My Tossed Off Day.

[Chip shop]

Sorry to sound like the old git I'm becoming, but I'm pretty peeved :lol:

An acquaintance rang last night saying a friend of theirs needed some windows urgently. I replied saying I've no time at the moment, but gave them the number of a couple of other local joinery firms.

10 minutes later, the guy that wants the windows is back on the phone stating that the numbers I gave them aren't picking up (this is ~18:00 on a Friday), I told them that may have more joy on Monday, to which he said they needed the windows fitting on Monday! I said that if it was real window emergency (really?) I could do it over the weekend. Them: brilliant, thanks go for it...

07:00 I'm at my suppliers spending £500 on timber, sash stays, locks and other paraphernalia.

09:00 I'm back at the workshop ringing the people, wondering if they want flush or storm proof, and what about glazing? No answer.

10:00 They get back to me with flush, left hand hung casements, with one fixed light, dims TBC. Cool I can run the profile.

12:00 Profile is sorted how about the window dimensions...no answer.

13:00 Tenoner & mortiser are ready to roll.

13:15 spindle is ready to rock with the rebate block.

14:00 I ring asking dimensions again! "We're not sure yet" (the guy gets his wife to pick up the phone this time!)

15:00 Same, "not sure"

16:00 'We've bought some second hand windows off eBay, we'll not need any more.'

I'm not bothered about the money, but it's a whole day I've lost with my family. Trying to do people bloody favours.

 

[adidat]

I would certainly consider charging him a days labour!

Adidat

 

[Stanleymonkey]

That's just rude.

I wonder if they'll have the cheek to phone you when the ebay ones arrive? Can you come and fit them please?

 

[ColeyS1]

Don't mix business with pleasure. Charge them labour and materials. You shouldn't be out of pocket for trying to bend over backwards to help. To even consider doing that after asking for help, they must be jerks !
I'm guessing it must have been single glazed to be able to have it ready for Monday? I can get dg units in a week, but not 2 days notice.

Coley

 

[Beau]

Think you have every right to feel peeved.

Bill them for the day at least but it wont give you your family time back :evil:

 

[MattRoberts]

I wouldn't move an inch without getting agreement of the work & costs in writing - then you have grounds to charge them if they cancel. An agreement can be signed, scanned and emailed in a matter of minutes if needed, so would still work in 'emergency' situations

 

[custard]

30% non refundable cash deposit before work begins...or I go out sailing instead.

 

[lurker]

You seem rather naive or live in an area where there are mainly honest folks.
As custard says money where your mouth is before any work starts.

 

[RobinBHM]

Who needs windows so urgently?

Any builder can make a dummy frame, with perspex or boarding and wait for windows in the normal joinery lead time.

Its easy to get caught out by a persuasive customer, the best way to avoid it is to have a set process for everybody and stick to it. That way you dont have to feel any obligation just let the order process dictate.

IE get an order acknowledgement signed or agreed in an email and a deposit for any bespoke work. Without a deposit there is no committment, its as simple as that.

I got caught recently by a smallish job, agreed a price then when the customer came to collect he started complaining about numerous details and tried to say he would pay half only. I refused, so Ive still got the work. The strange thing is that this job required the customers existing oak door and ironmongery, which I also still have so its goung to cost the customer a lot more to get the job completed......perhaps he bought something off ebay as well

 

[Chip shop]

Naive? not really...well maybe a little bit :lol: . I live in a pretty rural part of the country where things are perhaps done a little more casually. Unless it was a major job I'd never dream of asking anyone for a deposit.

The weird thing about this job was the apparent tight deadline. I quite enjoy working under a little pressure and was looking forward to getting my head down, brain off.

Anyhow, there's nothing lost, other than a day (that I wouldn't have been working anyway) kicking my heels.

 

[lurker]

Unfortunately the country is getting full of people with no moral compass.
Your inconvenience means nothing too them

They (think) know their rights but are unable to comprehend they have responsibilities

 

[Chip shop]

I'm guessing it must have been single glazed to be able to have it ready for Monday? I can get dg units in a week, but not 2 days notice.

Coley

Single glazed yes. If I was dealing with units it would have been a different matter. In fact, I have the glass in the workshop and was kinda keen to get it out of the way on this job.

Actually the glazing was the only real detail I could get out of them, and when I mentioned building regs they changed the subject right sharp. I reckon they must have been converting an out-building into a meth lab. I only saw one episode of the documentary 'Breaking Bad' and it didn't cover the type of glazing required.

 

[thetyreman]

you need to start charging people deposits, people like this think they are entitled to special treatment, and probably annoy everyone around them.

 

[AndyT]

Maybe next time, if you don't want to be formal about a deposit, you could at least be very clear with customers about what you will be doing for them and at what expense, like you explained it in your post here.

It's possible that your non-customers have no imagination and just think you always have plenty of suitable wood just lying about, and that making windows is as simple as putting up a shelf.

 

[tomatwark]

I would give them a bill for materials at least, why should you be out pocket.

I suspect that this will not be the first time they have done this and it is probably why they wanted them in a hurry as they have messed other trades around.

My policy is no deposit no work and that does not matter what size the job is.

You are not a bank why should you fund someone else's life style.

I would also mention what has happened to other trades you know locally.

 

[Chip shop]

POST SCRIPT: Had a call at tea-time tonight, saying they need two new windows after all. LOL!

 

[RobinBHM]

I have a feeling I know where youd like to put those 2 windows

If you can get a big deposit, It may be worth doing the windows to get your wasted time back. Of course inflation has been bad in the last 24 hours, mustve increased that window price some 50%......

I guess the ebay windows they got didnt fit, which wouldnt be a surprise.

 

[tomatwark]

and I hope you told them it would be at least 6 weeks until you could do them.

 

[Chip shop]

It was pretty funny, to be honest. As the call arrived I was lying on the floor trying to drive a self tapper into the burst seam in the water jacket in my fireplace. The mood was fairly grim as the females of the household were fussing about, trying to protect various valuables from the spray, and the other male was desperately trying to wrench his XBox from under the telly.

For some bizarre reason I answered the phone. The ensuing conversation contained many fruit based expletives.

 

[Bm101]

I'd treat these people in the same regard they seem to hold you. I'd bill them for time, labour and materials already spent. Then I'd ramp up my normal costs based on the way they have treated you by a fair percentage for the time you lost and the work they want you to do now. I'm in a different industry but how they treated you was just outrageous.