a drawer.

My students were advised to have at least 5 gauges. If they were all Tite-Mark the cost would have been horrendous.

Preserving settings through the job, has always been considered good practice.

best wishes,
David

 

[Jacob]

yep a handful of ordinary cheap gauges is best. Different shapes and sizes is useful too.

Another trick is to work backwards (and forwards) - you mark the last 4" or so then move back and mark the next 4" so you are running into the mark you've already made - and so on. This way if any of your marks has slipped into the grain and gone off it will be only within the 4" and should be obvious. Whereas if you mark in one pass from near end to far end the whole line might have gone off without you noticing it. Sounds complicated but it isn't.

yer ordinary wooden gauge is also comfortable to use which is important if you have a big pile of marking up to do - you could be at it all day on a big multiple project, which would make those pointlessly expensive metal versions even less useful.

 

[David C]

Nice technique.

David

 

[n0legs]

Did Jacob agree with David C?
Wow, I really need to stop drinking. I'm seeing things.

 

[custard]

Hi Custard,
when you say 2 handed saw, I'm guessing you don't mean in the style of an old fashioned felling saw (handles at either end) but more like the grip on a WWI/II vickers maxim machine gun. or is it something different, do you have any pics, just out of curiosity?

http://www.popularwoodworking.com/tools ... -in-sawing

Another tool I've got mentally filed away in case I ever get arthritis is this,

http://www.woodrat.com/downloads/PlungeBar_Guide.pdf

There should probably be a separate sticky thread for tools that help overcome disabilities.