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Digit

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I see the public forums are filling again with, 'so and so water authority should sort their leaks,' etc.
Sounds sensible. But is it I wonder?
Most city premises were originally built on green field sites, over the years the roads and pathways have effectively been waterproofed and drains installed to remove any rain fall. With the advent of the motor car we are seeing more and more front gardens turned into parking lots, and again waterproofed.
Not only has this increased the load on what is essentially a Victorian structure of water removal, but it has also increased the rate at which precipitation now reaches our rivers, which makes flood control that much more difficult.
What has this to do with water leaks? Stopping those leaks would now result in a level of ground shrinkage that could have serious effects on foundations etc. Perhaps we should be careful what we wish for.

Roy.
 

Phil Pascoe

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A lot of the shortages are in the S.E.- they are paying the penalty for decades of money being pumped into that area - hence it's over populated because that's where the money is. And thats where more money will be spent, because that's where the money is "generated". And then more people move there - because that's where the money is. Then there is a shortage of water. No pineapple Sherlock!
Maybe if the government--any government--actually noticed that the U.K. consisted of more than London & the S.E. we would not have so many problems.
Incidentally I have just received my water rates--£1137,94-- for a band c house. We do not waste water, and we would pay more if we were metered. This is in Cornwall-- one of wettest places in the U.K..
 

Digit

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Yep! Crazy ain't it?
We have here, according to government statistics, one of the highest leakage rates in the UK. Leakage rate? ie water lost as a percentage of water distributed, I don't doubt that that is correct and somebody probably got a pay rise for working that out.
But what is ignored is the number of consumers per mile of pipe! We have have a farm opposite me that is nearly two miles from the main road!
Another statistic is that we have the lowest compliance with targets for emergency response. Some nut decided that 8 minutes was a reasonable national target, without a grid reference just finding an accident scene can be a nightmare round here.
I'll hazard a guess that if the leaks in London were cured half the street trees would die!

Roy.
 

Blister

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I have soak aways in my front and rear gardens for rain water
 

Digit

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Some people will have of course, but in the City it's basically 1000s of acres of waterproof roofs, roads and paths. There have even been appeal to people to stop tarmacing their drives.
The whole of the SE is sinking due to isostatic rebound, but London is worse due to drying out. Water is even being pumped into underground aquifers to help re-balance the equation.
People worry about GW and sea level rises, but London is going down much faster than sea levels are going up! The Embankment has been steadily raised over the last hundred and fifty years to compensate.

Roy.
 

theturner

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I think you can also look at the moorlands.they have
been drained so the idle rich can keep their boots clean
when out shooting the poor little birds.
Roger. :twisted:
 

Digit

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One would have to question what the moors would be like without the shooting enthusiasts though. The Moors are a construct from many years of farming and shooting, originally they were forested.
People assume that the Moors are 'Wild.' They ain't!

Roy.
 

flying haggis

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Some people will have of course, but in the City it's basically 1000s of acres of waterproof roofs, roads and paths. There have even been appeal to people to stop tarmacing their drives.

I think you now need to apply for planning permission if you intend to put in a non water permeable driveway
 

Digit

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So I understand, this was introduced to combat run off into the drains and eventually the rivers.

Roy.
 

theturner

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Digit":25l0chj3 said:
One would have to question what the moors would be like without the shooting enthusiasts though. The Moors are a construct from many years of farming and shooting, originally they were forested.
People assume that the Moors are 'Wild.' They ain't!

Roy.
This dose not alter the fact that the moors were the sponge that soaked up the water and fed it down to the water table.
That water now is diverted to rivers and so is lost. :shock:
Roger
 

Digit

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I quite agree, drainage also has the affect of dumping large quantities of water into rivers in a short time period, where once the time taken for rainfall to reach a water course was days, it can now be minutes.
This causes very rapid rises in river levels and subsequent flooding down stream. In Germany extensive drainage in the upper reaches of the Rhine caused significant flood damage in Holland, now Germany is actively reinstating your 'sponges.'
Lesson learned.
One of the dangers that London faces will not be prevented by the Barrier, in fact the Barrier would make it worse, and that is the scenario of the Barrier closed and heavy rain fall on the city. Within minutes the river level behind the barrier will start to rise, because the spong has been built over.

Roy.
 

Benchwayze

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No chance our lot will learn anything; except how to turn the screw. They'll just blame Global Warming, and say we caused the Global Warming, and levy a new tax.

Either way, the populace pay! :evil:
 

Benchwayze

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Digit":leeufsr0 said:
One would have to question what the moors would be like without the shooting enthusiasts though. The Moors are a construct from many years of farming and shooting, originally they were forested.
People assume that the Moors are 'Wild.' They ain't!

Roy.
Trees can process a heck of a lot of water. The railways learned this a few years ago when they 'thinned' out trees on embankments, to help avoid 'leaves on the lines'. The embankments turned to mud and slid over the lines! :roll:
 

Digit

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Yep! And if you think of city trees, tarmac upto the Bole, where do they get all their water from?
These leaks that press loves to go on about everytime we have a drought, are in most cases very small, they never reach the surface. The same people complaining about the leaks would also complain equally loudly if the water companies dug up the length of their street and replaced the pipework with modern flexible pipes and re-made each and every domestic connections.
Also it's worth asking how much of the lost water is lost within those people's bounderies, for which they are responsible.

Roy.
 

dickm

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Keep on leaking, London - then in the end you'll have to take up Alec Salmond's offer to sell you some of our water!
 

cambournepete

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phil.p":31hs7qtm said:
Incidentally I have just received my water rates--£1137,94-- for a band c house.
How much!!!!!!!!!!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:

I'm in a 4-bed detached house on a meter just outside Cambridge and pay ~£360/year.
Why do you think you'd pay more on a meter?
 

Phil Pascoe

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Pete-- we've checked it out over the years, and every time it comes out as more! Useing water board information and a fairly conservative estimate we would be paying a couple of hundred more, and this is also borne out by friends in similar circumstances who are on meters.
Don't forget, the S.W. is caned for cleaning up the beaches ( a very large % of that problem being caused by passing shipping, which ,of course, is little to do with us) We have no political clout- a small population and party poodles for M.P.s -imagine if a water board said to the people of London (for some spurious reason) oh, by the way, we're going to charge you 3x what the rest of the country is paying!
 

Benchwayze

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No meter for us. Yet! :|

We pay a tariff, related to the 'rateable' value of the house. (Regardless of the fact that Rates are Ancient History, and the 'Rateable Value' means pineapples.) I don't want a water meter, for a simple reason. It's not on to expect us to pay for something that falls from the sky for nothing.

I will pay for the convenience of having it collected and piped to me, and no objection. But until the 'powers' that be say I HAVE to pay for what I use, I will stay as I am thanks! All of these wonderful schemes, and bright ideas have one purpose. Squeezing every last penny from us. :evil:
 

Harbo

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I've just applied to go onto a meter - the planned installation for our village over according to the Water Co. is 2014/15!
By applying direct you can get it sooner?
We already have a new box in the footway ready for meters when our jammed stopcock was replaced a couple of years ago.
There's only two of us in the house, most of the time, so hopefully it will come down from the £800 we pay?

Planning Regs are already in place to reduce surface run-off with the use of soakaways, storage ponds, ditches, porous surfaces etc etc.
But what is really needed is a National Distribution Network similar to the Electricity National Grid?

Rod
 

Digit

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The problem with that Rod is that water is incredibly heavy to move in volume, and the SE uses a lot of water!
In the past it has been suggested that the canal system be used, but what ever method is suggested it would be very, very expensive. London already has a desalination plant BTW.

Roy.
 

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