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Newbie_Neil

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Hi all

Please note that this thread is not trying to knock Record Power. I found this on the Record web site when looking for material to reply to Aidan's thread re Record.

This is on the Record power site under company information: -

"Today’s market is AWASH WITH ME-TOO PRODUCT reducing choice for the consumer and relying solely on price to recommend it. REGARDLESS OF THE BADGE IT MAY WEAR, IT COMES MAINLY FROM THE SAME DISTANT SOURCES and whilst prices continue to fall, Record Power offers an AFFORDABLE HIGH QUALITY ALTERNATIVE to the user who has experienced these ‘SO CALLED BARGAINS’ and realised that true value for money is recognisable by ease of use, reliability, longevity and performance and that these are the values Record Power products aspire to.

WE MANUFACTURE MOST OF OUR PRODUCTS on our 33 acre site in Sheffield, England. As a volume manufacturer with our own foundries, machining and assembly we are in full control of our quality and costs and can make premium quality an affordable luxury – especially compared to machines of comparable quality which typically cost twice as much (and more). "

I inserted the CAPITALS.

Now this seems totally at odds with my perception of Record Power.

Presumably they manufacture the Startrite range in Sheffield, but surely all of the "Select" range must be off-shore.

So how do Record Power measure "most of our products"?

Cheers
Neil
 

Adam

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That was good for a chuckle. Sounds like "marketing" BS to me. If only the statement was true, I'd consider buying from them.

Adam
 
A

Anonymous

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As far as I am aware, Record have sold two ranges for quite a while; the green range of tools (record power??) are decent quality and manufactured in Sheffield whilst the blue range (I believe they are called record select) are low quality tat and are made in china etc.

Well this used to be the case :)
 

Alf

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Tony":iswhav50 said:
the green range of tools (record power??) are decent quality and manufactured in Sheffield
Which is what they want you to think... The M--- is green, but it's only claim to a connection with Sheffield is the big yellow sticker on the side. These days you can't seem to take anything on trust :(

Cheers, Alf
 

Newbie_Neil

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Hi Alf

I notice that DM-Tools have taken to adding the country of origin on some of the Record equipment.

RECORD TSPP250 10IN TABLE SAW WITH CAST IRON TABLE WITH RADIAL CROSSCUT ACTION
The machine is made for Record in the far East and carries their usual 5 year warranty

STARTRITE 301E 200MM, CAST TABLE & STAND
NOTE. this in now made in Europe and not the u.k.

STARTRITE 351SE 300MM,CAST TABLE, STAND & MITRE FENCE
NOTE. this in now made in Europe and not the u.k.

Cheers
Neil
 

Alf

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Neil,

Oh really? Good for D&M. Sad to see Startrite stuff amongst them though; naively I thought they might continue to be UK made :(

Cheers, Alf

P.S. Congrats on the big 500 :wink:
 

Newbie_Neil

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Hi Alf

Alf":3o0z7vtu said:
Neil, Oh really? Good for D&M. Sad to see Startrite stuff amongst them though; naively I thought they might continue to be UK made :( Cheers, Alf
Yes, it was a big surprise to me. I can only assume that D & M are afraid of some comeback from people who are expecting to be buying British, especially if they have read the Record Power web site.

Alf":3o0z7vtu said:
P.S. Congrats on the big 500 :wink:
Oh no dear Alf, the congratulations are all yours. :wink:

I'd also like to add my thanks, to yours, for the good work that Charley does in the background. :D

Cheers
Neil
 

Newbie_Neil

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This is the reply I received from Record Power.

Hi Neil,

You are quite right to pick up on this. Due to internal problems in the company that developed this site for us, which has lead to a huge delay in the second phase of the site, we are currently in the process of changing to a new development and hosting company. There are parts of this site that we can administer ourselves, but the static information is not part of that and very difficult for us to change at the moment for obvious reasons.

There is no intention to mislead. At the time of writing that, we manufactured about 70% of the machines (by sales volume) that we sold in Sheffield. If you look back in some of the threads in this forum you will see exhaustive discussions about all the changes simce then but in summary,

1) Last year the old parent company of Record Power took the decision to cease manufacturing the majority of its products in Sheffield and in the case of Record Power only four weeks notice of this was given. This clearly gave no time for a proper run down plan or build up of buffer stock causing some severe product availability problems last year. It also caused major problems for materials and sub-contract suppliers.

2) This decision was such a threat to the continued existence of Record Power and its dealer and end user base (product support etc) that a successful management buy out was launched as the parent company appeared to have no long term commitment to it.

3) The buy out included the purchase of all the intellectual property, designs, patterns, jigs, tools and fixtures of the products previously made in Sheffield and a major project was undertaken to get them back into circulation and ensure long term after sales support.

4) We are currently about 2/3rds of the way through this, which you can imagine is a huge and complicated task - and many of our 'Sheffield' products are now back in production. We have done this by sub-contracting their manufacture on an exclusive basis (they are made with our tooling and to our designs)to a number of manufacturing partners. Some still in the UK, some in Europe and some in the Far East depending on the core skills of the partner factories, the products and their volumes. In the case of the lathes, morticers and drill stands we have even shipped three of the large CNC machining centres to the partner factory so that they can still use the same designs, patterns jigs, tools, programs and even machines as we used in Sheffield. These are still exclusive Record Power products and we believe they still offer the the same benefits as they did before - our product philosophy has not changed, just the location of the factories. Indeed, in some cases the move has lowered the cost of production and this has been passed on to the consumer increasing value further.

5) In common with many manufacturers and most of our European competitors, we always had to supplement our own manufactured product with 'factored' or bought-in products made under our brand to fill gaps in the range that we could not make either due to manufacturing expertise (e.g. we had great skills in cast iron but no facility for plastic injection moulding)or cost price issues. We also had some exclusive agencies - such as Lurem, and we have always been up front about the origin of these products.

6) Select was a range of mainly Far Eastern (but not exclusively - some German and some Sheffield made) products aimed at the first time buyer and budget market. In our literature at the time we explained the origin of these and that this was in order to achieve price points we would not otherwise be able to reach. The intention was to use our skills to specify these products better than comparable products at the same prices and we believe we did this in most cases. However, because our roots have firmly been in the 'upgrade' product area we found that soemtimes the products were being bought as a lower priced alternative to our usual competitors in the mid and upper market and then they disappointed some users.

You will see from our activity over the past year and the merging with Startrite that our new products all fall into the bigger, heavier 'upgrade' market that we have always had our roots in and this is the way we intend to progress. We want to provide products that users enjoy using and give sound reliable performance for many years.

Sorry for such a long reply - but we are keen not to mislead and be open. This is why we have an open forum such as this and have to take the rough with the smooth. We believe that being open is the only way to build long term trust even when it can sometimes be painful.

We have had some massive projects over the last year - an MBO, moving factories, moving the business twice (once into a temporary home and now into our permanent home), divorcing ourselves from the parent company and therefore taking on all the functions that used to be shared, new computer systems etc. This has sometimes lead to service levels below those we want or intend to give in the future and long delays on some projects (such as the update and upgrade of the website - though this is now a priority).

However a large number of these projects are now complete or nearing completion, a large number of products that were not avaialble are now back in production. We are now in our permanent home and the new IT and systems are bedded in and through the rest of this year we are confident our customers will beign to see the improvements and commitment that will make us the customer focussed company we intend to be and hopefully make up for any frustration some may have experienced in the last 12 months.

Many thanks

Record Power
 

woodshavings

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Hi Neil

That response from Record Power speaks volumes about the customer focus and business ethic of the original parent company - Irving.

If they give only 4 weeks notice, what confidence is there for product and customer support for the products continuing with Irving?

As far as I am concerned, I will not buy anything with the Irving label if there is any chance it needs on going support for spares etc.

With regard to Record Power, I wish them well although I remain confused about their intentions with Startrite - do they mean they will have a single combined range of Startrite/Record Power machines aimed at the mid range market? Time will tell.
 

Chris Knight

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I am very impressed by the reply from Record to Neil. I think it bodes well for the future if the company as it is now, is prepared to take the time to respond in this depth to a customer query.

I certainly hope the MBO works for them. I am sure there is a market for quality products in the semi-pro area that many of us seem to be interested in when talking woodworking machinery. All things being equal in terms of quality and features , I would buy British first and could wear about 10% on the price for the privilege of supporting our own manufacturing industry. The trouble is, I suspect, that the present excuse for a government has lumbered our domestic producers with far more than 10% oncosts.
 

Newbie_Neil

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Hi Woodshavings and Chris

I must say that Record went up in my estimation after reading their reply. Also, the fact that it was posted at 13.32 on a SUNDAY. :eek:

Only time will tell how they get on but they seem to be doing the right things and I wish them well.

Neil
 

Adam

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Thats a very good response, and like it said, quite honest, and open.

A
 

Alf

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Well I've mulled over that response from Record, and while it is pretty open, they seem to be saying something rather odd.

As I read it, they didn't have time to arrange new supplies of materials or sub-contractors for the already set up factory in Sheffield, but they did have time to ship large and expensive pieces of equipment across to the other side of the world in order that they could then ship the finished products (out of stock of course, 'cos they were left in the lurch etc etc) all the way back again from t'other side of the world to make their customers happy. Those same customers who probably bought Record in the first place because they had faith in something built in, er, Sheffield. Is that right? Cutting costs was just a happy by-product of this clear thinking then? Hmm :? Not that I mind Record doing that, it's their funeral, but trying to dress it up as an improvement? Crazy man. 8)

Cheers, Alf
 

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