Record CL4 Owners - Something Interesting (Maybe)

[NormanKing]

I hadn’t originally intended to post this information but it has been so useful to me that I decided to share it with the members of this forum.

As you know, the CL4 variable speed unit is fully programmable and has been setup by Record to (Quote) “comply with CE regulations for the device in question”. (The settings for ramp up/down speeds, top speed, overload tolerance etc).

I now have (don’t ask how) a complete list of the CL4 speed unit settings as well as the procedure on how to change them.

I’ve already adjusted the ramp down speed on my lathe from 8 seconds to 3 (same as ramp up speed), and just to see if it could do it, temporarily moved the top speed from 100 to 150 (probably about 4500rpm), but I think the standard 3000rpm is fast enough anyway and restored the setting to normal.
It may be possible to enable reverse and alter the threshold that the overload (USF) cuts in at, although I’m not sure how yet. (Not all of the settings are obvious and I didn’t want to change anything without understanding what it would do)

Anyway, it’s up to the moderators of this forum to let me know if it’s okay to post this information (I don’t want to break any rules) and of course to you CL4 owners, do you want it? (Keeping in mind that it will invalidate your warranty if it all goes wrong).

Post your opinions please, and if it’s a positive response I’ll post the information in a few days time.

 

[Newbie_Neil]

Hi Norman

If someone wants to change any settings to their machine/s, then that is a decision that they alone make and live with any consequences. The individual is responsible for their own actions.

Presumably, it is set the way it is to meet EU/Uk legislation and UKW strongly recommends that you follow all such advice/legislation.

If anybody wishes to discuss the merits of making changes, or the changes themselves, then please feel free given the above caveat.

Cheers
Neil

 

[Taffy Turner]

I am happy with the settings that my lathe came with, apart from the ramp down - 8 seconds is ridiculous!

However, what are the implications of reducing it to three seconds - is there a danger to the motor / inverter from excessive back e.m.f., or is it because they are concerned that if it ramps down to quickly with a large workpiece, then the momentum of the workpiece may over-run, and cause the chuck to unscrew?

I would very much like to reduce the ramp down time, but obviously not at the expense of wrecking the motor and / or the inverter.

There are a few electrical engineers on this forum, so how about it guys - what do you think?

 

[NormanKing]

I would very much like to reduce the ramp down time, but obviously not at the expense of wrecking the motor and / or the inverter.

I've been using mine at three seconds now for quite a while turning some very large heavy pieces without problem, and given that the ramp up is three seconds I think the motor can handle it.

There are a few electrical engineers on this forum, so how about it guys - what do you think?

That's a very good idea. I was going to suggest that anyone with an electrical engineering background comment on the complete set of variables and give their opinion on what they do.

Now that the moderators are happy, I'll post the information in the next few days.

UPDATE
I've just tried to post the settings but I am having difficulty displaying it in a form that remains readable.
I currently have them laid out in an Excel Spreadsheet but all of the formatting disappears when I paste it into the forum.
Does anyone know how to make tabs work on this forum?

 

[Newbie_Neil]

Hi Norman

Does anyone know how to make tabs work on this forum?

Sorry, no.

What about people sending you a pm with their email address?

Cheers
Neil

 

[NormanKing]

What about people sending you a pm with their email address?

That's probably the best idea, so if anyone wants this information send me a PM.

 

[dedee]

Norman, using a PM may be the cleanest way but an alternative is to copy the data in excel then paste into MS Paint then save as a jpg file store the picture on a hosting sight then put the link on a message as usual.

Andy

 

[Adam]

If you don't have any online storage facilities for images - drop me an email - and I'll convert to an image file - and then people can view it directly from this website.

Adam

 

[mudman]

Another alternative is to save the spreadsheet as Formatted Text(space delimited) file which will give it an extension of .prn.
If you open this up using wordpad, notepad or whatever you will have a nicely formatted table. You can then paste this into the post.
Only trouble is, I'm not sure if the extra spaces will be stripped out by the browser when it is rendered.

Hmm, trying it here...

a 2 3 4
b 4 5 6
c 4 5 6
d 4 5 6

Yep, strips out the spaces. But add the code tags and you get:

a              2       3       4
b              4       5       6
c              4       5       6
d              4       5       6

And Robert is your venerable old uncle. :wink:

 

[NormanKing]

After some fiddling around I managed to get the code function working (thanks mudman), so here it is.

Parameter	Value	Units		Description

bFr			 50		 Hz		Base Mains Frequency
ACC			  3		Sec		Ramp Up Time
dEC			  8		Sec		Ramp Down Time
LSP			 15		 Hz		Low Speed
HSP			100		 Hz		High Speed (Will go beyond 100)
SP2			 15		 Hz	
SP3			 25		 Hz	
ltH			4.2		  A	
L2A			yes		  -		Level 2 Access - Set to yes to access items below
			
FrH			Var		 Hz	
LCr			Var		  A	
Uln			Var		  V	
tHr			Var		  %	
tHd			Var		  %	
Uns			230		  V	
Frs			 50		 Hz	
Ufr			 20		  %	
Crl			 50		  %	
FLG			 33		  %	
SLP			1.5		 Hz	
LI 			IC4		  -	
Alt			 5v		  -	
Atr			 no		  -	
FCS			 no		  -		Restore Settings to Factory Default - Leave Alone
IdC			3.6		  A	
tdC			  1		Sec	
LOC			yes		  -		Memory Lock - Set to no to allow setting changes
L2A			 no		  -

To make changes you need to scroll down to the L2A setting using the arrow keys, press the Mode button and change the value to yes (using the arrow keys). Press the mode button again to take you back one step to L2A.
You can then scroll through all of the settings shown above.
When you are on the setting you want to change press the Mode button key and adjust the value with the arrow keys. (Note: None of the settings can be changed until LOC is set to no). Press the Mode key to return.

If anyone with an electrical engineering background can have a guess at what the other settings do I’d be interested to know.

 

[andygc]

I know it's an old thread, but the full details of the Lenze controller used by Record (in my CL4 at least) are easily discoverable by searching for Lenze-SMDL-Manual. I haven't tried adding a reversing switch yet - I need to make sure I understand how Record have set it up - they appear to use an error code to free-wheel to a stop.

 

[Paul Hannaby]

I do something similar with the inverter on my Wivamac lathe. I change the acceleration/deceleration ramp settings depending on the size of the workpiece (anything from 3 to 15 seconds). I have also adjusted the min and max frequency settings to extend the speed range of each pulley.
One thing to watch if you have a large workpiece and a short deceleration ramp is that the chuck or faceplate can unscrew so adjust these functions with care!
I think the reference to the CE regulations is that woodworking machines are supposed to stop within 10 seconds. However, there are times with a lathe where that would be dangerous and a longer deceleration is needed. Interestingly, most non-variable speed lathes just have on/off motors with no braking so the stopping time would be dependent on the friction in the bearings and inertia of the workpiece.

 

[tekno.mage]

Oh - so that's why modern lathes come with the inverters set to that annoying powered deceleration. I much prefer the way our old club Vicmarc works - with freewheel deceleration, which means you can slow the lathe quickly if you want by holding the handwheel. Powered deceleration is potentially dangerous as it fights you trying to stop the lathe faster by holding the handwheel - which under certain circumstances (something caught in the rotating work, for instance) you may want to do. It's interesting that several lathe manufacturers provide the programming book for the relevant inverter with the lathe! I have one for a Record Power lathe and also one for an Axminster lathe, so the implication is that the purchaser could re-program if they wanted to!