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Rob Cosman Planing Technique

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Devmeister

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The difference in use between 65 and 62 is insignificant and the edge retention is the same. But O1 is readily available and straight forward to heat treat. So I see no benefit to going beyond O1.
 

D_W

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I think most makers see things the opposite way vs. you and generally how I see them - the quest to find a better blade is a perpetual opportunity (it is).

mismatch comparisons also provide opportunity (translation - you can make O1 or 1095 or steels like either seem like a lot of different things just by choosing how they're hardened and tempered. 62 hardness O1 is just wonderful. At 59, it's probably great in a pocket knife. In a chisel, it's a bit soft - noticeably so. Good chisels tend to run around 61+ for hardwoods.

I can't say much about the need for high hardness chisels - i'm enamored with a relatively inexpensive razor steel called 26c3 that's like white 1B - what it does more or less is end up with the hardness potential of japanese steel. that's for me as a maker, though -I like the feel. It's great in use, but the steel is harder to heat treat than O1, so it's not something for beginners (if it's done in a mediocre way, then it's even with O1 in chisels and less wear resistant in irons).

What I don't know is just how hard vintage japanese chisels were typically as I've gotten a couple of hundred from japan and the hardness is all over the board. (maybe it's only 150, I don't know). There may be some use for softwoods where ultra high hardness is desirable.

But I can't think of anything that I'd ever do where white/26c3 would make a difference over well tempered O1.

I can guarantee almost without exception, though, if you could make a chisel that's 2 points harder than other chisels and holds up slightly better than O1, you could market on the hardness number and the test results and sell it like crazy.

I hate that kind of thing, so it won't be me. 26c3 needs to be heat treated by hand, too, so I'm confident that no skeezy toolmaker is going to have success with it in some kind of quick commercial process. They won't be able to handle how much it can warp, either.
 

Adam W.

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Holtey has remanufactured to Norris A13 . But his precision made dovetailed steel planes are far too hot for anyone's pocket other than the ultra-rich. We're talking typically 6k as an example for any of his planes, and I shudder to think what the A13 price might be.

This is typical of the prices Holtey A1 Jointer Plane a cool £10,560.00


And for the A13, thumb through this and you can see why his planes cost so much "Holtey Classic Handplanes A13 Technical page."
Does it come with a sharpening butler ?
 

Just4Fun

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It seems like we are all in this perpetual rat race to improve the past because we perceive a problem that isn’t necessarily there.
I don't think that is true. At least it doesn't apply to me. I just like making things. Do I do a better job than my father's generation? Or my grandfather's? Probably not, and I don't much care - I just do the best I can. As for design skills, I have no delusions of adequacy. I just (try to) make what I want to make.
 

TRITON

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I sometimes think some exponents of furniture making want to liken it to an art form.
Plane must be this, iron sharpened this way. You must hold the handles that way. Deviation wrong.
Utter baloney in my opinion.
Too many saying you need follow this makers technique, or that you tubers technique. Worshiping them like they are gods. Up their own.. ahem.. behinds.
I'm more than sure the cabinetmakers of old didnt spent their tea breaks wittering on about such nonsense.
 

Devmeister

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I don't think that is true. At least it doesn't apply to me. I just like making things. Do I do a better job than my father's generation? Or my grandfather's? Probably not, and I don't much care - I just do the best I can. As for design skills, I have no delusions of adequacy. I just (try to) make what I want to make.

My comment was in regard to the arms race to make a better plane blade using powder metalurgy tool steels. In my own experiments I have found this to be a rat race. The unique set of requirements for a plane blade can be met with plain 01 which is quite workable in small shops without the need for digital ovens and cryrogenic quench tanks.
 

Devmeister

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I sometimes think some exponents of furniture making want to liken it to an art form.
Plane must be this, iron sharpened this way. You must hold the handles that way. Deviation wrong.
Utter baloney in my opinion.
Too many saying you need follow this makers technique, or that you tubers technique. Worshiping them like they are gods. Up their own.. ahem.. behinds.
I'm more than sure the cabinetmakers of old didnt spent their tea breaks wittering on about such nonsense.

I think your right. And it becomes more irritating when some of these gods drop the hard sell in your lap at the end. I am willing to try a new idea. If it works great. If I don’t like it in favor of another approach well that is great to.
 

Orraloon

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I sometimes think some exponents of furniture making want to liken it to an art form.
Plane must be this, iron sharpened this way. You must hold the handles that way. Deviation wrong.
Utter baloney in my opinion.
Too many saying you need follow this makers technique, or that you tubers technique. Worshiping them like they are gods. Up their own.. ahem.. behinds.
I'm more than sure the cabinetmakers of old didnt spent their tea breaks wittering on about such nonsense.
Few professionals would talk shop and in a lot of places it was frowned on.
Acceptable topics were how much you drank last night and whether or not you got lucky.
Regards
John
 

Devmeister

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I like the work of bill carter. Check out his YouTube channel. His shop is small and and basic. I bring him up because he sharpens plane blades like me. A. Single bevel with the corners slightly relieved. No curves. No back bevels. No micro bevels. It’s not that hard. Sharpen the damn thing and get on with it.
 

Devmeister

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Few professionals would talk shop and in a lot of places it was frowned on.
Acceptable topics were how much you drank last night and whether or not you got lucky.
Regards
John

OMG Funny you should say that. My last shop closed last week so I am job hunting. Turns out our HR lady got the sack. The conversation last week was were she had her tattoo. Apparrently she showed my boss and the super where it was. Little left for imagination!
 

Adam W.

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I sometimes think some exponents of furniture making want to liken it to an art form.
Plane must be this, iron sharpened this way. You must hold the handles that way. Deviation wrong.
Utter baloney in my opinion.
Too many saying you need follow this makers technique, or that you tubers technique. Worshiping them like they are gods. Up their own.. ahem.. behinds.
I'm more than sure the cabinetmakers of old didnt spent their tea breaks wittering on about such nonsense.

I agree, it's snobbery in a lot of cases.

Anyway, I think most contemporary furniture is over designed and over worked.

For example......Bluuurgh, pass the bucket !


kremarbl_white.jpg


It's hideous.
 

TRITON

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Yeah thats not pretty 😬 The legs are the worst.
In fact it looks like they were taken off something else and stuck on as an afterthought.

A single pedestal in the same timber would be an improvement.
 

Craig22

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I agree, it's snobbery in a lot of cases.

Anyway, I think most contemporary furniture is over designed and over worked.

For example......Bluuurgh, pass the bucket !


View attachment 127864

It's hideous.

It is a cabinet by one of the all time greats, James Krenov. The legs are typical of his work, and are known as ballet dancer legs. Probably built in the 1960's.

 
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Jacob

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I agree, it's snobbery in a lot of cases.

Anyway, I think most contemporary furniture is over designed and over worked.

For example......Bluuurgh, pass the bucket !


View attachment 127864

It's hideous.
The wet skid mark motif is an odd one.
 
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Adam W.

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It is a cabinet by one of the all time greats, James Krenov. The legs are typical of his work, and are known as ballet dancer legs. Probably built in the 1960's.

I know, that's why I put it there.

@Jacob Somewhat reminiscent of something found on the pavement in Romford on a Sunday morning.
 

Jacob

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You guys think you could make cabinets as well as Krenov? Well good on you.
They aren't that special except he just hit the zeitgeist somehow and good luck to him! I think he was surprised; he's quite frank about it in some of his interviews and talks of himself as just an old hippy amateur.
I do think a lot of board matched spaltered beech etc does look horribly "organic" in a way not intended and is well out of fashion!
 
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