Uni Education and student loans

[Chris152]

Matt
Is it an option for him to try to get a job somewhere in the sector - at whatever level - with a view to getting a feel for it, before making a decision which route to go down? Lots of people head straight to university as if there was some great rush, but the reality for most people is that there isn't. Whatever happens, if he decides university is the way to go, a year or two working in the sector would probably only be a good thing. My son wants to be an engineer, and this is what I'll be encouraging him to do.
Chris

 

[jw00d]

jamie, great info, thank you

the issue I have here is that on a personal basis I have a level of tenacity that my son/ his Mum dont even begin to touch!. I realise that making the right choice is entirely possible but it needs an awful lot of work in order to do so. The more I go on about it all the more peoples eyes seem to glaze over! I seem to be surrounded by people who want to skim over the surface of things and expect it all to fall into place and . Many of my sons mates wont even go the Uni open days for gods sake. Most frustrating :roll:

The link to Pearson looks interesting - I'll look into that....

No problem Matt...

Yup whatever route he chooses you should let him know that a creative job will take a hell of a lot of work to turn into a decent career, even if you're extremely talented, so you've got to be ready for that. It's the catch 22 of needing experience to get a job but can't get a job without experience. As someone else mentioned, with Uni's churning out new batches of graduates each year, and more and more Uni's doing animation/games design courses the competition for jobs is huge, I certainly wouldn't like to have to start again from scratch these days!

 

[Jacob]

Funny how people slag off media studies. It's actually a mega employer.

Certainly- but that doesn't alter the fact that we are paying to train hundreds of thousands of people who will never work in it or will work in it but in fields that don't require a degree anyway.

Basically, training is a good idea.
It's surprising having to argue for it in this day and age.
Anybody out there wondering about doing a course of any sort; go for it, take no notice of the nay sayers. It could change your life.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Education is a good idea. Expensive poor quality training for non existent jobs isn't.

 

[Jacob]

Education is a good idea. Expensive poor quality training for non existent jobs isn't.

Well obviously. Logical - but you haven't said anything remotely interesting.

 

[finneyb]

BBC Radio 4 You & Yours Tuesday 12.15 or on Radio iPlayer Was your degree worth it ?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b09hp2hs

Brian

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Education is a good idea. Expensive poor quality training for non existent jobs isn't.

Well obviously. Logical - but you haven't said anything remotely interesting.

That sentiment is mutual, I can assure you.

 

[AES]

Jacob wrote, QUOTE: Well obviously. Logical - but you haven't said anything remotely interesting. UNQUOTE:

My reply: Neither have you Jacob - but have simply taken the first opportunity to jump back on to the old socialistic diatribe soapbox - just as you so often do here!!!!!!!

WHY oh WHY can't you, in this case, as in so many other instances, just look at the OP's clear need for other people's HELPFUL opinions and experiences of what is for him clearly a difficult dilemma, instead of just, as so often in the past, mouthing the same old claptrap time after time after time?

And slanging me off for this post will NOT be in any way a useful answer Jacob. Changing your posting ways just might!!!!

AES

 

[Glynne]

Don’t you just love the season of peace on earth and goodwill to all men?

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Bah humbug!!!!!!!! :lol:

 

[Jacob]

Jacob wrote, QUOTE: Well obviously. Logical - but you haven't said anything remotely interesting. UNQUOTE:

My reply: Neither have you Jacob - but have simply taken the first opportunity to jump back on to the old socialistic diatribe soapbox - just as you so often do here!!!!!!!

WHY oh WHY can't you, in this case, as in so many other instances, just look at the OP's clear need for other people's HELPFUL opinions and experiences of what is for him clearly a difficult dilemma, instead of just, as so often in the past, mouthing the same old claptrap time after time after time?

And slanging me off for this post will NOT be in any way a useful answer Jacob. Changing your posting ways just might!!!!

AES

I just scrolled back - I can't see anything I said as being particularly left wing.

The answer to the OP's dilemma is to support his son's application 100% in spite of the appalling grant system.
He may not get another chance.
The debt won't be repayable unless he earns quite a lot of dosh and in the meantime things might have become a bit more civilised with fewer disincentives to higher education.

PS apologies for mentioning the idea of free education for all - I realise it's a bit too "socialistic" for some! :lol:
But it's a good investment - even third world countries have cottoned and are developing better education services than we have. Most of Europe is more advanced - the UK is getting left behind. It isn't socialism it's just common sense.

PPS My 3 kids all got degrees (and 2nd degrees) in arts and media subjects. One of them is doing a PhD. They have all been fully employed in useful jobs since they left university. They will never be out of work!

 

[AES]

@Jacob: You wrote, QUOTE: The answer to the OP's dilemma is to support his son 100% in spite of the appalling grant system. He may not get another chance. The debt won't be repayable unless he earns quite a lot of dosh and in the meantime things might have become a bit more civilised with fewer disincentives to higher education. UNQUOTE:

Well, we're getting there with you Jacob, well done indeed. Especially if we can change your first word above QUOTE: The ... UNQUOTE: to "MAY" !

I'll ignore the rest Jacob as being, at the very least, irrelevant.

To the point. Just as you say, an awful will depend on whether or not the present funding system changes - something that both you and I MAY well hope for, but which obviously, neither of us, nor anyone else, can know for certain.

But to me, the crux of the OP's dilemma is whether or not going to Uni is the BEST form of training/education (NOT the same thing BTW Jacob) that his son needs.

Not having been to Uni myself (like you I guess, we're of a similar age Jacob?) I don't think I'm in a position to offer the OP any practical/useful advice. So I haven't offered any (but I do wish you and your son all the best in getting to where you both want to be Matt).

I do think however that by doing the rounds of questioning everyone - even including all us here - you're certainly doing everything reasonably possible to arrive at the "right" conclusion Matt.

So good luck with it.

The only thing in all this that really does concern me however is that from all I hear about UK these days (not lived there for over 25 years) is that APPARENTLY, unless you've got a degree of some sort to show, many companies (or their HR Depts) won't even start to consider you at all. If that really is so, then "shame on you all" I say.

AES

 

[Jacob]

@Jacob: You wrote, QUOTE: The answer to the OP's dilemma is to support his son 100% in spite of the appalling grant system. He may not get another chance. The debt won't be repayable unless he earns quite a lot of dosh and in the meantime things might have become a bit more civilised with fewer disincentives to higher education. UNQUOTE:

Well, we're getting there with you Jacob, well done indeed. Especially if we can change your first word above QUOTE: The ... UNQUOTE: to "MAY" !

Just as you say, an awful will depend on whether or not the present funding system changes - something that both you and I MAY well hope for, but which obviously, neither of us, nor anyone else, can know for certain.

But to me, the crux of the OP's dilemma is whether or not going to Uni is the BEST form of training/education (NOT the same thing BTW Jacob) that his son needs.

Not having been to Uni myself (like you I guess, we're of a similar age Jacob?) I don't think I'm in a position to offer the OP any practical/useful advice. So I haven't offered any (but I do wish you and your son all the best in getting to where you both want to be Matt).

I do think however that by doing the rounds of questioning everyone - even including all us here - you're certainly doing everything reasonably possible to arrive at the "right" conclusion Matt.

So good luck with it.

The only thing in all this that really does concern me however is that from all I hear about UK these days (not lived there for over 25 years) is that APPARENTLY, unless you've got a degree of some sort to show, many companies (or their HR Depts) won't even start to consider you at all. If that really is so, then "shame on you all" I say.

AES

The OP could ask himself - does he have such a low opinion of his son's abilities that he thinks the opportunity would be wasted and the place better given to someone else?

 

[AES]

Off the point yet again Jacob. Leopards and spots and all that.

Bye bye.

AES

 

[Inoffthered]

PS apologies for mentioning the idea of free education for all - I realise it's a bit too "socialistic" for some! :lol:
But it's a good investment - even third world countries have cottoned and are developing better education services than we have.

Of course, university and higher education used to be free, tuition fees were reintroduced by the socialist government of a certain Anthony Charles Lynton Blair.

 

[Jacob]

PS apologies for mentioning the idea of free education for all - I realise it's a bit too "socialistic" for some! :lol:
But it's a good investment - even third world countries have cottoned and are developing better education services than we have.

Of course, university and higher education used to be free, tuition fees were reintroduced by the socialist government of a certain Anthony Charles Lynton Blair.

So what? What difference does that make?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuition_f ... ed_Kingdom

NB It wasn't me that introduced a political theme to this thread - it was our Roger and AES, huffing and puffing! All their fault if it goes off the rails. :lol:

 

[Matt@]

@Jacob: You wrote, QUOTE: The answer to the OP's dilemma is to support his son 100% in spite of the appalling grant system. He may not get another chance. The debt won't be repayable unless he earns quite a lot of dosh and in the meantime things might have become a bit more civilised with fewer disincentives to higher education. UNQUOTE:

Well, we're getting there with you Jacob, well done indeed. Especially if we can change your first word above QUOTE: The ... UNQUOTE: to "MAY" !

Just as you say, an awful will depend on whether or not the present funding system changes - something that both you and I MAY well hope for, but which obviously, neither of us, nor anyone else, can know for certain.

But to me, the crux of the OP's dilemma is whether or not going to Uni is the BEST form of training/education (NOT the same thing BTW Jacob) that his son needs.

Not having been to Uni myself (like you I guess, we're of a similar age Jacob?) I don't think I'm in a position to offer the OP any practical/useful advice. So I haven't offered any (but I do wish you and your son all the best in getting to where you both want to be Matt).

I do think however that by doing the rounds of questioning everyone - even including all us here - you're certainly doing everything reasonably possible to arrive at the "right" conclusion Matt.

So good luck with it.

The only thing in all this that really does concern me however is that from all I hear about UK these days (not lived there for over 25 years) is that APPARENTLY, unless you've got a degree of some sort to show, many companies (or their HR Depts) won't even start to consider you at all. If that really is so, then "shame on you all" I say.

AES

The OP could ask himself - does he have such a low opinion of his son's abilities that he thinks the opportunity would be wasted and the place better given to someone else?

you need to swot up on what the Uni system is providing to our young people circa 2017. Do you actually know? Quite a few quotes on this thread from people that have direct experience of whats on offer - not the hearsay and predjudice as you seem to be implying. As to what my opinion is of my son what the hell business has it got to with you but I'll answer you anyway. He is highly talented, motivated and focused and I want whats best for him. Again, read of peoples experiences on this thread to find out why I am mindful that he might be short changed if he makes the wrong decision.

 

[Jacob]

....
you need to swot up on what the Uni system is providing to our young people circa 2017. Do you actually know?..

All my kids have recently (last 20 years or less) been through higher ed. One of them is a university lecturer, now doing a PhD. First grandchild is half way through his 1st degree - started in Lancaster Uni now spending a year at Lyon Uni (France).
It would have been criminal to stand in their way!!
Yes the debt looms over them - but soddit there is no alternative at the moment.
We not well off - very little subsidy from parents or grandparents - but plenty of moral support.
This is not a new problem - years ago when free state education started being available you'd get "he'd be better off darn't pit wiv me and his grandad"
Plus ça change plus c'est la même chose!!

He is highly talented, motivated and focused and I want whats best for him.

In which case I'd take advice from his lecturers - with all due respect they probably know more about higher ed than you or me.
Take no notice of the miserable moaning nay-sayers!!
20 years down the line - would your lad be glad that you stopped him going to Uni?

 

[Matt@]

pertinent to my son, its the discussion in this article that has pricked my attention, though I realise its 4 yrs old. http://uk.ign.com/articles/2013/04/02/i ... ideo-games

So after reading the article, would you agree that its possible he could a get on a course that will let him down?

edit
or are you saying ANY further education is good education?

But I acknowledge this thread is more general and about Uni and loans. Still it does tie in with the above to some extent.....

 

[Jacob]

You just have to get the best advice you can - there are no guarantees. His lecturers will be concerned about his prospects. I'd listen to them. They don't get a bonus for sending him off to a course which would be no good!