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Scary Sharpening Tip

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Just watched this video by Jonathan Katz-Moses where he's just discovered the 'Scary Sharpening' system (has he been living under a rock?) ... anyway, he pointed out that if you spray the plate first with water, it gives you a chance to not only reposition the adhesive backed abrasive, but also work out the air bubbles.

Thought I'd share, as it's new to me.
 

Jacob

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transatlantic":2w7kuh3b said:
Just watched this video by Jonathan Katz-Moses where he's just discovered the 'Scary Sharpening' system (has he been living under a rock?) ... anyway, he pointed out that if you spray the plate first with water, it gives you a chance to not only reposition the adhesive backed abrasive, but also work out the air bubbles.

Thought I'd share, as it's new to me.
If you flood the plate and the sheet with water (though I'd use white spirit) you can use thin paper backed wet n dry as it sticks down well once it's flattened, is cheaper and flatter than the alternatives and is easy to remove. When dry store it between boards to keep it flat.
I only do it for occasional flattening ops not for sharpening - I'd use a trad oil stone.
 
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Jacob":4v20jpxq said:
transatlantic":4v20jpxq said:
Just watched this video by Jonathan Katz-Moses where he's just discovered the 'Scary Sharpening' system (has he been living under a rock?) ... anyway, he pointed out that if you spray the plate first with water, it gives you a chance to not only reposition the adhesive backed abrasive, but also work out the air bubbles.

Thought I'd share, as it's new to me.
If you flood the plate and the sheet with water (though I'd use white spirit) you can use thin paper backed wet n dry as it sticks down well once it's flattened, is flatter than the alternatives and is easy to remove. When dry store it between boards to keep it flat.
I've never had much luck doing that. The friction between the chisels and the paper seems to be greater than that of the paper/water/plate, and it slides all over. It also seems to cause it to roll up.
 

Jacob

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transatlantic":eg693ps5 said:
Jacob":eg693ps5 said:
transatlantic":eg693ps5 said:
Just watched this video by Jonathan Katz-Moses where he's just discovered the 'Scary Sharpening' system (has he been living under a rock?) ... anyway, he pointed out that if you spray the plate first with water, it gives you a chance to not only reposition the adhesive backed abrasive, but also work out the air bubbles.

Thought I'd share, as it's new to me.
If you flood the plate and the sheet with water (though I'd use white spirit) you can use thin paper backed wet n dry as it sticks down well once it's flattened, is flatter than the alternatives and is easy to remove. When dry store it between boards to keep it flat.
I've never had much luck doing that. The friction between the chisels and the paper seems to be greater than that of the paper/water/plate, and it slides all over. It also seems to cause it to roll up.
Has to be very wet, flooded, on the plate and the sheet.
 

thetyreman

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you can use oil as well with it, I use 3 in 1 oil with the scary sharp system, I found that water had a tendency to make it de-laminate from the glass plate.
 

Ttrees

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Charlesworth mentioned stretching the back of the paper burnishing it against the corner of the bench to stop it rolling.
 

Jacob

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thetyreman":1tufbdxs said:
you can use oil as well with it, I use 3 in 1 oil with the scary sharp system, I found that water had a tendency to make it de-laminate from the glass plate.
I'm talking about ordinary cheap paper backed wet n dry used with white spirit. I know it works. Maybe water is different and doesn't soak in so well. I haven't tried it (rust!)
 
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Jacob":2su6qyue said:
thetyreman":2su6qyue said:
you can use oil as well with it, I use 3 in 1 oil with the scary sharp system, I found that water had a tendency to make it de-laminate from the glass plate.
I'm talking about ordinary cheap paper backed wet n dry used with white spirit. I know it works. Maybe water is different and doesn't soak in so well. I haven't tried it (rust!)
Yep - I've noticed the rust too. For the lower grits, I don't use 3M, but this stuff, mostly beacuse I already had it. I do wipe it dry after each use, but there must still be tiny filings stuck in the abrasive, as the paper has turned a rusty colour.

This doesn't seem to be a problem with the 3M paper, I suspect due it's anti clogging properties, so all the filings do actually wipe off.

Not sure I would want to use white spirit though :p
 

Pete Maddex

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White spirit is mainly classed as an irritant. It has a fairly low acute toxicity by inhalation of the vapour, dermal (touching the skin) and oral routes (ingestion). However, acute exposure can lead to central nervous system depression resulting in lack of coordination and slowed reactions. Exposure to very high concentrations in enclosed spaces can lead to general narcotic effects (drowsiness, dizziness, nausea etc...) and can eventually lead to unconsciousness. Oral ingestion presents a high aspiration hazard. Prolonged or repeated skin exposure over a long period of time can result in severe irritant dermatitis, also called contact dermatitis.[2]

Exposure to an average white spirit concentration of 240 mg/m3 (40 ppm) for more than 13 years (of continuous exposure time) can lead to chronic central nervous system effects. Similar long-term studies have been made in which some of the observed effects included memory impairment, poor concentration, increased irritability etc. White spirit is implicated in the development of chronic toxic encephalopathy (CTE) among house painters. In severe cases CTE may lead to disability and personality changes.[2][3] These effects in painters were first studied in 1970s in the Nordic countries.[3]

Increased irritability, you don't say...

Water getting a bit wet...

Pete
 

Jacob

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So Pete it's white spirit which makes you so mad, bad and dangerous to know? :lol: Now you tell us!
You aren't supposed to be drinking it or swimming in it!
Water makes tools go rusty. In sufficient quantities drowning is possible. :shock:
 

Trevanion

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I use water imported from the Lake Biwa in Japan so that my tools are sharp like ancient samurai katana.
 

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Trevanion":2wpezoqq said:
I use water imported from the Lake Biwa in Japan so that my tools are sharp like ancient samurai katana.
Don't tell the others or they'll all want it. :roll:
 

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transatlantic":2v5sgdgm said:
(has he been living under a rock?)
Geez, yeah! He could be just trying to drive views rather than it being genuinely the case that he's never heard of it until recently (which, call me a cynic, I doubt is possible).

Regardless I deliberately didn't watch the vid when it came up on my YouTube feed because it's just another video – of about a zillion at this stage – on sharpening on abrasive paper, which wasn't even a new thing when the phrase was coined.

transatlantic":2v5sgdgm said:
... anyway, he pointed out that if you spray the plate first with water, it gives you a chance to not only reposition the adhesive backed abrasive, but also work out the air bubbles.
Also an old trick. This has been used commercially for placement of stickers/decals on various products for yonks, and it has long been popularised in how-to guides for allowing repositioning of adhesive films for window tinting and similar.
 

ED65

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Pete Maddex":3h2s2deo said:
White spirit...
Thanks for that Pete. This is exactly why I chose to move away from using it for honing. I use enough white spirit for other purposes (where I can't do without it) and wanted to reduce or eliminate exposure during honing, especially as I didn't want to wear gloves during to prevent direct skin contact.

Nobody knows how ongoing or lengthy low-level exposure to relatively safe stuff will affect them. I have more than a couple of friends who can no longer be around epoxies without gloves on (even a respirator in one case) because of pretty limited use of epoxy sculpting compounds, with most of the exposure occurring just at the mixing stage. While other people seem to be able to get away with it for years and years they can't know if negative effects are only around the corner, same way the other guys didn't right before it happened to them.
 
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ED65":dzus3atd said:
Also an old trick. This has been used commercially for placement of stickers/decals on various products for yonks, and it has long been popularised in how-to guides for allowing repositioning of adhesive films for window tinting and similar.
Fair enough. I've always been very careful NOT to get the adhesive wet as I just assumed it would stop it from sticking. So it was one of those, ... "god damnit! I've been doing it wrong all this time" moments :roll:
 

ED65

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transatlantic":2qqdobk6 said:
Fair enough. I've always been very careful NOT to get the adhesive wet as I just assumed it would stop it from sticking. So it was one of those, ... "god damnit! I've been doing it wrong all this time" moments :roll:
Yeah me too up to that point!

And in fairness there are loads of things with sticky stuff on the back where if you attempt to apply it to a wet surface you're not going to be happy with the results :lol:
 

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ED65":1jaz854e said:
transatlantic":1jaz854e said:
(has he been living under a rock?)
Geez, yeah! He could be just trying to drive views rather than it being genuinely the case that he's never heard of it until recently (which, call me a cynic, I doubt is possible).

Regardless I deliberately didn't watch the vid when it came up on my YouTube feed because it's just another video – of about a zillion at this stage – on sharpening on abrasive paper, which wasn't even a new thing when the phrase was coined.

transatlantic":1jaz854e said:
... anyway, he pointed out that if you spray the plate first with water, it gives you a chance to not only reposition the adhesive backed abrasive, but also work out the air bubbles.
Also an old trick. This has been used commercially for placement of stickers/decals on various products for yonks, and it has long been popularised in how-to guides for allowing repositioning of adhesive films for window tinting and similar.
I do more than spray it on, I drop the wet n dry (paper backed no adhesive) into a pool of the stuff and then pour it on top as well.
I noticed Pete's warnings about white spirit (news to me) but I don't do this often - just for flattening the occasional rusty plane sole which comes my way. I use it mixed with oil on my sharpening stones but I suspect this is well below any hazard level of exposure, such as a decorator might get.
 

AJB Temple

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I've never watched a scary sharp video. My father showed me how to get get my Footprint chisels and my Stanley No 4 plane blade sharp (all part of my youngsters too kit aged about 8 (I guess) - and all tools I still have and use). This was about 40 years ago. He used "wet and dry" either on a foundry plate, or a sheet of thick glass, and some liquid (can't remember what), to keep the paper down and thin lubricating oil from his can to lube the grinding surface. He was an engineer (Midlands) and I suspect he had been doing it since he was an apprentice. It's not new and it's not scary. I have no idea why people go on about it.

Tools were never rusty. If they were not used much they were stored in some special brown paper.
 

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Jacob":9wes6bvw said:
Trevanion":9wes6bvw said:
I use water imported from the Lake Biwa in Japan so that my tools are sharp like ancient samurai katana.
Don't tell the others or they'll all want it. :roll:
It's still cheaper than Honerite too.
 
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