Tiny home on wheels

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Regarding the roof. I have wondered - also for a workshop - about using multi wall polycarbonate sheet, e.g. https://www.plasticbuildingsupplies.com ... gKFpvD_BwE

It is used for conservatories and greenhouses, is not expensive, is lightweight and has good insulation values. Glazing framework is available and of course it provides light. I'd be interested in what the building experts here think.

OTOH you have a large roof area which is crying out to be covered in solar cells.

Keith
 
Ive used polycarbonate twinwall before, on sheds and the like. It is certainly all those things (cheap, insulating, light) and might be a good shout for a skylight, but something seems odd about having an entire roof made of it! I quite like the idea, its a bit radical, but I guess in the summer it would have a pretty serious greenhouse effect!

Definitely going to want lots of solar power too...
 
All sounds good but be very careful with the kitchen as this is normally where most of the weight is carried, cooker, fridge etc and the reason why you'll find few, if any caravans with a front kitchen.

Unless you have a range rover / disco etc. or a commercial vehicle you'll find that most cars have a maximum noseweight allowance of around 100 - 120 kg and even if more than that the actual towbar manufacturer may have plated lower. It's an offence to exceed the lowest of the 2 amounts.
There will also be a maximum axle load for both the trailer chassis and the towing vehicle.

You must have passed your test after 1997 if you need to upgrade to cat B+E or C1 and so be restricted to max combined of 3500kg

I'm at the other end and have loads of entitlements including a motorcycle which is stupid as I haven't ridden one for 50 years :roll: but because I'll be 70 in March and our motorhome is 3850kg I need to pay for a signed medical form from the GP. I don't have issues with that as I'm all for safety first but bet I'll not be happy with the cost of a docs signature. :(

Looking forward to seeing your project take shape, plenty of photos please!
 
Hopefully phase one will begin in the new year if i can avoid distractions, and the outer structure should go up quite quick once I get going, will document it all thoroughly!

It is a shame that licenses aint what they used to be, though with good reason im sure. Ive found it all totally mindboggling, just looked again at a few sites and confused myself again. But im pretty sure I can have a winning combination of gross train weight, vehicle tow limit, hitch limits and chassis rating, so it largely comes down to the nose weight of the trailer, which I will be paying close attention to from now on!

One (dangerous?) thought: does having weight either end balance out, with the axels as fulcrum? ie. if the front ends up too heavy, does making the opposite end heavy balance things out... safely?
 
Dokkodo":ia1l9xl6 said:
One (dangerous?) thought: does having weight either end balance out, with the axels as fulcrum? ie. if the front ends up too heavy, does making the opposite end heavy balance things out... safely?
In a word - no!

The main loads should be over the axle which is why end kitchen caravans, in the old days of construction especially were bloody awful to tow. You can balance it out some but seriously risk distorting a modern lightweight chassis by loading each end heavily. It's also an offence to tow a badly loaded van and the police would stop you if it was badly swaying also in the event of an accident the insurance company would refuse to pay out.

Modern units on Al-ko chassis and others have electronic braking stability as well as friction dampers in the coupling head which helps and many of the tow vehicles have additional electronic stability features as well.
The van I sold in September was a large twin axle with MPTLM of 1800kg whilst my Merc weight only 1880kg but loaded properly and with the correct noseweight it towed perfectly.

I have a downloaded pdf file re licence regs which is easy to understand, just pm me with your email address it it's of use to you, I can't see how to send it via pm.

Noseweight is easy to check btw with a set of bathroom scalesand length of broomshank.

Apart from being a long time caravanner, in the early days especially, I worked for one of the largest manufacturers, ABI in the late seventies.

Cheers
Bob
 
Well in that case i am doubly grateful for your input! And would love to have that file to add to my project folder, got the IVA manual waiting to be given a thorough scan, an engaging holiday read... I will PM you my email address.

I dont think Ive posted the pics of my chassis yet so ill show that off now too:

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Following this thread with interest. The chasis looks really smart !

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
 
Solid looking chassis, excellent!
I don't think you'll have much trouble towing with the vehicle parked next to it. :lol:
 
ColeyS1":3vy98fah said:
Following this thread with interest. The chasis looks really smart !

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


Yeah, so shiny. Its got all the clever braking wizardry and the company fabricating it added an extra feature which is quite neat, the a-frame can be unbolted. So if its going to live somewhere for a while I can take it off, for security, and so itll look dead tidy. just need to build the thing now...
 
Looking forward to seeing more of your build. Hopefully you’re well on with the project. Any updates ?
 
I think George Clarke's sidekick Will Hardie built a trailer on one of their programmes. May be worth doing a bit of research too see if the episode is on the internet and get an idea of what construction he used.
Regards Keith
 
Just reviving this to say that I am about to begin. Life has happened as it does so its taken longer than i'd have liked to get going but im looking forward to making a start, with phase one being the outer shell and interior cladding.

I am going more or less with the original design for the shell. One alteration is that I am now going to wrap the whole thing in ali sheet now, which makes the roof simpler and will make it even more airstreamy, so it will be a sort of monocoque exterior but with the exposed timber frame inside.

Think i'm going to stick to the timber frame plan despite concerns about the weight of reclaimed 4x2s, they aren't too heavy, and will give both structural and aesthetic benefits, and in principle it will still be monocoque and overall pretty light.

I hope my insulation plans are correct, itll be boards in the floor build up, spray on the walls and maybe that or more boards in the ceiling. The build up of these is one of the things i'm less sure on having not done much building work, any pointers on recommended thickness for floor welcome. And the spraying direct to outer shell i believe reduces condensation problems? As for ventilation, there are lots of opening windows, hopefully thats enough.

Hopefully will be able to post first WIP photos in the coming week or two. Thanks to those following and supporting!
 
Hi Dokkodo

I really think you might want to still consider the metal frame option for the walls - I hear what you are saying about the aesthetics internally, but you can do that with strips of wood, placed anywhere you like, and have the choice of fancy wood types to boot!

I've not built one, or worked for a caravan company, but I've been watching the tiny homes scene for close to 10 years (as a possible option to never being able to buy my own), along with self builds, Earth Ships, boatbuilding (Father owns a wooden fitted yacht and has been talking about a refit for years), George Clarkes Amazing Spaces (with Will Hardy, mentioned previously who's a real innovator), and pretty much every program and hundreds of youtubes on renovating old structures both static and mobile inc caravans / horse boxes etc etc etc into a home, for decades - man I'd LOVE a vintage Airstream, I know a guy who has one...... or an american style school bus - a la Bob Waldmire's Route 66 bus (google it, it's a beaut), anyway, so I'd like to think I've picked up a few things along the way.

Oh and I also studied architecture and construction at college for 3 years.

Anyway my point is this, there is one main rule for all of them, it's a bad design choice that builds UP TO a weight limit for a mobile structure.

One should always endeavour to BUILD DOWN as much as is reasonably feasable within a budget or slightly over if the cost is tolerable. Saving that weight now might well be required down the line - but you'll never know that until it comes to it, and by then it's too late.

For example there's a simple question, how are you going to fit out the kitchen area and "how much does a box of average sized tiles weigh?" - it's every small choice like this that most people don't take into account.

As for the fitted components inside, whether it be a few or festooned, there's only one mantra to follow "maximum storage, maximum storage, maximum storage".

150kg of weight saved (compared to the ali frame option as guesstimate) will give you a lot more storage alteration options, and you'll be very glad of it - especially if you get fed up of having no washing facilities unless you intend to strip wash from the sink every day which will get old real fast when there's no site facilities; relying on site facilites will seriously hamper your ability to just "hook up and go, any time, any place", there are a great deal of sites that are little more than a field on someone's farm with NOTHING in the way of facilities apart from a source of water.

You'll need to plan for that - or be forever tied to using a dedicated site.

Looks like you might have JUST enough room for a "bath in the floor" between the struts of the trailer - and as you're planning on having a log burner here's an interesting option :)

https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-man-b ... 26067.html

Make the bath out of metal - copper preferably - and solder copper pipes to the outside of it, in continuous loops, several being better to have more pipes in the fire, that run through the stove fire in am unbroken loop, with a pressure outlet valve AND a cut off valve so you can cut the water from flowing when it's hot enough. The liquid in the loop is usually water but could be glycol (?) or a mixture for better thermo conductivity and will self feed cold > hot because of thermo dynamics.

or... *faded memory surfaces* aha yes! Easier still make a version of this:

https://gigazine.net/gsc_news/en/20160731-dutch-hub/

I'm sure the design can be modified to work with a log burner.

Lol, just an idea :)

The simplest way would be a simple solar shower option, black bladder on roof, heating water that outlets from the side of the structure, but they don't work in english winters ! :)

Oh and don't forget to create storage cubbies in the floor either, best place for car batteries and heavy items, you've got at least the depth of the chassis and a little bit more you can use - and possibly give it some larger wheels, looks like you've got some room there too, before rubbing the underside of the main framework, far as I know it doesn't matter of the trailer is tipped slighty forward towards the car, and prolly preferable to being tiped back away from the car, so maybe get some height measurements on where the hitch will be heightwise when attached to a vehicle.

I've noticed in your more recent sketchup you've got freestanding furniture, in a towable structure this is also MASSIVE NO NO. They can move, shifting the weight and adding all sorts of complications - this is quite apart from the other point which is there is an awful lot of wasted airspace in between the legs of a freestanding chair.

Your first sketchup with a "box style / built in" unit is far more preferable - no moving parts except what's stored inside; however your coffee table on wheels is also a massive no, no.

If it were me I would do several things differently - if you would allow me.

The bed, I would remove that altogether for now and make it part of the boxed seating arrangement - sure you'll have to make it and unmake it each day, or not as the case may be :wink: but it will also lower the centre of gravity at the rear, which is where all the fun happens if the weight isn't well distributed as MikeG stated - because I'm getting the impression you like to make things "chunky" - aka "weighty".

I would also not statically build in the seating unit either, I would make it in sections that can be moved about on small rollers something similar to these:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SODIAL-Sliver- ... 4321&psc=1

Maybe 1 longer and taller one for the main back rest and 3 or 4 for the seating - and here's where the clever bit happens and the reason for the rollers - when in transit they can be MOVED further forward over the axle, and then fixed down to the floor using some ali angle, metal plasterboard hollow fixings in the floor and these, which take up minimal space.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/sourcing-map-A ... ay&sr=8-38

You'll need to have fixing points in the floor where they will be placed for transit and when in "normal" use. There is one additional benefit - if you move the units over the axle it'll also give you the option to make a decent sized open space at the far rear should you need it - for storing lightweight items like a bicycle, surfboards and whatever else that can be strapped and tried down to the floor using those self same metal fixings.

If you absolutely MUST have a bed you don't have to "make up" every day - you could consider a platform that's more central over the axle, that lifts and lowers on climbing rope (not paracord) using a pully system, with the cords arranged similar to a venetian blind, pulling from one point, with drop down legs so it rests on the floor, then the legs fold and clip up in place and you lift it to the roof again - you'll lose minimal headspace and you could even use the underside to fit LED's for main lighting - just add some spacers to the "bottom" of the bed and a sheet of 6mm plywood to create a cavity for the fittings and power unit (and the legs) - they use very little power and present an almost negligable fire risk if fitted / insulated correctly.

Sorry, I'm going on and on, I've got lots of ideas for a similar space and I envy you that you've got the chance to make it happen =D> - I'll be watching with interest.

And and it's not "cheating" to use the free resources here, I'd call that smart thinking.

Good luck ! (hammer) (hammer)

Edit - I was just going to say that I'm practically FIZZING with jealousy and I'd offer to help if you lived closer - then I clicked on your avatar - I can't repeat what I said but, we live in the SAME CITY, Bristol.

Seriously, I've got my own tools; maybe more than you as it's my profession (hammer) including things like a site saw, track saws, mitre saw, MFT's and trestles, clamps galore, etc etc and can offer time in between work and stuff as I'm self employed; it would be a lot of fun - oh and my car is large - a people carrrier actually with no rear seats, should you need materials in bulk.

Send me a PM if you need extra hands. Really.

Oh and one last, last final thing - my vehicle has a full on towing setup (from previous owners) 2 power outlers and a safety latch - in case you needed to move the trailer on site .

#muchtookeentobehealthy
 
Hahaaa well thats a very enthusiastic and content heavy post for which I am very grateful, many good ideas!

On frame and weight. I see what you're saying about building down the weight, of course. I haven't ever used metal stud frame so thats one reason i haven't been considering it I suppose, wouldnt know where to begin, and wood makes it easy to do odd angles and frame in windows and doors, though obviously thats possible in metal too.

Regarding the tubs! I was planning on the latter, outdoor thing, this isn't going to be a touring vehicle. Its more a house, that can move every now and then, if i want to travel i take my van. Ideally ill move it once every couple of years, so a few things can be set up around it. I was thinking of making a semi-portable outdoor compost loo, for instance, and maybe outdoor shower/bath arrangement. In the dream version, theres another trailer with a sauna/shower on it. Obviously this would require finding the right spot (or buying some land) but its all possible. But the tub in the floor, that is pretty cool...

Same goes for furniture (although all interior stuff in the sketchup is very much just ideas - was going to reconsider when the shell and floor are done and i have a better sense of proportion). If i have to lug a few things out and pack my van with them when it comes to moving time, thats not such a big deal.

I am also rethinking the large double doors on one side. I already have them, well some metal framed sliding patio doors I acquired to have the double glazing out of, but they are very heavy, and actually I realise they use up a huge amount of wall space. As nice as it would be to be able to open the whole thing up, im wondering whether its worth the trade off in functional space.

I was just going to say that I'm practically FIZZING with jealousy and I'd offer to help if you lived closer - then I clicked on your avatar - I can't repeat what I said but, we live in the SAME CITY

Guess i better PM you about having a meet up and you can avail me of your thoughts in person! Much to discuss and if i have to rethink things i better get on with it, was about to make a start...
 
Dokkodo":1kkjqz4a said:
Hahaaa well thats a very enthusiastic and content heavy post for which I am very grateful, many good ideas!

On frame and weight. I see what you're saying about building down the weight, of course. I haven't ever used metal stud frame so thats one reason i haven't been considering it I suppose, wouldnt know where to begin, and wood makes it easy to do odd angles and frame in windows and doors, though obviously thats possible in metal too.

You can still add wood to the metal framing for any particularly "odd" bits.

Dokkodo":1kkjqz4a said:
Regarding the tubs! I was planning on the latter, outdoor thing, this isn't going to be a touring vehicle. Its more a house, that can move every now and then, if i want to travel i take my van. Ideally ill move it once every couple of years, so a few things can be set up around it. I was thinking of making a semi-portable outdoor compost loo, for instance, and maybe outdoor shower/bath arrangement. In the dream version, theres another trailer with a sauna/shower on it. Obviously this would require finding the right spot (or buying some land) but its all possible. But the tub in the floor, that is pretty cool...

Same goes for furniture (although all interior stuff in the sketchup is very much just ideas - was going to reconsider when the shell and floor are done and i have a better sense of proportion). If i have to lug a few things out and pack my van with them when it comes to moving time, thats not such a big deal.

I am also rethinking the large double doors on one side. I already have them, well some metal framed sliding patio doors I acquired to have the double glazing out of, but they are very heavy, and actually I realise they use up a huge amount of wall space. As nice as it would be to be able to open the whole thing up, im wondering whether its worth the trade off in functional space.

Mostly static gives you a lot more options and flexibilty of design. Regarding the double glazed doors this is what I meant by weight trade offs, although I'd imagine a hollow UPVC frame would be lighter than even a Pine frame even without the fact it's rot proof, although you could, maybe try a light hardwood, as there are a few, I've got some that is as light or even lighter than common Pine.

Wallspace - there's more than one way to skin a cat - who says things can't occupy the same space at the same time? Intrigued?

Dokkodo":1kkjqz4a said:
I was just going to say that I'm practically FIZZING with jealousy and I'd offer to help if you lived closer - then I clicked on your avatar - I can't repeat what I said but, we live in the SAME CITY

Guess i better PM you about having a meet up and you can avail me of your thoughts in person! Much to discuss and if i have to rethink things i better get on with it, was about to make a start...

Yup we can do that :)
 
I'm a bit late to the party, but I did once build a campervan out of a Luton furniture van, which I then lived in permanently for 3 or 4 years. If you want a permanent home, you want a permanent bed, which doesn't have to be folded up. Every. Single. Day. It wears thin - believe me. You cannot have enough storage (a bit like clamps in a workshop), and any hidden void should be considered potential storage space.

Finally, I have a friend who makes barrel top waggons. Not suggesting you buy one, but it may give you some inspiration, and Ben is a very approachable chap, especially if you have cider. He may well be able to help regarding clever ideas, design etc. http://www.barreltopwagons.co.uk/cabins ... -huts.html
 
Tend to agree with you TN, and i intend this to be my full time home at some point so I dont know about a bed that takes too much effort to make use of.

Finally started this week with refurbing the windows while i wait to finalise shell design, with a hope to get the shell done before i go away for a month in october and before its dark cold and wet all the time.

IMG_6234.JPG


Generally, i am tending towards having it the way ive planned with regards to weight extravagancies such as floor, windows, doors, because they are going to make the space very nice, which is priority number 2, priority 1 it being road legal. It would be really great to casually tow it on holiday or to festivals and the like, but if by making it very nice it means I have to pay someone to move it on the rare occassions i want to actually move house, i think id rather it was a nicer home for the 300 days a year when i dont need to be glamping... i might upgrade to an iveco van and get my towing license
once i know the weight of the finished thing.

However, I appreciate the need to save weight wherever possible, even more so probably considering the extravagant features. Going to put the housing for batteries, water and gas as central as possible, maybe some in/under the floor. All the windows and big doors are pretty much central.

Speaking of, the 7 double glazed windows total 90kgs and the pair of oak exterior doors I salvaged from a skip outside a 16th century house in sussex will be about another 50 once ive replaced the leaded glass for double glazing. And i need to make a frame for the doors and think about how to frame out the window apertures.

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Today I got the 11 lidl veg boxes of parquet tiles down from my mezzanine and de-tarred a square metres worth to calculate numbers and weight. As it is it will add up to another 150 kg :shock:
so, im thinking i might resaw the necessary 1100 :!: tiles down by the back third, this will obviously save a goodly weight but will also mean that the tounge and grooves will all become tounges. Wondering if anyone sees a problem with this, once stuck down im hoping it wouldnt all be suddenly very prone to warping... they about 3 quarters the darker colour, the rest the lighter, so i think ill do a border in the lighter or something. They need a good clean but I would like to retain the patina so i tried a bit of the reviver mix from the hand tools forum to clean them, seems to work pretty well.

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Still I hope we can get that meeting in Raf, before i get carried away and build the whole frame out of oak and put a green roof on it :mrgreen: (hammer)

Once the design is sorted though i should be able to get the shell up fairly quick. Frame/batten, clad (going to skin the whole thing in ali now, roof included, so its going to be even more airstreamy on the outside), install windows/doors, spray insulation (expensive but good from what i hear), then various floor layers (epdm, osb, insulation, parquet). Will save up all the evidence and do a proper WIP when all is done.

PS apologies for the neck breaking picture orientations
 

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Well seems like you've got a plan of sort's but other weights you might want to consider are "living stuff" - mattress (heavy), gas bottles, (heavy), water (heavy) - potable and waste, not grey, don't assume a guarenteed water supply on site, or disposal facilites for human waste, but that all depends on where you intend to put the tiny home, so I'd check first.

Batteries and how many you'll need to get at least a weeks worth of normal usage, for WINTER hours, as solar isn't even remotely reliable for charging - lol which reminds me as an aside one "green" house I saw being built in USA had to have a boiler fitted because apparently "the sun is not a reliable energy source".... in California. He's never used the boiler once, and was so tickled by that ridiculous statement from the planning office he had it engraved in stone and mounted by the boiler he doesn't use.

Mounting batteries ANYWHERE is a tricky thing, my advice would be to research how they do it for yachts, where the risk of fire is compounded by being at sea (ironic right?), but underfloor would be my first option in a water tight casing system, trying to offset the centre of gravity as low as you can, as much as you can - don't forget wind is a factor against a large surface area, and this will also limit where you can site it.

Consider adding eyebolts to the chassis at 4 locations, and a further 4 or 6 on the tiny home itself near the roof - for tie downs in case of higher winds while you are away, using the kind of spiral anchors used by extreme kiters when wishing to remain immobile using a drag kite, they have incredible pull out resistance when set properly. Anchoring it in some way to the ground wouldn't be a stupid idea either once on site, if allowed or possible, some hefty chains concreted into holes dug - "post hole" fashion to discourage light fingered folk who take a fancy to it.

Yeah we should talk soon, looks like some of next weeks weather is a bit rubbish so I'll be free for a chat and maybe a looksee, you got my number.

Still think some of those choices might want a second look for alternatives - the parquet flooring being one - "just coz you haz it - don't mean you HAZ to use it."
 

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