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Startrite tilt Arbor motor

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Myfordman

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Distinterior":1jkg5mc0 said:
Myford Man,.....If the previous owner of the saw decided to remove the Capacitor and wire up the motor without one, would the motor run at all or would it just display the symptoms that are being described by Matthew....? Just curious!
A few single phase motors don't use a capacitor but they are for low torque loads especially fans where the load is a function of speed.
On a saw, there is the load of the belt drive to overcome during starting and I can't think of a belt driven machine I've come across (single phase) where a capacitor start motor is not essential.

Sorry I'm not familiar with strartrite saw model numbers. What max size blades go in a 145/165?
 

Myfordman

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Well Startrite made quality machines so must have been Ok.
900w is a curious size too, 1.2hp. Startrite must have had a thing about that size of motor, my 18-s-1 bandsaw uses one but I can stall it on an aggressive cut. It is on my round -2-it list to beef it up.
 

CHJ

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Is there any chance that a 3ph motor was fitted and a 'bodge' capacitor fitted somewhere in the control gear housing to provide a Pseudo 3rd phase.

Would explain lack of power and poor performance on a saw.
 

Distinterior

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If the standard switch box is still being used, there is nowhere near enough space for a capacitor to be fitted in it Chas!
All the single phase Startrite saws that I've worked on ( which is quite a few....!) have had the capacitor mounted on the side of the motor.

Perhaps Matthew can post a few more pictures to give us a better idea...? Can you manage to get a picture of the rating plate Matthew? They are either Red, like in the picture above or Black, depending on the age of the saw/motor.

The apparent lack of a capacitor is one issue, but the motor fitted in your saw may not be man enough for the job as it does look a bit of a lash up when looking at the picture you posted....
 

Myfordman

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CHJ":3fn7gcbw said:
Is there any chance that a 3ph motor was fitted and a 'bodge' capacitor fitted somewhere in the control gear housing to provide a Pseudo 3rd phase.

Would explain lack of power and poor performance on a saw.
That could be a possibility Chas.
Most Griffin 3 phase motors I’ve played with have been fixed star wound although quite easy to pick apart and convert to star 240v working.
All the more important to see the rating plate to know if we have a fundamental limitation on power out as you suggest or a single phase motor with a dying/dead capacitor.

It does look to be a BS 5000 imperial motor so more costly to replace with new unless the op is willing and able to machine the pulley to fit a modern metric motor.
The worst part is cutting a new keyway slot. Often easiest to buy a new taperloc pulley.
 

Myfordman

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Chas wins the prize! That is a 3 phase motor and there sould be a capacitor hidden away somewhere generating the third phase.
 

Matthew Woodworks

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The guy who changed the motor was a proper eccentric guy called Mo who worked for the London Saw Company (sharpeners) and it looks like he did quite an eccentric job on it! It still ran on 3 phase as you can see?
 

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Myfordman

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Everythikng you have shown supports it not only having a three phase motor but also fully wire for three phase including a red commando plug.
This begs the question how have you even managed to get is to work from a single phase supply? Now wonder it has much reduced power.
 

Distinterior

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Matthew Woodworks":2af91nip said:
I also had a good hunt around inside and can't see anything that is a capacitor?
There is no capacitor in there...!

As suspected,...its a bodge up. Do you mind if I ask,.... how much did you pay for this saw?
 

Distinterior

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That's not the original switch or switch box either....My guess is, it was replaced with this one when the previous owner put the "incorrect" motor in it.
 

CHJ

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Someone needs to check the supply the machine is plugged into, is it 3ph, how many Pins are in that red plug?
 

Distinterior

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I think you've nailed it Chas!
Matthew,....Did you just assume it was a 240 volt saw because of the Startrite model tag on the side of the saw..?
Did the saw come to you with that Red Commando plug on the end of the wire?
How did you get it to run initially? Did you remove the Red plug and put a 3 pin 240v plug on the end? Surely, there would have been too many wire conductors in the flex..?

Edit. Chas has beaten me to the question.....
It looks like there are the 3 phase wires going into the upper connections on the contactor switch.
The lower connections go to the motor.
 

Matthew Woodworks

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The saw was kind of inherited rather than bought and prior to the new motor being fitted it was also sluggish back then I remember and the 'new' motor made no difference to its performance - no wonder I can see now. It's always, with me anyway, run on 3 phase. The saw was rarely used a(as we have 2 much larger panel saws) and it hasn't been used for a few years and was in danger of being buried in a dark corner of the workshop! So I wanted to have a go at working out how to get the poor old thing working properly again as they are fab little saws.

I can't see what the other questions where on the thread as I write this so I hope I've not missed anything!

I'm not really sure how to move this forward!! What's the plan I wonder? I need to swat up more on 3 phase as I find it rather murky and I've always just nodded along when sparks come and fit new machines etc :). I would really like to get the saw cleaned and repaired and up and running as it would be a useful machine in the workshop.
 
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