Mitre/Glue up nightmare

[thecoder]

I'll stick with my locked mitres! :lol:

Roy.

HOW MUCH !!! I nearly fell of mi perch :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axcaliber-45 ... rod783050/

 

[Digit]

Phew! Fortunately that is for a spindle moulder. It seems that Axminster no longer do the smaller ones, pity.

Roy.

 

[tomatwark]

If you have router table you could buy this one.

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axcaliber-mi ... rod805970/

Tom

 

[andy king]

Andy its so simple can you not work it out for yourself?

Say its 10mm thick timber.

Vertical board in Jacobs sketch
1. cut a 10mm wide by 7mm high rebate by whatever means you want router table would be accurate or a rebate block.
2. With a 45deg cutter in the router table mitre the remaining 3mm thick end or use the spindle, saw bench or shoot it by hand

Horizontal bard in his sketch

1. Cut a 3mm deep by 7mm high rebate in the end using any of the above methods
2. With a 45 deg cutter raised up in the table or spindle mitre the remaining 3mm of the end. Could be done with a saw and SUVA guard

To speed things up the two rebates would be done first then the two mitres.

Simples

One other point with theis joint if you are cutting a rebate for the top or bottom then have the rebate extend to cover the corner rebate, that way it will look like a mitred joint from above & below.

Jason

Hi Jason,

it's not that I don't know how to do it, but the quote from Jacob 'which is much easier to make' simply isn't true when compared to a basic mitre. That in itself is all about accuracy of the cut and the length of components, nothing else, so in itself, straightforward enough.
It was the half a tale and what was required to make 'easily' it I was trying to get him to qualify, as I can see it's not a joint to cut quickly by hand, and ideally needs a spindle or router table to make it successfully, along with suitable cutters, so not cheap for a one off speculative piece. Worthwhile if you make a lot of boxes, but if that was the case, a lock mitre cutter would be far simpler than multiple passes for rebates and mitres. On a tablesaw, there aren't many that come with SUVA guarding as standard.
That is what I was saying first and foremost, the joint isn't as easy as is stated when compared to a basic mitre, and a basic set of handtools will do the job for standard mitres far quicker, it just requires a swipe with a plane on a shooting board to sweeten as neccessary.
I was hoping Jacob would come up with a definitive way of doing the joint he sketched to clarify one way or the other in case i (and maybe others?) was missing something - I wasn't as far as I can see.

Cheers,
Andy

 

[tomatwark]

Phew! Fortunately that is for a spindle moulder. It seems that Axminster no longer do the smaller ones, pity.

Roy.

They did up to 5 minutes ago.

It must be this free deliver they are offering at the moment, which means the stock keeps changing :lol: :lol:

Tom

 

[Digit]

Yeah, I just checked the dimensions again, unhelpfully most suppliers no longer seem to included info about timber thicknesses.

Roy.

 

[thecoder]

Phew! Fortunately that is for a spindle moulder. It seems that Axminster no longer do the smaller ones, pity.

Roy.

Thats a relief,how easy or difficult are they to set up Roy ?



dave

 

[tomatwark]

Roy

Axminster do.

It is right at the end of the description when you click on more info.

Not the most helpful of places. The description not Axminster.

Tom

 

[Jacob]

it's not that I don't know how to do it, but the quote from Jacob 'which is much easier to make' simply isn't true when compared to a basic mitre. ....
Andy

Good grief, will this never end! :roll:
Yes it is easier. The two rebates are dead simple by most means. Then the mitreing only has to be done to the thin tongue remaining, instead of the whole board end, and only the visible end needs to be a good fit.

 

[Digit]

Thanks Tom.
Put it this way Dave, for a one off box, forget it!
But there is also the point to remember that the basic box is used for other such things as clocks, writing slopes, small cabinets etc, so if you are thinking along those lines then they are worth the effort.
They are swines to set up first time! They cannot be cut on a table without a suitable sled or similar, they cannot be run along the table fence 'cos as you make the cut the timber is running against the fence with a fine 45 edge.
But with the proper jigs they make a good, strong joint that requires little in the way of squaring up.

Roy.

 

[thecoder]

Thanks Tom.
Put it this way Dave, for a one off box, forget it!
But there is also the point to remember that the basic box is used for other such things as clocks, writing slopes, small cabinets etc, so if you are thinking along those lines then they are worth the effort.
They are swines to set up first time! They cannot be cut on a table without a suitable sled or similar, they cannot be run along the table fence 'cos as you make the cut the timber is running against the fence with a fine 45 edge.
But with the proper jigs they make a good, strong joint that requires little in the way of squaring up.

Roy.

Ok Roy thanks for the honest apraisal,I guess I will leave it on the list of would be nice to have in 2012 but its not near the top,although the joint does look nice when cut...seen it on google..

regards

Dave

 

[Mike Wingate]

An expensive solution, but it only costs money and 2 router bits.
http://www.trend-uk.com/en/UK/product/1 ... utter.html
http://www.trend-uk.com/en/UK/product/1 ... utter.html
I generally shoot my mitres. I have 3 Mitre lock bits for a variety of timber thicknesses.
http://www.trend-uk.com/en/UK/product/1 ... inter.html

 

[Digit]

Out of curiosity Mike how to you set up the height etc?

Roy.

 

[RogerP]

"Make sure that the cutter is centred on the workpiece." It says, but be sure to do several test pieces first and save a successfully cut bit as a setting-up template for next time you use that thickness timber.

 

[Digit]

The problem with that Roger was that I ended up with more test pieces than finished pieces!
Now what I do is limit the box sides to a certain range of thicknesses, then, having finally obtained a sutable setting I use a depth mic to measure the position of the cutter relative to the table and to the fence.
These are contained in my 'little black book' and I only have to to set to those dimesnsions to guarantee a fit first time!

Roy.

 

[RogerP]

The problem with that Roger was that I ended up with more test pieces than finished pieces!
Now what I do is limit the box sides to a certain range of thicknesses, then, having finally obtained a sutable setting I use a depth mic to measure the position of the cutter relative to the table and to the fence.
These are contained in my 'little black book' and I only have to to set to those dimesnsions to guarantee a fit first time!

Roy.

Oh to be so organised!

 

[Modernist]

Out of curiosity Mike how to you set up the height etc?

Roy.

Not so easy as the centre of the joint is half way along the sloping face of the key. They really ought to have a measurement from say the top face of the cutter or some easy to find datum to the joint centre. At least then you would be starting somewhere near. And that's just the height!

 

[Digit]

The height of course once set is fixed, the fence has to be 'inched' in to make more than one cut.
I gave up struggling and made a small router table that is clamped into a vice and can be turned through 90 degrees so that both cuts are performed horizontally. With that, and using known settings, the job becomes much easier. With the lid and base glued into place I separate the top and bottom on the TS then route the cut faces on an over head router so that everything is nice and square.
It was a pain making the tools and getting the measurements sorted out but once done things go much easier.

Roy.

 

[Mike Wingate]

Careful measurment and tests. Do make sure all your wood is of the same thickness. Make and keep a setup block for standard sizes. Fine adjustment of the fence and router height helps. I cut along a board then cut the board into pieces. Saves time and stops the wood wandering. Have confidence and keep your fingers.

 

[Mr T]

Hi

To get back to the clamping problem. I use mitres quite a bit in carcase furniture, reinforcing them with biscuits or dominoes, so I need a positive way of clamping them up. I use shaped clamping jigs clamped to the pieces then an F or G clamp across the corner as shown here clamping up a frame.

I clamp the diagonally opposite corners ensuring they are square and true. Then when they have set I clamp the other two corners. It seems to work well every time. Wider panels can be done with wider jigs. The cubist drawers shown used jigs similar to those pictured, SZand paper glued to the underside helps to prevent slipping if you have to put a lot of pressure on.

I've recently completed a fairly complex TV cabinet for my own home using this system. I'll post some pictures tomorrow.