Nanohone price

[ali27]

Guys for years the diamond lapping plates of Shapton and DMT were the most expensive
plates. Prices about 350 en 200 USD. The Nanohone comes with a plate that is two to three
times more expensive!

250 x 70 x 20 mm
€739.00

https://www.dictum.com/en/nano-hone-eam ... l-8-711222

Flatness tolerance < 0.05 mm (after diamond coating).

That's two thou right? Totally unimpressive. For the price he is selling the tiny plate, you could buy
a very large surface plate that is ten times more accurate.

You know maybe I should start making diamond plates as well. 2 thou is something I might even be
able to see with the naked eye so no precision tools necesarry.

Not trying to be an A$$hole, but when I see these kind of prices and few facts to justify the price, I get
a bit irritated.

 

[Rorschach]

The grist size is 50 micron which is 0.05mm so the tolerance is to allow for one bit of grit sat on top of another.

I don't understand how they say they can re-grind it though, surely it would have to be recoated in diamonds again?

 

[Droogs]

Man that is an absolute bargain, what you moaning for. If you wanna moan, moan about the 200 euro baking tray you need to get to use it properly. Dictum must have had new windows fitted just before the lockdown

 

[ali27]

The grist size is 50 micron which is 0.05mm so the tolerance is to allow for one bit of grit sat on top of another.

I don't understand how they say they can re-grind it though, surely it would have to be recoated in diamonds again?

I guess I am paying that amount of cash, I would not accept a tolerance that big. Good find though! Did not think about it that way.

The diamonds are dispersed throughout the metal buttons, as the metal abrades, diamond particles appear.

In contrast to conventional lapping plates, this product does not have a diamond coated surface, but raised cross-shaped metal buttons that have diamonds dispersed throughout their entire structure.

So there are layers of diamond abrasive embedded in the buttons. As the buttons abrade ''fresh'' diamond particles get exposed. Problem is that the flattness is lost also. Basically they grind the metal buttons flat when the plate needs recallibration.

 

[Rorschach]

Ahh that makes sense.

 

[D_W]

It appears to have sintered buttons. Sintered plates are not uncommon in japan (they were expensive) and aren't that great at keeping flatness. They're for heavier use, i guess (the stones sold in japan are for grinding and sharpening, not for stone flattening).

The interrupted pattern probably makes it influential on a stone. Overall, it's a stupid tax, though. For sharpening stones makes it doubly stupid.

I have long collected and refurbished stones. At the point that any stone becomes a challenge for a normal diamond hone, it's much more appropriate to use a cheap belt sander and spot remove material (using a hard point of contact with a normal al-ox belt - the hard point being a theoretical line on the idler at one end of the belt sander) until what's left can be lapped flat.

I can literally think of no practical purpose for that thing, and its boast of being 5-times flattenable is given without an estimate of the cost of shipping and having the reflattening done.

 

[dannyr]

Those 'buttons' look rather like those threaded on wire to cut stone in quarries - a whole wire with many thousands of buttons is quite expensive but the few on one plate would not be $$$$ - if they're not the same, and the button plate is useful, I can see some supplier coming up with a much cheaper version from quarry wire (even used would be OK as the wear in stone cutting is on the circumference), or they could be from a slab planer/polisher. (They're all industrial diamonds - which are actually pretty cheap, in a nickel or similar matrix, which can cost as much or more, pressed and sintered, or HIPped).

 

[D_W]

Nano Hone

Nano Hone
Nano Hone is an entity of HMS Enterprises Inc., which is headquartered in the USA and has a production site in Japan.

Harrelson stanley is the individual who imported and doubled the price of shapton stones and made people believe they needed nonsense devices such as the "sharp skate".

This is just my opinion (as a former shapton user before moving to natural stones, but I got my shaptons directly from japan), but harrelson has added zero value to consumers after the initial introduction to something that's otherwise common in japan (shapton products, knives, tools, etc - all of it very heavily marked up - a beginner's trap). Not sure what happened with shapton, if he gave up distribution or if it was taken away, but I guess he's moved on to higher priced and less sensible things (my opinion).

His page peddles BS, like referring to everything that he does as "methods" as if it's groundbreaking, and now with murray carter (another markup artist), they have the "carter stanley sharpening method".

Barf.

Should I set up a webpage extolling my planemaking methods for double iron planes, dogmatically declaring each way that i do something (which is probably the way anyone with sense would do something) as demonstrably superior to anything else?

The shame of all of this for beginners is that in all of my years of sharpening things, and literally 500 different sharpening stones (natural and not), the best way to sharpen something if you're grinding by hand is a medium crystolon in an oil bath for grinding, something inexpensive and moderately fast for mid work, and a slow stone for the fine finish work. *none of these are expensive*.

 

[Andy Kev.]

Come on lads, you're being a bit slow on the uptake.

That thing is obviously designed as the latest must-have jewellery accessory for those rapper chaps (the "c" is silent), clearly to be worn on a half inch thick chain around the neck. How else are you going to be able to wear so many diamonds at one time?

Maybe David Beckham will get one fitted onto his ear.

 

[D_W]

I wonder if lloyds is taking odds on how long it will be before Rob Cosman is selling these beside underwhelming and overpriced trend products and "hone rite".

 

[Cheshirechappie]

When I first saw the image of said Nanohone, I assumed it was intended for some engineering honing purpose - finishing hardened gauges or precision parts, something like that. Having googled, it seems not. These things apparently are intended as woodworker's sharpening stones.

I'm not really too bothered about the price of the things; people can drive Bentleys or old bangers as far as I'm concerned, they'll both get you to the shops.

What makes me scratch my head a bit is how you'd hone a 1/4" chisel on them without it constantly dropping into the gaps between the abrasive pads.

 

[Argus]

This whole topic would have been more appropriate on Wednesday morning.

 

[Trevanion]

What makes me scratch my head a bit is how you'd hone a 1/4" chisel on them without it constantly dropping into the gaps between the abrasive pads.

I think it's only purpose is to flatten off other stones rather than actually take the tools to it.

I think I'll stick with the back of my £1 ceramic tile :shock:

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I didn't have any problem with the coping stone on the garden wall for my waterstones.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

What makes me scratch my head a bit is how you'd hone a 1/4" chisel on them without it constantly dropping into the gaps between the abrasive pads.

I think it's only purpose is to flatten off other stones rather than actually take the tools to it.

Ah - that makes a bit more sense. A bit more, mind, not a lot more.

Is anybody bored enough to work out how much coarse emery cloth you could buy for the price of one of those things? I would, but I've got some drying paint I've got to watch ...

 

[Trevanion]

Is anybody bored enough to work out how much coarse emery cloth you could buy for the price of one of those things? I would, but I've got some drying paint I've got to watch ...

Sorry, Can't. Watching grass grow :duno:

 

[lurker]

Jacob would love this thread

 

[D_W]

When I first saw the image of said Nanohone, I assumed it was intended for some engineering honing purpose - finishing hardened gauges or precision parts, something like that. Having googled, it seems not. These things apparently are intended as woodworker's sharpening stones.

I'm not really too bothered about the price of the things; people can drive Bentleys or old bangers as far as I'm concerned, they'll both get you to the shops.

What makes me scratch my head a bit is how you'd hone a 1/4" chisel on them without it constantly dropping into the gaps between the abrasive pads.

The thing that's, I guess, not surprising here - whenever something like this comes up and is described as superior for one reason or another (at only one thing that people seem to have survived without for centuries), it always seems like the same characters are behind it.

I understand distribution and associated costs, but there are levels that are in bad taste. Bentley vehicles are notorious in the US as being affordable only for those who can stand both to fix them and to have them be nearly worthless in less than a decade. At least they are honest when they market them.

Murray Carter is mixed in with these now - at one point he was a knife maker, but I guess the labor of making actual craft has become too much. There's some much over description of basic things. It would be as if we described our cars as a '17th generation, semi-automated, continuous running spherically equipped petroleum based highly efficient 9th generation sheet metal carriage' to people who had never seen a car before.

This kind of dogma has caught some of my friends - especially engineers and other technical people who don't know that in woodworking, we generally mark things, remove wood and when our wood removers don't work well, we rub them on fairly crude things and they work again. My friends are of means to some extent, so I guess it doesn't matter. Something must've gone south with HMS and shapton as some of the claims for these duds marketed on dictum are aimed at the construction of shapton's stuff (their DGLP or whatever it is also being a pure indulgence, but now suddenly appearing relatively cheap).

Harrelson stanley has always doubled the prices of things without adding value in my opinion, working on the convenient hiding of japanese goods from most american consumers because web searches don't turn up japanese results due to the script. I recall having my salesman's antenna alert up about carter before, but remember that at least early on, he was telling people that there really wasn't much to do sharpening things other than use a pair of inexpensive king stones that are about $55 in japan together (flattening was done as a part of the sharpening process). I guess the temptation is just too great.

They should just sell liver pills instead. They already have carter's name on them.

 

[ali27]

Nano Hone

Nano Hone
Nano Hone is an entity of HMS Enterprises Inc., which is headquartered in the USA and has a production site in Japan.

Harrelson stanley is the individual who imported and doubled the price of shapton stones and made people believe they needed nonsense devices such as the "sharp skate".

This is just my opinion (as a former shapton user before moving to natural stones, but I got my shaptons directly from japan), but harrelson has added zero value to consumers after the initial introduction to something that's otherwise common in japan (shapton products, knives, tools, etc - all of it very heavily marked up - a beginner's trap). Not sure what happened with shapton, if he gave up distribution or if it was taken away, but I guess he's moved on to higher priced and less sensible things (my opinion).

His page peddles BS, like referring to everything that he does as "methods" as if it's groundbreaking, and now with murray carter (another markup artist), they have the "carter stanley sharpening method".

Barf.

Should I set up a webpage extolling my planemaking methods for double iron planes, dogmatically declaring each way that i do something (which is probably the way anyone with sense would do something) as demonstrably superior to anything else?

The shame of all of this for beginners is that in all of my years of sharpening things, and literally 500 different sharpening stones (natural and not), the best way to sharpen something if you're grinding by hand is a medium crystolon in an oil bath for grinding, something inexpensive and moderately fast for mid work, and a slow stone for the fine finish work. *none of these are expensive*.

No doubt in my mind David that you would acknowledge that the modern sharpening stones are better. It's just that the improvement is marginal.

I do think the Sharp Skate is a nice product. It looks like a well made solid product. Then again a 5 buck Eclips can be made to work extremely well.

This diamond Nanohone is more of a product like you describe. A lot of BS. I remember Harrelson in a youtube video praising the 16K or 30K stone with something in te line of ''It is removing the steel, beautiful'' and somebody replied ''Of course it removes steel, it's a sharpening stone''.

I think his products are solid, but the prices are way too high. Also he needs to reduce the BS level in his products.

 

[D_W]

Modern stones may be better for a paint-by-number type system, but they fall short of some of the older stones for an experienced user. For example, what sold now grinds hardened steel better than a typical newly made norton crystolon in an oil bath? Nothing. The bonded waterstones in coarse configuration are no good. For middle stones, a finer silicon carbide stone of the same type or a norton fine india is probably better in experienced hands and some kind of slow finisher to freehand (and that is tough on the surface and can sharpen small things as well as large) is better. 1 micron diamonds on a hard cast plate are also probably better for the fine finish than any of the modern bonded stones, but the cast plate needs to be well made.

All in all, I think they're (some bonded stones) better for beginners, but I strayed away from them because they're a hassle and ultimately slower once you can sharpen freehand and understand how it's done fastest (bias toward grinding, the finish stone does as little as possible and right at the edge so as not to alter geometry and create additional work).

What I don't like about the harrelson types is in my opinion just a matter of lazy greed. A shapton cream stone at retail in japan has always ( as far as I can remember) been around $55 at retail. When they popped up here, somehow, they were $120-$150 and there was a lot of hocum surrounding their marketing (they're a common stone in japan, not something exotic). In my opinion, it's shysterism - but there's a lot of that in the market of selling natural japanese stones, too. I have done some fighting of that (I bought used stones, graded them and sold them pretty close to cost for years just as a side hobby, and then gave away the info of what I was getting, where and how to try to drown out the shyster natural stone sellers here on razor sites and sales sites, etc), but it'll never go away. Those things all take advantage of beginners, and I don't like it.