Record 405 combination plane

[devonwoody]

Purchased the 405 combination plane last week from the Sale/wanted section.

Picked up this manual form the web if anyone is interested.

http://www.elsewhere.org/woodworking/Re ... Manual.pdf

Nice set of blades (23) however the sharpening of those fluting blades is going to give me some headaches, I suppose I could get out some emery paper and dowelling and start now ready for next spring.

 

[mickthetree]

I have a Stanley Multiplane and if its a similar blade I am thinking of (used mine to make this beading) then if the blade is currently sharp enough, use it to create the shape it is designed for in a piece of wood, then whack on a load of polishing compound (got mine from work), then flip the blade over and you have the perfect honing shape.

I'll take a photo later of my "setup" (scrap of wood)

Hope this makes sense.

 

[woodbloke]

I think Paul Chapman recommends using a shaped mdf wheel in a drill press for sharpening those flutey cuters...I think it's dressed with some sort of abrasive paste (Autosol maybe) but could be way off the mark - Rob

 

[devonwoody]

Thanks Mick, that sounds a good way to go, so I shall need to get some polishing compound from somewhere, what did you do give the former a layer of grease to hold the compound or does it grab by itself?

 

[mickthetree]

I got some jewellers rouge and just rubbed it on. I used pine and it just stuck.

Not sure if this is the proper way to do it, but it gave a razer sharp edge in no time.

 

[GazPal]

The only drawback with using a powered abrasive wheel (Incl. MDF impregnated/coated with abrasive paste) on fluted irons is the increased risk of producing uneven edges.

As with Mick's suggestion, all we used to do was cut various fluting, ovolo and beading runs into a surface - using mahogany/timber scraps - and coat the resulting pattern in honing paste. Edges are easily touched up/refreshed at any time. An 8" long section of 2"x2" can contain sufficient pre-prepared surfaces for most cutter sets and runs far less risk of altering blade geometry than slip-stones and MDF wheels.

I hope this helps.

 

[devonwoody]

Thanks for the advice and information. If we get a warm spell I will have a trial run out in the workshop.

 

[Argus]

.

The fluted cutters can be tricky to hone without distorting the shape with over enthusiastic sharpening. As with wooden moulding planes, it's best to get the profile right with a smooth inside bevel, then leave it alone.

It's inportant to get the backs flat; I usually tickle them on a strop or lately Autosol that soeone here recommended.
This way, you can also ensure a snug fit onto the rear skate. This last bit is essential to prevent chatter, as many of the later-manufacture British Stanley/Record blades were stamped and may not have dead flat backs from new - or in many cases with Second hand planes, - unused.

There are lots of methods for repairing bevels - being an occasional carver, I use gouge slips.

Gouge slips can be expensive - If you don't have any, you can make your own in any shape you need by cutting down an old Japanese water stone, if you have one, with a hack saw.
Saw slices off and finish to shape the profiles you need with files and abrasive paper.
Many of us have gone over to Diamond plates or scary sharp so, you can make lots of different slips from a worn out water stone that's no longer used.


.

.

 

[Paul Chapman]

Hi DW, have a good read of this stuff from Alf's website. It's an excellent tutorial and includes some good stuff on honing the shaped cutters http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/combihow.html

One way I've honed the beading cutters is to hone the straight part of the blade as normal and then hone the curved part on a wheel made from MDF and held in an electric drill on a horizontal drill stand

The MDF wheel is easily shaped by holding a rasp against it as it revolves. I then use some honing compound on it and hone the blade freehand with the drill on a slow speed. However, I now have a Tormek so will try using the small leather wheels that you can get for that.

Whatever you do, try not to alter the shape of the cutters as they would be difficult to grind back to their original shape. Keep to the single bevel of 35 degrees and don't try honing a secondary or micro-bevel.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[devonwoody]

Thanks Paul for the post. They are the old style cutters I assume because they are in a nice fitting box and give the impression that the profiles are good.

 

[Charles Stanford]

I have one and use it often. However, you need to identify whether you have a model that is cadmium plated. If so, you need to wash your hands thoroughly after using the plane or wear gloves when you do use it.

 

[devonwoody]

I have one and use it often. However, you need to identify whether you have a model that is cadmium plated. If so, you need to wash your hands thoroughly after using the plane or wear gloves when you do use it.

Please explain more! How would I recognise a cadmium plated model.?

And a welcome to the forum.

 

[bugbear]

I have one and use it often. However, you need to identify whether you have a model that is cadmium plated. If so, you need to wash your hands thoroughly after using the plane or wear gloves when you do use it.

Please explain more!

This, I imagine:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium_poisoning

BugBear

 

[Charles Stanford]

I have one and use it often. However, you need to identify whether you have a model that is cadmium plated. If so, you need to wash your hands thoroughly after using the plane or wear gloves when you do use it.

Please explain more! How would I recognise a cadmium plated model.?

And a welcome to the forum.

Thanks, good to be here.

The plane will have a dull, matte appearance perhaps even chalky in places.

 

[TomiRosso]

Hi,

I get this kind of Record 405 lately.

Quite nice find. It has been one old woodworker at 30 years. He was kept it quite good condition.

Is there any type study of those 405's? Age little bit interests me. Booklet copyright was printed at 1949.

And where I could find Record plane catalogues? It would be interesting to look those little bit.

-TR

 

[Argus]

A good find - it appears to be complete.

I believe that Roy Arnold re-published their 1938 cataloge, No: 15 about 15 years ago. The ISBN on my copy is : 0 904638 14 6 It may well be out of print now, but you may find it other catalogues going second-hand.

Here's a very good site:
http://www.record-planes.com/

And another related site:
http://web.archive.org/web/201412180558 ... lanes.com/

Good luck from Wales

 

[TomiRosso]

Yeah, at fast looking, I don't noticed that nothing or anything big is missing.

I have looked those already. Good sites. I have coulpe of Records before and always it's nice to look little bit planes history.

It would be interesting to look some catalogs from -49 to end of 50's. Plane is probably somewhere between those, or what you think?

Also that Cadmium plating is interesting. When it was used?

 

[Argus]

If your plane instructions are dated 1949, then it is probably a few years after that, say early 1950s.

Rationing (typically of food etc.) persisted well into the 1950s for some foodstuffs and for some tool items sold during and after the last war there were restrictions on plating materials that could be used, typically for those types of planes, the nickel plating.
They were either not plated at all or plated with something else. There were regulations on the subject if you care to dig aroud and research.

If you see cerain original boxes from the period some manufacturers had a label stating 'War Finish' and quoting the regulations. It all finished by about 1955.

Good luck

 

[Bod]

http://web.archive.org/web/201503200723 ... riods.html

Scroll down this page, there's some information towards the bottom.

Bod

 

[TomiRosso]

Yes, I have dig little bit those before. Certain is that it's from 50's. At 1965 and after irons are delivered at plastic case. And that trade label are used before 1956. But this label is in instructions, there are any at plane itself. And there are also said this kind of box was replaced at taller and narrower box after war. So could at start of 50's be the answer? Still I can't found any War Finish text on box.....

-TR