very early jack plane

[richarnold]

Hi, I notice there has been some discussion about scrub planes of late. I'm not sure when they first appeared, but as far as I know, there is no reference to them in the 18th century. I can only presume that all the rough work was done with the jack plane. As planes go the jack must have had the hardest life of any plane, and subsequently early examples just don't crop up. I have always been led to belive that the early jacks not only had a heavily cambered iron, but that the sole was also similarly shaped. Last week i had the chance to visit my old friend, Brian Jackson, and he had very kindly been saving a plane for me for some time. Brian knows what a nutter I am when it comes to early planes, but i don't think he had any idea how pleased I would be with this one. I know some people wouldn't give this house room, but to me it just screams history, and more importantly some long forgotten craftsmans love of a plane that he just could not let go off. Have you ever had a pair of shoes, or boots that are so far past there sell by date, but are so comfortable, that you carry on wearing them long after they should have been in the bin?. Well i feel this plane must have been a bit like that for our long dead craftsman. This plane proberbly started off being about 3 inches deep, but it's only about 1 5/8 at the toe end now!!. The patina, and wear patterns where he held the plane are just incredible. after cleaning the pane in the workshop today, I couldn't resist just giving this old boy one last work out. I found a nice peice of redwood, set the blade, didn't even sharpen it, and just ripped through that softwood as though it was butter. After that, I locked up the workshop, and drove home, feeling happier than i have in a long time. So a big thank you to Brian, and to a long forgotten craftsman for not consigning this one to the log pile.

 

[Jacob]

It just needs a new sole and it'll be good for another 100 years.

http://www.woodworkuk.co.uk/forum/viewt ... f=5&t=1351

 

[AndyT]

Nice one Richard. I think your 'favourite shoes' analogy is just right - it must have fitted its owner's hands as if it was part of his body.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Interesting that the Seaton toolchest (of 1797) contains two jack planes, one with a single iron and one with a double iron. There is nothing that could be interpreted as a scrub plane (or bismarck plane) in either the chest or the inventory found with it, though the inventory did mention a 'fore' plane, no longer in the chest. That could suggest that the jack did the preliminary heavy stock removal. Given the lack of machinery at that time, it would be a very necessary piece of kit.

The sole shape of Richard's plane suggests that it was indeed an 18th century/early 19th century 'scrub' equivalent. It just oozes history, even in the photo.

 

[jimi43]

Made my day Richard!

A real beauty and a worker too! I would give it a workout every time the need arose!

Thanks mate!

Jim

 

[Vann]

It looks like it's been torpedoed, and is slowly going down bow first :mrgreen:

But seriously - nice find.

Cheers, Vann.

 

[Tom K]

It looks like it's been torpedoed, and is slowly going down bow first :mrgreen:

But seriously - nice find.

Cheers, Vann.

Fallen victim to the Bismark perhaps

 

[bugbear]

Interesting that the Seaton toolchest (of 1797) contains two jack planes, one with a single iron and one with a double iron. There is nothing that could be interpreted as a scrub plane (or bismarck plane) in either the chest or the inventory found with it, though the inventory did mention a 'fore' plane, no longer in the chest. That could suggest that the jack did the preliminary heavy stock removal. Given the lack of machinery at that time, it would be a very necessary piece of kit.

The sole shape of Richard's plane suggests that it was indeed an 18th century/early 19th century 'scrub' equivalent. It just oozes history, even in the photo.

Indeed. I have seen references to the efficacy in use of a rounded sole combined with a heavily cambered blade elsewhere.

I can offer a caveat on interpreting written references when looking for evidence of scrub planes. These illustrations are from a 1925 Melhush catalogue.

I'm guessing "105W" is not the image that would spring to mind if you saw the word "jack" in textual form.

BugBear

 

[AndyT]

That's really interesting BB. Clearly two different tools with the same name. One has a narrow blade, a short body and a peg or horn to grab hold of - so it's what we have been calling a Bismarck or scrub plane, optimised for taking short but very thick shavings for tasks such as rapidly levelling a cleft board. (I'm assuming the owner would have known to camber the blade.)

The other jack plane - the really common sort - would have been for preliminary sizing of stock and would be capable of taking a thickish shaving - but not as thick as the 105W, just because its wider blade made it harder to push.

I guess it's further proof that there is rarely a nice clear 1-to-1 relationship between words and things!

Edit - further thoughts:

I reckon that Melhuish catalogue picture was drawn wrong. It has the peg on top when it should be down on the step. Compare these two images - this is from Wells and Hooper in 1910 and includes at Fig 7 what they call a "Bismarck or roughing plane" - with the intended reader a potential Melhuish customer.

and this is a similar one on ebay, described as German by the seller:

 

[bugbear]

I'm not so sure - the pictures you show would seem an excellent match for Melhuish's ram's horn offering.

BugBear

 

[AndyT]

I'm not so sure - the pictures you show would seem an excellent match for Melhuish's ram's horn offering.

BugBear

Agreed, but it just looks so odd to put the 'peg' up on the top, when the natural place for it is on the step (or why else cut the step at all)?

So, can anyone find a real plane or photo of one with the peg on top as in the Melhuish catalogue?

 

[jimi43]

............Fallen victim to the Bismark perhaps

Took a while for me that one! Excellent and subtle!! Nice one Tom!

=D> =D> =D>

Jim

 

[jimi43]

Got the text on the Meluish poster Prof?

I'm interested in the description for 8 and 9....

These are Spiers or another maker?

Jim

 

[AndyT]

Got the text on the Meluish poster Prof?

I'm interested in the description for 8 and 9....

These are Spiers or another maker?

Jim

Just read ahead on-line

http://www.archive.org/stream/moderncabinetwor01well#page/8/mode/2up

or download the whole book to your PC or tablet!

http://openlibrary.org/books/OL14122535M/Modern_cabinetwork_furniture_fitments

(They are just generic designs, with no mention of makers' names.)

 

[Richard T]

Interesting to see Richard, that the sole is worn round (or deliberately cut?) to follow the camber of the iron.

I regularly use a wide, ( approx 1 - 1/4") wooden round plane for small area scrubbing. I can tilt it all over the place to use more or less of the edge. Anyone else succumbed to this nasty habit?

 

[bugbear]

Interesting to see Richard, that the sole is worn round (or deliberately cut?) to follow the camber of the iron.

Actually, that's an interesting point - does the sole match the iron, or are the effective cambers different?

BugBear

 

[richarnold]

Interesting to see Richard, that the sole is worn round (or deliberately cut?) to follow the camber of the iron.

Actually, that's an interesting point - does the sole match the iron, or are the effective cambers different?

BugBear

Just to let you know, the sole does match the profile of the iron. This is the first surviving example of this earlier style of jack plane that I have ever seen. One of the reasons why it was so special to me. Michael Dunbar's book, "antique woodworking tools", describes this type of plane, and he explains the move from a cambered sole to a square one coming about due to the improved sawing of timber. With the planks being sawn to a much more acurate dimension, the heavy cut of a cambered plane was no longer needed. This is an American viewpoint, but I can't see that it would have been any different over here. I notice that the two Jacks in the seaton chest both have square soles, so even by the end of the 18th century it appears this style of plane was obsolete. I forgot to mention that the handle is also heavily off set. another early feature

 

[jimi43]

So....just to stop some confusion in my poor brain...the words "saving up for me"....was that just to show you or did you buy it?

Not that it matters as I'm sure that Brian and your good self frequent the same venues and that is likely to be where I next see you...and the plane I hope?

Cheers

Jim

 

[bugbear]

Interesting to see Richard, that the sole is worn round (or deliberately cut?) to follow the camber of the iron.

Actually, that's an interesting point - does the sole match the iron, or are the effective cambers different?

BugBear

Just to let you know, the sole does match the profile of the iron.

Thank you. The reason I asked is that I know of a scrub design where the camber of the sole is less than that of the iron. This has the effect that the cut is less at the edges than in the centre. Depth of cut than then be varied "on the fly" by simply tilting the plane on its long axis.

BugBear

 

[richarnold]

So....just to stop some confusion in my poor brain...the words "saving up for me"....was that just to show you or did you buy it?

Not that it matters as I'm sure that Brian and your good self frequent the same venues and that is likely to be where I next see you...and the plane I hope?

Cheers

Jim

Sorry for the confusion. Brian being the the nice chap he is, kindly gave me the plane As he rightly said, there are not that many people out there who would get so exited about a very battered bit of wormy beech as me!!
Both myself, and Brian will be at the next MAC open day, and I'm sure the jack plane will put in an appearance to