Sash windows

[rich1911]

My windows are 150 years old - as far as I’m concerned, that’s a pretty good advert for pine.

Except that the pine they had 150 years ago is 150 times the quality of any pine you could get your hands on today.

I refitted everything, using folding wedges, oakum and lime mortar instead of foam and portland cement. Painted with linseed paint.

This is the correct way to do this but is also the most time consuming and laborious method. You could never do it this way and expect to make any money as people who tend to buy the windows have no clue about it and just want it as cheap as possible. If you're twice the price of everyone else, you'll never get any work.

As much as I would love to spend a week waiting for paint to dry, another hour per window ramming oakum into the window voids and then spend half a day mixing lime cement, it really isn't economical on a professional scale.

I agree that people aren’t generally willing to pay for it, hence all the problems so many windows now have. But if the OP is willing to do the work himself, it’s well worth doing IMO.

As for the the pine - I’ve normally been able to keep myself in old reclaimed pine. On my street alone, 5 houses must have had loft conversions in the last 5 years, with each one resulting in lots of rafters and some purlins ending up in skips, lovely 150 year old pine. My local reclaimed wood yard (Oxford wood recycling) normally has plenty of this sort of thing too.

This is all extra work of course, it needs denailing, planing and re sawing but if the OP find he only needs to make the boxes and doesn’t need to make any sashes, it’s eminently doable.

I have a shed full of reclaimed wood, in fact the shed is made from reclaimed wood too!

On the issue of refurbishment, is there a way to do a scarf joint tht wont fail in years to come?

To me it seems better to replace a cill or box lining than trying to fit a different bit of wood into it.

 

[MikeG.]

........On the issue of refurbishment, is there a way to do a scarf joint tht wont fail in years to come?.........

In a window? No. In oak framing, there are dozens of ways.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

... My windows are 150 years old - as far as I’m concerned, that’s a pretty good advert for pine...

I bet there are very few people who can find 50 year old ones that are still sound.

 

[rich1911]

... My windows are 150 years old - as far as I’m concerned, that’s a pretty good advert for pine...

I bet there are very few people who can find 50 year old ones that are still sound.

Ha! Yes indeed.

We have some sashes that are probably 120 years old and they are fine. Some that were maybe 30 years old which were rotten and some that are less than 10 years old and are rotting...

 

[doctor Bob]

It's great having 150 year old sashes, but I bet they are as drafty as ..........

They just weren't designed with draft free in mind in 1860's.
I had original ones in the house I demolished 1850's, just not worth lighting a fireas the drafts it caused through the windows were horrendous and the rattle it created was deafening.

The new ones are just so much better.

 

[thomashenry]

It's great having 150 year old sashes, but I bet they are as drafty as ..........

They just weren't designed with draft free in mind in 1860's.
I had original ones in the house I demolished 1850's, just not worth lighting a fireas the drafts it caused through the windows were horrendous and the rattle it created was deafening.

The new ones are just so much better.

Trivial DIY job to fit parting and staff beads with brush pile inserts. No draughts, no rattles.

 

[doctor Bob]

It's great having 150 year old sashes, but I bet they are as drafty as ..........

They just weren't designed with draft free in mind in 1860's.
I had original ones in the house I demolished 1850's, just not worth lighting a fireas the drafts it caused through the windows were horrendous and the rattle it created was deafening.

The new ones are just so much better.

Trivial DIY job to fit parting and staff beads with brush pile inserts. No draughts, no rattles.

Indeed, but not worth it on a house to be demolished. Anyway, not detracting from the thread but having had old ones and new ones I really think there is no comparison, however I now have double glazing and having viewed about 20 different companies windows, I think i have a top end set of windows and maybe I wasn't comparing to a top window of 1850's, such as a manor house etc. I'm not an expert, furniture is my game, so just my observation on my windows.

 

[thomashenry]

It's great having 150 year old sashes, but I bet they are as drafty as ..........

They just weren't designed with draft free in mind in 1860's.
I had original ones in the house I demolished 1850's, just not worth lighting a fireas the drafts it caused through the windows were horrendous and the rattle it created was deafening.

The new ones are just so much better.

Trivial DIY job to fit parting and staff beads with brush pile inserts. No draughts, no rattles.

Indeed, but not worth it on a house to be demolished. Anyway, not detracting from the thread but having had old ones and new ones I really think there is no comparison, however I now have double glazing and having viewed about 20 different companies windows, I think i have a top end set of windows and maybe I wasn't comparing to a top window of 1850's, such as a manor house etc. I'm not an expert, furniture is my game, so just my observation on my windows.

True

 

[doctor Bob]

This is the old house,
front, only one broken window pane.

Back, nice polycarbonate window and one window with 3 hardboard patches masticed on

Bloody hell it was a cold house

 

[thomashenry]

This is the old house,
front, only one broken window pane.

Back, nice polycarbonate window and one window with 3 hardboard patches masticed on

Bloody hell it was a cold house

Stunning house, though.

 

[doctor Bob]

New house, very nearly identical with a side extension of 50% and loft rooms.

Can you see why I prefer new windows

 

[sammy.se]

I can't tell the difference



Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

 

[thomashenry]

New house, very nearly identical with a side extension of 50% and loft rooms.

Can you see why I prefer new windows

That's lovely!

 

[Chip shop]

New house, very nearly identical with a side extension of 50% and loft rooms.

Snip

Can you see why I prefer new windows

Stunning. I am seriously envious. Did you do the project management yourself?

 

[rich1911]

This is where we are. Sometimes when its windy outside, you can feel the breeze inside!

 

[nabs]

about 20 years ago I lived in a 2 up 2 down victorian semi with sash windows all round, every one of which was painted shut and had rotten cills. To my untrained eyes they were write-offs and I got several quotes to have them all replaced with upc. Then a neighbour pointed out they could be refurbished and I got the Timber Window Company to just that - from memory the refurb costs were less than the upc replacements (although they had to be repainted - not cheap!)

I had no interest in woodwork at the time and with hindsight I wish I had paid more attention - I remember they removed all the windows, stripped them of paint, removed and replaced any rotten wood and then reglazed them with thin greenhouse glass to keep something like the look of the original (hand made?) panes - sounds just like what you did with your first two. What surprised me was how little rot there was, despite them obviously being pretty badly neglected for a number of years (decades?)

Anyhow they were as good as new when finished, gliding up and down perfectly and it was very pleasing to know they could be good for another 100 years (also a narrow escape as the plastic windows would have looked dreadful).

If I had the skills and the time (I don't have either!) it is the kind of job I think I'd find really satisfying, particularly since you could do it stages without lots of time pressure.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Years ago I lived in a '50s bungalow overlooking the N. Cornwall coast - in the winter we'd be cold with the heating on full and two open fires blazing. When the wind was up our reflections in the lounge window would go up and down a foot and the carpet lifted a rosewood dining table and eight chairs clean off the floor. :shock: One day on my motorbike I ducked a full dustbin blowing across the road - I should have realised how windy it was when I put the cat out and she blew across the garden.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

... and then reglazed them with thin greenhouse glass to keep something like the look of the original (hand made?) panes ...

One reason for doing this is that often there isn't room the box frame for heavy enough weights to balance a heavier sash, also sometimes is there isn't much depth in the rebates.

 

[Mmmmark]

Have a look at westbury windows and garden rooms in south woodham ferrers.
John Mumford sold his company a few years ago and now works for Westbury, their windows are better than mumford and wood in my opinion.

Can you provide some details on this? We looked at the Mumford London showroom and liked what we saw. Westbury doesn't have a London show room, so it's a bit of a trek. But some details might help us know if the trek would be worth while.

 

[Baja-king]

Building sash windows is a straight forward affair. I bought a Victorian house in 1997 that needed 22 replacement windows, I bought a book and dismantled an old one then renewed all of them with draft excluders etc. Saved a small fortune