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thecoder

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I have at the ripe old age of 50 just this summer come to woodwork as a hobby I have converetd my garage into a workshop and begged stole and borrowed my tools which in the main are not the best in the world,but part of my strategy was to see how I went on with the hobby and buy a better quality piece each year. (Point of interest I have been smitten with the bug I eat drink and sleep it now :shock: )

Come January I am thinking of buying either Bandsaw or Table saw,now I already have the benchtop verisons of both,they are second hand and well sought into.

My question is and I realise already that price v quality are not always the same in the world of the woodworker and with a budget of £1500 would I be better off looking at the second hand sector and what brands/makes of either table or bandsaw would you reccomend ?

Dave
 

Digit

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£1500 could be more than you need spend or just a fraction of that which is required, all depends on what you intend using them for.
I have a 10 inch CI TS and a 10 inch CI BS, with them I have built furniture, extended my home, built my workshop and made small boxes.
It's horses for courses my friend.

Roy.
 

thecoder

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Digit":2um1to5k said:
£1500 could be more than you need spend or just a fraction of that which is required, all depends on what you intend using them for.
I have a 10 inch CI TS and a 10 inch CI BS, with them I have built furniture, extended my home, built my workshop and made small boxes.
It's horses for courses my friend.

Roy.
Thanks for the reply Roy,yes I see what you mean and to be fair I dont ever see me having to do major joinery works I am more interested in making furniture,jewelery boxes etc, I enjoy using both tools but wondered which would be the most versatile in relation to using/making various jigs with etc..If I am honest I probably feel safer using the bandsaw but thats not really a major factor..I only included the budget figure to give a broad idea of price range
 

condeesteso

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Ooooh!!, bang on budget too. A Hammer N4400 bandsaw. I want one so surely everyone else does too?? But more sensibly £1500 would get you a cracking 2nd hand Startrite bandsaw, and an equally cracking 10" table saw. Assuming you have the space both are nice to have, but I think allow about 5 feet min all around a T'saw and that means placed centrally in the workspace. A bandsaw is very useful against a wall. Mine has wheels so occasionally I can pull it out and open the front doors of the shop to rip really long bits (12 foot plus).
 

thecoder

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condeesteso":1w6c5rpf said:
Ooooh!!, bang on budget too. A Hammer N4400 bandsaw. I want one so surely everyone else does too?? But more sensibly £1500 would get you a cracking 2nd hand Startrite bandsaw, and an equally cracking 10" table saw. Assuming you have the space both are nice to have, but I think allow about 5 feet min all around a T'saw and that means placed centrally in the workspace. A bandsaw is very useful against a wall. Mine has wheels so occasionally I can pull it out and open the front doors of the shop to rip really long bits (12 foot plus).
Douglas space would be my issue,unless I were to remove one of the benches I made in the summer,Im driving swimbo nuts with the workshop thing, :lol: when you say yours has wheels and can cut 12 foot plus do you mean the bandsaw ? :shock:
 

Digit

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As Douglas says you should be able to obtain both in reasonable sizes. The 5 ft all round would be nice Doug! I have the SIP 10 inch in a 2.5 mtre wide shop!
All my machines are on castors and I have a clear run through the door if needed as it should be understood Coder that a 6ft length of timber requires at least 16ft of workshop to machine on a TS. (Or an open doorway! :lol: )

Roy.
 

thecoder

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Digit":3tuxpzcs said:
As Douglas says you should be able to obtain both in reasonable sizes. The 5 ft all round would be nice Doug! I have the SIP 10 inch in a 2.5 mtre wide shop!
All my machines are on castors and I have a clear run through the door if needed as it should be understood Coder that a 6ft length of timber requires at least 16ft of workshop to machine on a TS. (Or an open doorway! :lol: )

Roy.
I have my planer/Thicknesser/current table saw on platforms with wheels that I can move around the shop,also in better weather my workshop doors open up so all can be wheeled outside.

One other thing that im kind of thinking is that if I can achieve possibly all I need with just one of the power tools mentioned,I could maybe invest the rest of the budget in better quality handtools. Just a thought #-o
 

condeesteso

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sorry Coder, yes the bandsaw occasionally rips 12 footers, but obviously I need over 24ft for that, hence the doors get opened. Biggest I can deal with on the T saw is about 10ft cross-cut, 8ft rip. I don't bother with boards, just pre-size with a handsaw or jigsaw, then use the Tsaw to clean up. I do find a sliding carriage on the Tsaw very handy indeed by the way. I would surely miss that item. That's one thing about the Scheppach TS2500 that I think is very good. Amusingly I got my 2500ci complete with sliding carriage, side table and outfeed table off ebay for £600 =D> =D> The guy selling it was a printer (oops, sorry).
 

Digit

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I could maybe invest the rest of the budget in better quality handtools.
Yes indeed, but without wishing to appear cheeky, do you have the skills to achieve the accuracy that a machine can achieve?
Better quality hand tools? Yes, but have you considered that many of them can also be home made?
All my planes, for example, are home made in timber, and you will find that I am not alone on this forum in that respect. My chisels are all good quality bought from car boot sales, a good quality plane that you do not have the ability to sharpen is as much use as a chocolate fire guard!
To me a mix of machine and hand tools is the ideal, I lost my enthusiam for roughing with a scrub plane some years ago!

Roy.
 

thecoder

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Digit":2nmguj7z said:
I could maybe invest the rest of the budget in better quality handtools.
Yes indeed, but without wishing to appear cheeky, do you have the skills to achieve the accuracy that a machine can achieve?
Better quality hand tools? Yes, but have you considered that many of them can also be home made?
All my planes, for example, are home made in timber, and you will find that I am not alone on this forum in that respect. My chisels are all good quality bought from car boot sales, a good quality plane that you do not have the ability to sharpen is as much use as a chocolate fire guard!
To me a mix of machine and hand tools is the ideal, I lost my enthusiam for roughing with a scrub plane some years ago!

Roy.
No not cheaky at all Roy it is fair comment and one I will take on board , Im definately a 1000 miles away from making my own planes and tools,I do recognise the craftmanship and skill that people who do that have..Actually my most used hand plane was one I got from a forum member on here who sharpened it very nicely :D
 

thecoder

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condeesteso":1vxhb8le said:
Ooooh!!, bang on budget too. A Hammer N4400 bandsaw. I want one so surely everyone else does too?? But more sensibly £1500 would get you a cracking 2nd hand Startrite bandsaw, and an equally cracking 10" table saw. Assuming you have the space both are nice to have, but I think allow about 5 feet min all around a T'saw and that means placed centrally in the workspace. A bandsaw is very useful against a wall. Mine has wheels so occasionally I can pull it out and open the front doors of the shop to rip really long bits (12 foot plus).

Hi Douglas ....I think ive just found the answer to my question.....just need to get the SWMBO onboard #-o

Take a look at this baby .....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16Nhq5swos8 \:D/
 

condeesteso

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Yes Coder, seen it already. Damn, that's a part of what sold me. I am really quite certain this is the one I 'need'. And seriously the word inside is they are underpriced, meaning more engineering for the money.
Now, back in the real world: a second-hand Startrite (352 prob) bu: £400 absolute tops, a Tsaw (10" Scheppach, maybe Record, maybe Elektra B...) bu: £550. Leaves about £550 for planes off ebay, at an average £30 each makes about 17 of 'em. And wifey likes that cos every single one will sell for what it cost. It's like saving with the Co-op. Maybe 13 planes, a saw and 2 chisels - you'll look right proper then :lol:
Sorted. See, wasn't hard.
 

Mike Wingate

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I bought second hand almost unused Startrite 352 about 19 years ago. With a range of good blades it is a good all rounder.
 

kostello

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thecoder":1epu4dog said:
I could maybe invest the rest of the budget in better quality handtools. Just a thought #-o
which reminds me of a trip to the axminster shop in high wycombe in september..................

it was full of new students who had just started at the university on the furniture making course...........................

they had their shopping lists.....................and were busy buying lie nielsen planes...................

i didn't have the heart to tell them that it would be a good while before a £300 plane would make that much difference to their work..............


:D
 

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Not seen the Hammer N4400 up close but it looks to copy a lot of the features of similar size Startrite/Record machines. Looking at the prices that they seem to go for I reckon you may be better off with a good second hand startrite. We have several at work and I think they're hard to beat.
 

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As has already been said; you can do a lot with a well set-up bandsaw and the right selection of blades. You may even find that you can get buy without a space-hungry table saw for some time. If ever you need to cut sheet materials, it's often easier to lay them down flat and cut them with a circular saw and guide or track (for the initial cuts, at the very least). There's almost no risk of kickback with a bandsaw and you'll find that most have a greater working height than your average table saw. I see this as an advantage, as it means longer lengths of timber may clear any benches or other machines in your workshop. That's also the reason I like having a sliding mitre saw for crosscuts. Table saws need to be much lower for comfortable working and handling. But then, they need a good amount of space on both the in and outfeed.
 

woodbloke

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OPJ":15s8gkw8 said:
As has already been said; you can do a lot with a well set-up bandsaw and the right selection of blades. You may even find that you can get buy without a space-hungry table saw for some time. If ever you need to cut sheet materials, it's often easier to lay them down flat and cut them with a circular saw and guide or track (for the initial cuts, at the very least). There's almost no risk of kickback with a bandsaw and you'll find that most have a greater working height than your average table saw. I see this as an advantage, as it means longer lengths of timber may clear any benches or other machines in your workshop. That's also the reason I like having a sliding mitre saw for crosscuts. Table saws need to be much lower for comfortable working and handling. But then, they need a good amount of space on both the in and outfeed.
The OP mentions that he's converting a garage, but doesn't say (unless I've missed it) if it's a singly or double. If it's a single, then Olly's advice is sound in my view. If it's a double, then you ought to consider both a table saw and b/s. My 'shop is slightly less than a double and I've got a Charnwood W650 (now severely fettled :-" with yet more mods that are a WIP) a Startrite 352E with M42 Tuffblade and I've managed to keep my original Euro 260 bandsaw. Bandsaws incredibly useful machines, but by the same token, so are tablesaurs and I wouldn't want to be without either. With your budget, you could easily go for both, but don't forget to make an allowance for extraction from the machine(s)
Edit - if you go for the Hammer b/s, look very carefully at the main tensioning spring as it's this that determines the size of the blade that the machine will take and more importantly...tension! I had a look at similar sized S352 vs Record machines at Yandles earlier in the year and the spring on the Record machines was puny compared to the Strartrite - Rob
 

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