Smoking Startrite table saw

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BorisTheBlade

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So I just took delivery of a Startrite table saw and you can hear the whine when it starts up, I assumed from belt/belts that need replacing but then it billows out smoke when cutting a thin piece of soft wood. Would a belt throw out that much smoke or is the motor shot?

Not the happy new tool day it was supposed to be 🙁

 

Spectric

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That smoke does seem to coincide with you cutting, it could be a dull blade that is burning the wood. Is the smell burning rubber, burning wood or the fishy smell of a burning motor? Remove the belt and take a look, V belts are more tolerant to slipping but if it is a polyvee then they can just fly apart if they slip.
 

Distinterior

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How many teeth are on that saw blade...?
From what I can see in your video, it looks as though the teeth look black and therefore blunt or in dire need of a clean.
The whine sounds more like blade resonance than a bearing noise....
Can you show us the cut you made on that bit of wood..?

And PLEASE,... dont operate the saw without a riving knife fitted and blade guard fitted...I was feeling weak in the stomach just watching you cut that little bit of wood....
 
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BorisTheBlade

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That smoke does seem to coincide with you cutting, it could be a dull blade that is burning the wood. Is the smell burning rubber, burning wood or the fishy smell of a burning motor? Remove the belt and take a look, V belts are more tolerant to slipping but if it is a polyvee then they can just fly apart if they slip.
I thought the engine would smoke if under load not all the time? I felt the blade soon after and it was cool to the touch. The smoke didn't seem to come from the blade but I will try a different one tomorrow. The smell isn't fishy, maybe sawdust but there was no burning on the wood cut at all and it didn't seem to come from the blade.
 

Fitzroy

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Looks like a duff blade or bad set up. That’s a piece of 1” wood, it should be through that in half of no time, if it’s taking 30s something is up.

If blade and fence are not parallel you could be pinching the wood, although with no riving knife I’d have expected a nasty outcome in the vid. So perhaps not that.
 

BorisTheBlade

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Can you take a picture of the blade...?
How many teeth does that blade have...?
Sorry had to put my son to bed. Don't worry re: my fingers, I had a push stick for the right hand and my left is firmly posted to the table around 6" from the blade as a guide not holding onto the wood. I didn't see a riving knife so may have to buy or fabricate one.

There was no burn marks on the wood. The saw hasn't been used in a long time so will change out the blade to run more tests.
 

BorisTheBlade

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Looks like a duff blade or bad set up. That’s a piece of 1” wood, it should be through that in half of no time, if it’s taking 30s something is up.

If blade and fence are not parallel you could be pinching the wood, although with no riving knife I’d have expected a nasty outcome in the vid. So perhaps not that.
Yes it was taking a little while and I was taking it easy on it to be on the safe side. I don't think it was pinching, I couldn't feel the tell tale resistance. It felt more like a dull blade but I wouldn't expect that much smoke with no burn marks on the wood.
 

Distinterior

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Boris,.....How many teeth are on that blade..?
The blade should be about 9" or 235mm in diameter......based on this size blade, and if you're planning on cutting solid timber, you dont want more than about a 40 tooth blade....
 

Ttrees

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Two pushsticks is the way to go, and RK at the least.
You can't concentrate on everything at the same time.
I remember the first time I touched the blade with a piece of hardwood, unintentionally I might add, as I had that sorta thinking that one was sufficient enough, and would make do with that until I found some soft ply or MDF.
Quite the bang when the blade snatched the timber into the ZCI!

Could be a lot of issues here, with new blade and combination square, use the pick a tooth method and line up with mitre slots.
Short fence made and support for outfeed presuming you would sort out.
With that sorted
Is there a dish on the table,
Is the wood surfaced face and edge
Is there runout on either the arbor, bearings possibly,
although I'd want to also check flanges very carefully as those can make a lot of wobble should there be grit or damaged, most meant to have contact with blade on perimeter.

Just a few possible reasons,
Mastering your tablesaw, by Kelly Mehler is one of the best videos I've seen available on youtube, although dated and American, exceptions can be made for the setup of the setup of the rip fence having toe in, as I guess there might not have been enough time or whatever in those days.
Gwinnet woodworks have two video seminars on safety which are pretty thorough.
the older even more so.
Steve Maskery has made some good articles also.
Just for some tips and whatnot.

Keep safe

Tom
 

Jones

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Are you sure the blade is in the right way round? It should cut that little stick in a couple of seconds. Also saw safety ,HSE have a short guide, a saw cutting properly will do fingers very quickly too.
 

baldkev

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Are you sure the blade is in the right way round? It should cut that little stick in a couple of seconds. Also saw safety ,HSE have a short guide, a saw cutting properly will do fingers very quickly too.
Lmao, ive seen a few tablesaws on ebay with the blade backwards. I messaged one seller pointing it out and telling him its dangerous to let it go like that.... he replied thanking me. He couldnt work out why it was cutting so badly 🙄😱 he withdrew the listing so he could keep it.
From then on i didnt bother messaging anyone else because if they are that dumb, darwin is going to rack up some more statistics 😆🤣
In this case, it must be the right way round, otherwise it would have been bucking like mad and definately no cutting.
@BorisTheBlade , count the teeth as previously asked. For ripping i use a 24 tooth usually.
 

DBC

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Sorry had to put my son to bed. Don't worry re: my fingers, I had a push stick for the right hand and my left is firmly posted to the table around 6" from the blade as a guide not holding onto the wood. I didn't see a riving knife so may have to buy or fabricate one.

There was no burn marks on the wood. The saw hasn't been used in a long time so will change out the blade to run more tests.

All of the warnings and advice above are important.

Furthermore, you seem very confident as to the position of your hands but it doesn’t matter where your hands are if you get a kickback. I don’t know how experienced you are on a table saw but you need to take your new saw really seriously until it is running safely and you understand how to use it. To underscore the importance of this type ‘saw kickback injuries’ into google images. I was working in a joinery in 1989 when another employee lost an eye and a large part of his scalp to kickback from a saw. His cabinetmaking career ended that day; and he only had 6 months left in his apprenticeship and qualifying for full tradesmans pay. A kickback pits the torque of the saw against the muscles in your arms and the integrity of the timber and the saw often wins.

A few of the common causes of kickback are…

…inexperienced operator
…misaligned stock guide or blade
…lack of riving knife
…blunt or damaged blade.

You already have one of these that we know of.

I started sweating watching the first few seconds of your video. Its your life but ffs please be careful.
 

Orraloon

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I would think that if the smoke was from the motor that it would no longer be running. Smoke is usually a motors way of saying ''thats all folks''. As said its likely a blunt or wrong blade. As you dont have a riving knife yet a safe simple test would be just let it run for 5 mins then stop, unplug and see if the motor is hot. Also feel the arbor for heat as that will indicate if bearing is ok.
Regards
John
 

Alasdair

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If the blade is sharp and has a decent set on it and the right way round I would look at the belts If it hasn't been used for a long time it could be the belts that are on there way out or perhaps loose or perished on the surface. The rubber can degrade with time and when you switch it on you get smoke from them. It might be from excessive dust build up in the motor as well. Try a new set of belts at the correct tension and see.
 

Myfordman

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Take a logic step by step process.
Remove blade and belt(s). turn the motor by hand to see if it spins freely. run the motor for up to 30 minutes, It might get warm but there should be no smoke.
Check the arbour turns freely. take a marker pen mark the vee of the pulley all the way to the bottom and up the other side. Fit the belt, run the motor and spindle for a few minutes. observe the marks on the pulley. the ones on the side of the vee should have worn off but the bottom marks should still be present. If they are worn off, then the belt is worn out and needs replacing. If you have more than one belt then replace all with a matched set.
Check the two pulleys are perfectly in line. Adjust if needed to bring them into line.
Refit the blade making sure the tips of the teeth are pointing towards you on the infeed side of the saw.
Now and only now can you start to draw any conclusions about possible problems.
 

Blister

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The time taken to cut through that small piece of timber is excessive , My opinion the fault is blade related
The motor did not slow down when cutting , Also the motor looks more modern than the saw
Re blade the wrong way round , In a hurry to finish a job before it got dark I fitted a new chainsaw blade the wrong way round ,Did I condemn the suppliers :eek:Oh yes I did , Then the penny dropped , Whoops :)
 

Inspector

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...... Don't worry re: my fingers, I had a push stick for the right hand and my left is firmly posted to the table around 6" from the blade as a guide not holding onto the wood.........

Every one has covered the probable reasons for the smoking so I will address your explanation above. Keep in mind I live amongst the "blade guards are useless" types and started out the way myself. For the most part of your video you will probably make your cut without loosing fingers but at the very end you reached behind the blade to grab both pieces of wood to remove them. That is when you are most likely going to have a life altering accident. You will at some point have the wood catch the blade with the resulting kickback taking your hand back into the blade. It is also the time when people loose concentration and put their hand into the blade on the way to grab the offcuts or sweep away the dust. Yes people do that a lot. The lesson I'm trying to impart is never put your hand behind the blade to get something even with a guard! Use the push stick to push it on to outfield table or the floor.

Pete
 
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