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AndyT

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That drawer front looks a bit thicker than your usual elegant proportions Rob... and did you have to leave such a clear marking out line? ;)
 

TheTiddles

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Marking out lines on drawer sides are like leaving tailor’s chalk on your suit.

There is a way to do that compartment without the scribe line, though I’m planning on routing the slide into the drawer side too (maybe) so maybe it’s not for everyone

Aidan
 

MikeG.

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TheTiddles":20us2aw6 said:
Marking out lines on drawer sides are like leaving tailor’s chalk on your suit........

You don't see tailor's chalk on suits, but you see scribe lines on drawer dovetails all the time in antique shops and auction rooms.
 

Sheffield Tony

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Which is interesting; one of the approaches to making a really snug drawer (see, heading back on topic) that I've seen recommended is to make the front fit precisely, then make the sides out of slightly oversized (thickness wise) stock, then plane the sides of the finished drawer down to match the front. If the scribe lines show, then it wasn't done that way.
 

Andy Kev.

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What I think is an absolute revelation is that the join is invisible after cutting the draw front out on a table saw. I would have thought that the kerf would simply have been too wide and I would have assumed that the use of some fiendishly fine, probably Japanese, backsaw would have been necessary for that cut.

Did you have a confidence in advance that the results would be effectively invisible? (Probably a daft question; I suppose you must have.)
 

Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)

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Andy, my reasoning was this: I could cut with a Japanese saw, which leaves a fine surface and a fine kerf. But I am still going to have to shoot the ends to ensure that they are perfectly square to one another - that is, both sides. That can add up to a wider kerf. So, go for the table saw, which will leave a fine and square cut with a predictable cut/kerf.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't. :)

The other factor is one of planning. Planning the cutting, that is. It is an illusion that there are three possible kerfs. Or two, if just thinking about the drawer. There are, in fact, no kerfs to worry about (if the saw cuts are perfectly straight): as you cut one side, the next piece is butted against it, and so on. No gaps. What you have to worry about is the effect on the figure. Can you get away with it - will the figure tell the story? Answer: look where you are cutting.

Regards from Perth

Derek
 

MikeG.

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Sheffield Tony":ao9r4fex said:
Which is interesting; one of the approaches to making a really snug drawer (see, heading back on topic) that I've seen recommended is to make the front fit precisely, then make the sides out of slightly oversized (thickness wise) stock, then plane the sides of the finished drawer down to match the front. If the scribe lines show, then it wasn't done that way.

I think cabinet makers of old, particularly those making "country furniture", didn't aim for such a snug fit as we do these days.
 

Andy Kev.

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Andy, my reasoning was this: I could cut with a Japanese saw, which leaves a fine surface and a fine kerf. But I am still going to have to shoot the ends to ensure that they are perfectly square to one another - that is, both sides. That can add up to a wider kerf. So, go for the table saw, which will leave a fine and square cut with a predictable cut/kerf.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't. :)

The other factor is one of planning. Planning the cutting, that is. It is an illusion that there are three possible kerfs. Or two, if just thinking about the drawer. There are, in fact, no kerfs to worry about (if the saw cuts are perfectly straight): as you cut one side, the next piece is butted against it, and so on. No gaps. What you have to worry about is the effect on the figure. Can you get away with it - will the figure tell the story? Answer: look where you are cutting.

Regards from Perth

Derek
Ahhh … I see! (I imagine you can here the penny dropping even at this distance.) The implication is that with something that has dead straight grain, the cut can be done without too much worry but with something like that jarrah, it's a matter of pick your spot carefully.
 

Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)

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Andy, that is the other issue: shooting Jarrah ... it is brittle and the likelihood is spelching rather than a clean edge which will disappear.

Regards from Perth

Derek
 

NickM

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Andy, my reasoning was this: I could cut with a Japanese saw, which leaves a fine surface and a fine kerf. But I am still going to have to shoot the ends to ensure that they are perfectly square to one another - that is, both sides. That can add up to a wider kerf. So, go for the table saw, which will leave a fine and square cut with a predictable cut/kerf.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't. :)

The other factor is one of planning. Planning the cutting, that is. It is an illusion that there are three possible kerfs. Or two, if just thinking about the drawer. There are, in fact, no kerfs to worry about (if the saw cuts are perfectly straight): as you cut one side, the next piece is butted against it, and so on. No gaps. What you have to worry about is the effect on the figure. Can you get away with it - will the figure tell the story? Answer: look where you are cutting.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I used the same technique for the art desk I made (WIP on here somewhere), the main difference being that the apron continued under the drawer so I had to rip it into three pieces before cross cutting the drawer.

I wasn't trying to make mine invisible, I just wanted the drawer to have a similar colour grain pattern so it didn't "clash" with the rest of the apron. Cutting it out of the apron is the easiest way of doing it.

I also used a table saw (although I think I also shot the ends), and I was surprised how invisible the drawer looked. It didn't end up looking invisible because I fitted the drawer with a small gap, but I think I could have got it invisible if I had really tried.

Rob Cosman did a good series on making this kind of drawer recently. It was incredible the lengths he would go to in order to get the perfect fit (including using 1 thou shim to find the "high" spot). He also had a few foul ups along the way so it was instructive on how to recover from mistakes.

The table looks fantastic Derek. I hope the customer likes it!
 

Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)

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There are four parts to the drawer build: the drawer size and design, the drawer case, fitting the drawer case, and the drawer.

Part 1 described the drawer size and design, and the apron of the drawer case. Part 2 describes the rest.

We ended Part 1 here. That is the apron and opening to the drawer case ..

Sunday4.jpg


This is where the build ended ...

14a.jpg


The drawer case and its fitting

I scratched my head for a week how to do this. How to get the case to support drawer blades. I did not want a heavy, complicated arrangement, one which ran the danger of protruding below the table and might be seen at a distance. It needed to be lean and mean. To be elegant. A design to be appreciated by myself and you. This is what I came up with ..

The case sides were grooved 3mm (1/8") ...

4a.jpg


.. and matched with a rebated section which would form the 6mm (~1/4") thick drawer blade ...

2a.jpg


3a.jpg


The thickness of each blade is the same as the depth of the lip on the drawer front (which doubles as a drawer pull). This depth is significant.

The reason for the rebate arrangement is to get the blade as low as possible on the case side. Recall that the front of the blade acts as a drawer stop as well, and must be coplanar with the lower edge of the drawer lip.

The side/blades are fitted to the rear of the apron with a mortice-and-tenon joint ...

1a.jpg


This was definitely a tricky joint to do and it needed to be precisely positioned so that the entry lined up with the sides ... precisely!

9a.jpg


Here is what it would look like with the drawer front inserted ...

8a.jpg


To aid with alignment, I made a MDF pattern ...

10a.jpg


Here's the fun bit - aligning the case with the front and rear aprons, to mark out the rear mortices ...

5a.jpg


The pattern is inserted and a straight edge is attached to the front apron to prevent flexing ...

6a.jpg


A lot of repeat measurements are taken on the rear apron before I am satisfied it is square and equal front-and-back.

This is the result ...

1.jpg


By-the-way, note the biscuit joiner-made slots for attaching the table top.


The drawer

The drawer build was fairly straight forward. The usual half-blind fronts and through dovetail rears.

Transferring tails to pins on the Moxon ...

3.jpg


The sides were grooved rather than using slips. This was to save the extra 3mm height needed for the slips (saving as much height as possible for inside the drawer). 3mm grooves ..

1a.jpg


Matching groove in the drawer front ...

2a.jpg


Below is the stage of glueing up the drawer carcase. You know that it is all coplanar and square (essential for a piston fit) when the dovetail at each end just drop neatly into the matching sockets :) ...

9a.jpg


The 6mm thick drawer bottom receives a 3mm rebate. This was made with a moving fillester, and then fine-tuned with a shoulder plane ...

13a.jpg


The drawer fits well and needs minimal tuning. Got to use the newly-made drawer-planing fixture ...

11a.jpg


Two items added: a very fine chamfer to the top of the drawer front, to prevent binding when the drawer is closed. And a stretcher across the tops of the drawer sides, prevent the drawer tipping ...

23a.jpg


This aids in achieving near-full extension ...

27a.jpg


The end :)

19a.jpg


Regards from Perth

Derek
 

Andy Kev.

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Derek,

was there a reason for not cutting a stopped mortice? That way the side blades would have simply slotted in and been supported.

Andy.
 

Sheffield Tony

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Nicely done =D>

A couple of questions - how did you loose / hide the ugly dowels in the top of the legs, as your new aprons are shallower ?

And - forgive me if I'm being dense - why would drawer slips make the drawer 3mm shallower ? Can't you just put the rebate in the bottom the other way up and keep the drawer depth the same ? I would have thought it easier to achieve the thin drawer sides that way.
 

Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)

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Tony, thanks for asking. I had meant to mention the way I dealt with the dowel, but there was not the opportunity.

Here are the legs, and you can see the ugly dowels. What I did was to turn them upside down, and remove the dowelled section in the taper cut ...

legs2.jpg


First, the legs were morticed ..

legs16.jpg


I built a simple fixture for my sliding table saw ...

legs8.jpg


The nail holes were filled with coloured epoxy, which disappeared after the finish was applied ...

legs12.jpg


And then smoothed ...

legs13.jpg


I was asked (when I posted this photo elsewhere) why I planed into the grain. The answer is ‘because I can with a closed chipbreaker’ :) No, the real answer is because it was easier to keep track of the mark demarcating the flat section.

As to the drawer slips, I like to leave such flat - no protrusions - which then requires a groove. The groove is 3mm below the top edge .... hence 3mm more material is needed.

Regards from Perth

Derek
 

Woody2Shoes

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A lovely job - as always. I'd be interested to know what finish/process you use - I don't know if you've included the 'finishing' stage in previous WIPs but it's something of a black art to me. Cheers, W2S
 

Woody2Shoes

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I did mention the finishes used early on. Pictures and all.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Thanks - I missed it in all the excitement about the slicing and invisible re-gluing of the front apron! Finishing is still a bit of a 'dark art' as far as I'm concerned. Isn't it very late/early in Perth?
 
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