Slightly unorthodox test of Festool TS55 Rail saw

[SVB]

Saw this on YT - an unusual approach!

http://youtu.be/oezp-_DcUgg

(Warning - bit of strong language)

S

 

[Eric The Viking]

That was fun, but he is a bit rude though!

I was slightly amused by the assessment of the rotor and the bearings. The Hall-effect sensor was obvious and the blade bearing a bit odd (the sleeve bearing takes hardly any load though, because of its distance from the blade and the helical gear).

Does anyone know - do Neutrik make the power connectors for Festool? I don't own Festool kit, but I've often thought the exterior of the plug looks a lot like the old "Speakon" connectors:

If so they're probably pretty well designed, and rewireable. Neutrik have made mains connectors that size for a long time:

(and there's a new style black/orange thing they make that's probably cheaper too).

Not being a Festool owner... is it the same Plug-It connector used on both 110V and 240 versions of the saw? If so it's asking for trouble (one would think). If they are different, how can you tell which is which if you don't have access to the plug on t'other end?

Just being contrary...

 

[sploo]

Does anyone know - do Neutrik make the power connectors for Festool? I don't own Festool kit, but I've often thought the exterior of the plug looks a lot like the old "Speakon" connectors:

If so they're probably pretty well designed, and rewireable. Neutrik have made mains connectors that size for a long time:

(and there's a new style black/orange thing they make that's probably cheaper too).

I don't have the gear to hand, but the inside of the connector for my DF700 looks quite different. Ah - here's a good image: http://www.axminster.co.uk/festool-spar ... GwodjE4IeA

 

[Eric The Viking]

Yes I knew it wasn't a Powercon or a Speakon, but I wondered if Neutrik made it for them.

Interestingly, the lugs stop you mating 240V mains with a 110V tool, but the other way round?

The Plug-it plugs don't have the voltage clearly marked on them (as far as I can see), and there are apparently two gauges of wire, so there are two 110V versions that don't interconnect, and THREE lug configurations (110-120V "small", 110-120V high amps, 240V). At least I think that's it (welcome correction on this). It looks like one permutation lets you plug 110V into a 240V tool, but the barrels may be different diameters.

There's a discussion here http://festoolownersgroup.com/festo...now-about-plug-its-conversions-(usa-version)/ but only about the USA (110-120V) configuration.

They apparently sell conversion kits for other brands of tool (a power-in plug-it with a some inches of cable to go into the actual tool). This strikes me as just nasty as the plugs will keep catching on the work etc.

I like detachable cables as a rule because they make tool storage a lot tidier, and they're safer when you're carrying tools around (less chance of tripping or catching the cable on something, but given I own no Festool presently, I'll probably go my own way on this, if I ever do mod any tools.

 

[n0legs]

Not really sure what to make of that.
Okay so he took it apart to have a look inside but I'm not sure about his assessment of the machine.
I really didn't get the bit about melting the plastic as a test or his issue about the motor housing end cap being a lesser grade of material.
What I am sure of is what a waste of a good tool if he can't get it back together.
Interesting in some ways, but gratuitous in others.
F__k_ng I_ot is my honest opinion :roll:
I'll leave you lot to fill in the blanks :lol:

Just a quick edit to add,
It would have been way more interesting and informative if a Festool engineer did it and explained some of their design ideas and reasoning behind construction and materials choice.

 

[pcb1962]

Not really sure what to make of that.
Okay so he took it apart to have a look inside but I'm not sure about his assessment of the machine.
I really didn't get the bit about melting the plastic as a test or his issue about the motor housing end cap being a lesser grade of material.
What I am sure of is what a waste of a good tool if he can't get it back together.
Interesting in some ways, but gratuitous in others.
F__k_ng I_ot is my honest opinion :roll:

Not an silly person at all, a very knowledgeable and capable engineer.
And he always gets the tools back together, here's some of his others: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=youtu ... tube+BOLTR

 

[sploo]

I like detachable cables as a rule because they make tool storage a lot tidier, and they're safer when you're carrying tools around (less chance of tripping or catching the cable on something, but given I own no Festool presently, I'll probably go my own way on this, if I ever do mod any tools.

I do like that about the DF700. I'd like to get a Festool vac with the combined cable+tube to automatically start extraction when the tool runs, but it would be a vanity purchase rather than a necessity.

 

[Sporky McGuffin]

It would have been way more interesting and informative if a Festool engineer did it and explained some of their design ideas and reasoning behind construction and materials choice.

I'd much rather a qualified independent reviewer - the guy clearly knows his stuff and wasn't afraid to point out the good design as well as the less good.

 

[n0legs]

Not an silly person at all, a very knowledgeable and capable engineer.

How do you know that?
I watched a few more and to be honest I can see where he's coming from but his presenting style is not my cup of tea. He gets some of them back together, the makita saw but I didn't see it running. The one that I was interested in, the Hilti (because I own use and rate them) he didn't get back together, unless there's another video I may have missed.

 

[n0legs]

It would have been way more interesting and informative if a Festool engineer did it and explained some of their design ideas and reasoning behind construction and materials choice.

I'd much rather a qualified independent reviewer - the guy clearly knows his stuff and wasn't afraid to point out the good design as well as the less good.

I think you missed my point. I wasn't after a review, they've been done to death about Festool stuff, I wanted some insight.

 

[pcb1962]

There's a discussion here http://festoolownersgroup.com/festo...now-about-plug-its-conversions-(usa-version)/ but only about the USA (110-120V) configuration.

They apparently sell conversion kits for other brands of tool (a power-in plug-it with a some inches of cable to go into the actual tool). This strikes me as just nasty as the plugs will keep catching on the work etc.

Works very well on tools that you are using a dust extraction hose with, you just velcro the cable with plug to the hose, I've done it with my Bosch sander...

 

[pcb1962]

Not an silly person at all, a very knowledgeable and capable engineer.

How do you know that?

:roll: from watching his videos for the past 3 years.

The one that I was interested in, the Hilti (because I own use and rate them) he didn't get back together, unless there's another video I may have missed.

The Hilti is back together here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl-TbyCRqUQ

 

[n0legs]

:roll: from watching his videos for the past 3 years.

I'll pop my videos up of me doing some open heart surgery. I'm an expert... Honest.
Thanks for the link re. Hilti drill, I'll give it a watch.

 

[Sporky McGuffin]

I think you missed my point. I wasn't after a review, they've been done to death about Festool stuff, I wanted some insight.

I don't think I missed your point, but I seem to have used a trigger word for you - my apologies.

I think you get interesting insights from someone who is qualified and independent, just as you do from someone from inside the company. Both are useful and both are valid. The guy in the video was making perfectly valid comments, both positve and negative.

 

[custard]

It illustrates the problem with the YouTube world.

Is he knowledgeable and qualified, or does he just pretend he is? I've no idea if I should trust him or ignore him. Maybe he's Isambard Kingdom Brunel re-incarnated, maybe he's a dreary loudmouth, I don't know and furthermore I don't know how I can find out.

A useful question to ask is, "why is he doing this?". I can only think of two possible explanations. Firstly to earn advertising money from User Generated Content. Or secondly to big himself up and revel in his new found reputation as an online celebrity. I doubt he's doing it to enrich mankind with his insights, and even if he is then it takes us back to my original point, are his insights actually worth anything?

I watched some of the Wood Whisperer videos once as I wanted some reviews on a bit of kit I was thinking of buying. It was obvious early on that he's not a particularly experienced or competent woodworker. He's an interim level hobbyist who's trying to turn his hobby into an income. Good luck to him, all he needs is your clicks and eyeballs. But is this the person you want to be guided by? Or is it just woodworking themed entertainment, a way of idling away twenty minutes at work? I came to the conclusion that, nice enough chap that he appeared to be, his opinions on an expensive router table weren't anything I'd base my buying decisions on. Not that I thought he was dishonest in any way, just that his standards on accuracy and reliability aren't my standards, so he's not someone I'd turn to for advice.

 

[Eric The Viking]

(on Spagnuolo)... I came to the conclusion that, nice enough chap that he appeared to be, his opinions on an expensive router table weren't anything I'd base my buying decisions on. Not that I thought he was dishonest in any way, just that his standards on accuracy and reliability aren't my standards, so he's not someone I'd turn to for advice.

I'm inclined to agree.

I watched his video on setting up a planer:

1. I have a P/T, quite different mechanically from a planer-only design.
2. The big planer that he has ("Jointer") is altogether better made than mine and has handy adjustments that mine doesn't - I need a different approach.
3. He doesn't really explain the issues, such as snipe and knife height (why, for example should the knives be set _higher_ than the outfeed table - they probably should, but it's not straightforward, as it's feed-speed dependent).

Steve Maskery of this parish has explained it all a lot better in the past.

If I had posh machines, I still wouldn't go to the Wood whisperer for advice.

I still like the guy though, but it's entertainment, not serious instruction.

 

[pcb1962]

:roll: from watching his videos for the past 3 years.

I'll pop my videos up of me doing some open heart surgery. I'm an expert... Honest.

Your mistake is to assume that I'm not qualified to judge his level of expertise.

 

[custard]

[/quote]Your mistake is to assume that I'm not qualified to judge his level of expertise.[/quote]

I'm sure you are, but I don't know that. I can't inspect your work nor check your credentials. And that's one of the failings of the internet as a source for learning. Back in the day if a furniture maker gave me some advice I could glance over at his bench and see how gappy his dovetails were, and if they weren't a deal neater than mine I'd know to disregard his opinions. But here in cyber space everyone's a Guild Mark winning craftsman!

 

[n0legs]

Your mistake is to assume that I'm not qualified to judge his level of expertise.

Please please share your expertise in this matter.
I would love to hear your professional opinion from the evidence supplied, a poorly edited and presented autopsy of a well designed market leading tool.
Take it for what it is, a guy with some abilty trying to discredit tool manfacturers. Entertaining - maybe. Conclusive - no.
He did get the Hilti back together and working, fairplay to him.

 

[woodenstx]

I'd be shocked if 'anyone' capable of taking a production line built product apart, couldn't then get it back together and working again... Its not hard to do! just consider (unfairly or not) the people on the lines who make this stuff, its only an assembly job where all the hard and clever work of design and tolerances etc have been sorted before hand.

From the guys other videos it seems nothing makes him happy, ergo he probably is an engineer and possibly a decent one (a happy engineer is a scary thing!).
Stuff gets cost reduced when productionised, and it also gets the most appropriate materials (usually) so the handle in point for example... as a woodwork tool where you are massively massively unlikely to have greasy hands, the butyl rubber stuff is totally fit for purpose. On the positive side, my hilti drill which has been used under my car etc was covered in butyl rubber and it still is as good as it was 8 years ago