Table saws... Scheppach or Record?

[Anonymous]

Hello everybody my name is James, and I like spending time alone with tools! D

I love the web site!

Right then, the time has come for me to get a proper table saw, and my short list comprises of, a Record Power TSPP250 with the sliding carriage and a Scheppach TS2500ci with 2m carriage.

My basic wish list for a table saw is that it has a distance of 1m or more to the rip fence and has a carriage with the capacity to handle a 1220mm sheet.

Also I would like the saw to be accurate, but to what?, is my first question. At the moment 1mm is fine for me, however, I do hope in the future to be putting the saw to different and varying uses, and as my skills grow I would like the saw to be able to cope.

So to all you with many more years experience and knowledge than me, do you use, or would you like to have the option of 0.1mm accuracy? If yes then i would be swayed toward the Scheppach.

If not I think the Record would be at the top of the list, I've seen both machines back to back at D&M and the TSPP250 looked most impressive. The reason for the choice is the fence, which in my mind is very important, and looks the stronger of the two. The Scheppach seemed very flimsy in comparison because of the front only locking, it looked like if you leaned on it a little it would go out of true. Is this the case? I suspect not from their reputation, but that's all i could ascertain from looking and feeling )

And is the Record fence as good as it looks? can i have confidence in it use. I read a post recently from a chap (sorry the name escapes me) that had a Scheppach TS4010, and said he no longer used his jointer as the fence on the saw was so good that it wasn't necessary anymore. This is the kind of accuracy and im looking for really.

Oh and while I'm here is the fence on the TS4010 different to the TS2500, ie. does it clamp on the back also, or stronger mounting on the front?

So really If you own a Scheppach or a Record Power TS that I have mentioned can you comment on its ability and its short comings please.

Oh and in case anybody is thinking 'Unisaw', I would love one, but they are too big and heavy for my needs. Oh and while we are on a controversial subject, if I get the Scheppach, I will be purchasing their slot cutter!, lol


Many Thanks,
James

 

[Alf]

Welcome to the forum, James. Sure you wouldn't rather get a bandsaw...? :-k

Okay, I'm already on my way out. :wink: :lol:

Cheers, Alf

 

[devonwoody]

I couldn't imagine any saw not needing the timber to go through the P/T after cutting if furniture is the end product, and then some would want to hand plane.

 

[Charley]

Welcome to UKW James

I can't really help as I've never seen the record but I know the TS2500 is a great saw.

I read a post recently from a chap (sorry the name escapes me) that had a Scheppach TS4010, and said he no longer used his jointer as the fence on the saw was so good that it wasn't necessary anymore. This is the kind of accuracy and im looking for really.

It's not really the fence, it's the blade. You still need to get a square edge first so to do it on the table saw you would remove the fence and use a jig that runs in the mitre gauge and clamps the work piece but you can’t use a table saw to prepare wood! If he was just talking about cutting PAR boards on the table saw, although the fence needs to be setup accurately, again it's the blade that controls the quality

Are you sure you don't want a unisaw? I know a place where you can get them from :lol: - I'll get my coat...

 

[Woodythepecker]

Hi James welcome to the forum. I believe the fences on the TS4010 and the TS2500CI are exactly the same, eg they only lock at the front, but don't let this put you off as IMHO both the fence and the locking mechanism of the Scheppach's are first class. My son has the older model TS2500 (the one without the cast iron table) and once you lock the fence it does not flex or move in anyway at all.

As i have not seen the Record i cannot say if the Scheppach is better or not, but what i will say is if you go for the Scheppach you will not be disappointed.

regards

Woody

 

[Gill]

Hi James

The Record was reviewed in Good Woodworking Issue 145 and came out with ratings of 4 for value for money and 3.5 for performance.

Good Woodworking has also run a comparison test (which I can't find at the moment) of the Scheppach, EB and Kity 419 and the Kity came out on top. I understand they also rate the Jet very highly, if you want to move into the next league.

Gill

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all your comments so far.... Keep them coming

 

[Gill]

As you might be aware, I ordered a Kity 419 at Woodex yesterday. One of the reasons I decided on the Kity was its accuracy. Using a standard blade, this veneer of pine was cut:

I've placed a scalpel in the photograph to give an idea of just how thin the veneer is. In fact, it's comparable in thickness with commercially available veneers that I've purchased in the past for marquetry. It was taken from a piece of timber that was about 1m long and the thickness of the veneer is consistent over the whole length.

I've positioned the veneer in the photograph so that the cut side is visible. It's difficult to see saw marks unless you look very closely.

Gill

 

[Anonymous]

FAO. Gill

Thanks very much for your continued advice, and can you tell me was woodex any good? I was thinking about going but i wasnt sure it there would be much in the way of machinery there? I saw a flyer and it looked almost like a craft fair.

And I do really like the Kity machines and you picture would almost sell me one, however they just dont have the ripping capacity or carraige travel i need at the moment. (I dont think so any way)

How much of a discount did you get at woodex? and Did you see Scheppach or Record there?

 

[Gill]

I enjoyed Woodex and wrote about it here.

It would be unkind to describe it as a craft fair - if you look at the list of exhibitors in the thread I've pointed out you should get more of an idea about who's there. Scheppach were certainly there but I didn't actually look too closely at their machines. From my own research, I was already pretty confident that a Kity would meet my needs and when I saw it in action, I knew it was the saw for me. I'm quite a fan of Kity machines, anyway. The whole set up that you see in the Woodex thread cost £670 all in. I didn't investigate the capacity of the machine for cutting panels because I don't have that requirement. However, it seemed to have a large capacity and I was told that you could reverse the sliding carriage to facilitate easier cross cutting if you needed to.

Incidentally, the veneer I showed earlier was cut with the fence secured from the front only. However, it can also be fastened simultaneously at the rear.

I can't recall if anyone was selling the Record machine. I know that Price's had a variety of brands on their stand and I seem to recall that they had some Records, but my attention was drawn by their Festool display :roll:. For me, it was always going to be a choice between the Scheppach and the Kity anyway.

Gill

 

[Anonymous]

Oh please forgive me, i ment no offence in my perceptin of Woodex. And by way of apology i will try to go tomorrow

 

[Chris Knight]

Bob,

You don't say exactly why you need a tablesaw. For cutting sheet goods, a number of people are switching to a Festool plunge saw with guide rail. You will find plenty on the forum and elsewhere on the web that show this to be an excellent solution and very accurate. I have one and love it.

I also have a Scheppach TS 4010 which is a very good saw. The rip fence is one of the best things about it. It is a very solid fence and I can use it to adjust and rip strips to within two or three thousandths of an inch accuracy as I do for laminating work. The Scheppach can certainly deal with sheet goods, however, I don't like manhandling large sheet goods and my workshop is too small to do so safely so I cut them up in my garage with the Festool to the size I need (if large as for a tall bookcase for example). That is all I need to do - there is no need for further work on the tablesaw or even with a handplane on the edges, the Festool leaves a perfect cut.

I can't really compare with the Record but I believe the latter cannot stow its extension table (to the rip side). On the Sheppach the optional steel rip is of a folding type and that save a lot of useful space.

 

[colinc]

I just got back from a similar mission to Woodex as I'm looking for a saw too. I almost got the cheque book out for the Kity as the quality and accuracy of set up seems supurb. However, I resisted for now as I am in the middle of an expensive bathroom refit - but if it comes in within budget then I'll go for it.

The reason for writing was just to reinforce the idea that you should go and look for yourself at the machines there. There was little else comparable to the Kity that I saw. Other machines there included those from Sheppach, Elektra Beckum and SIP but the Kity just seems to me to offer so much more for the money.

In terms of accuracy it looks to me as if the Kity is potentially better than all the others I looked at. It has all the hallmarks of a machine built to a spec. not a budget and is a proven and refined design that has been around for a long time now.

Some other goodies there too though - check out the router lift, micro-fence and Incra fences - I was very impressed with the engineering in the lift for £165 - am off to pull out some router table designs now!!

 

[Alf]

You don't say exactly why you need a tablesaw. For cutting sheet goods, a number of people are switching to a Festool plunge saw with guide rail. You will find plenty on the forum and elsewhere on the web that show this to be an excellent solution and very accurate. I have one and love it.

Or if you've already got a decent circular saw, the EZ Smart Guide (there's another thread on it more recently as well) seems to have many fans - and we could do with a review of it for the forum... :wink:

Cheers, Alf

 

[Anonymous]

At the moment I do need a table saw for sheet material, however I normally get the lumber yard to basic size for me as it easier to transport.

I would like the table saw to do all the jobs a table saw is used for, otherwise, I could stick to a skillsaw and a straight edge. I feel I have exhausted that method, and the festool system although very good, could only save me a little time rather than expand my working techniques.

The fact that the Scheppach folds away is the reason its on the list, otherwise i really couldn't justify the extra 800 pound premium.

I know the Scheppach is a much better machine, but it was just the doubts of the fence that i was wondering about. However it seams as if this was just a poorly set up machine i must have seen.

So is there anybody else out there that can swing my favour in the direction of the record?

Thanks again for the replies so far.

P.S. that EZ thing looks tempting, dont suppose they were going cheap at woodex?

Also, are the Kity x619's as good as the 419's good, a shop up the road has old stock of these at £1230 for the full pkg.

 

[Woodythepecker]

James, you might also like to know that the Scheppach has a fine adjuster on its fence which is very accurate.

Regards

Woody

 

[frank]

now play fair you lot not one of you has said what about an xcalibur its just like norms and did any one say phillys got one :lol: :lol:

 

[johnelliott]

now play fair you lot not one of you has said what about an xcalibur its just like norms and did any one say phillys

The thing is, no one (including the retailers) will say what the travel on the xcalibur's sliding table is. Presumably it's quite short and therefore NFG for panel work

John

 

[Philly]

Gee, guess you'd have to make a phone call for that information....... [-(
Philly

 

[johnelliott]

Gee, guess you'd have to make a phone call for that information

Why would I want to do that? I've already deduced that the sliding table is NFG for panel work, and I'm nicely equipped for panel work as is. What we are trying to do is sort out a suitable saw for Bob. If you happen to know what the travel on the xcaliber sliding table is, perhaps you would tell him
John