metalworking kit?

[jasonB]

Gidon

The silver brazing alloy that axminster list is what I know as silver solder, would suggest Easy-Flow No2 as it requires the least amount of heat.

I use a similar torch to axminsters "hose torches" off a 3-4kg calor propane bottle lasts for years. Also don't need welding glasses so you can see what you are doing

Just a note to say use this solder in a very well ventilated space as the cadmium fumes don't do you any good

Jason

 

[gidon]

Thanks again Jason - so could I also use one of axminster blow torches - if so would the one burner one be ok or what would be the best burner? So just normal goggles for this soldering then? Sorry for all the questions - quite tempted because of the relatively small outlay. Especially as I only have small jobs lined up at the minute.
Cheers
Gidon

 

[jasonB]

Just the standard burner will do for smaller size work, you are aiming to heat the area to a dull cherry red

Yes clear glasses/goggles as the brightness of the flame will not affect your sight

Don't forget to order a tub of flux which will last you years if kept dry.

Jason

 

[gidon]

Great - thanks Jason. May see what I can pick up at Yandles tomorrow ...
Cheers
Gidon

 

[Woody Alan]

Hi

I would just like to throw in another option which doesn't get a lot of mention, carbon arc brazing! The reason most people fail at this is because the carbon rods that are supplied with kits for arc welders are not the correct rods. They are in fact cutting rods. When I found a supplier of the correct rods I could do quite delicate brazing, one example is in my "sore saw" thread, where you can see I brazed an outfeed table for my saw, as well as my own design mobile equipment trolley idea (which you can only see the front of) but can see here .
https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4791
Hope that's not clouded the issue

Cheers Alan

 

[Chris Knight]

Alan,

Your picture doesn't show the outfeed table - I think you meant this one

 

[Woody Alan]

Chris

Now, I know I've had a drink...or two, maybe,who's asking? but I'm sure that the picture you've posted is from the "sore saw" thread as I described. however if I am totally confused, then please say and don't worry I find it to be a relatively normal condition...at least according to the wife :lol:

Alan

 

[Chris Knight]

Alan,

Yes it is from that thread but when I clicked on the link you provided, I got two pictures without the outfeed table - with no apparent way to navigate to the picture with the outfeed table as I linked to. (Could see the mobile base though!).

Mind you, you are not the only one who has had a drink! Maybe it will all look different in the morning!! :lol:

 

[Woody Alan]

Chris
I think this is going to come down to my laziness in not finding the "sore saw" link. If I had put that in at the appropiate point then all would have been very clear, I was kind of leaving a clue instead of what I should have done. lesson for next time eh?

Alan

 

[gidon]

Alan
Thanks - yes you have confused me further! But nice effort on the outfeed table. It would great to be able to do that sort of stuff!
Following Tony's advice I'm going to get down to a Halfords and see what they have on offer. I don't really want to spend much and as ever it's got less urgent becuase I've made do! But when I see exactly what's available I'll most likely be back with more questions.
Thanks for everyone's help. I certainly know a lot more about this than when I started - and I'm certainly more confused .
Cheers
Gidon

 

[matt]

An old but informative thread... Although I remain a little confused.

A lot of the advice seems to focus on flat or hollow section materials (i.e. up to 6mm thickness etc, tubes for bike frames, etc). What would those experienced in this area choose for welding solid steel up to say about 10mm? (Which would also be useful for other general welding work).

Reason for asking... My wife wants me to make a steel arch to grow a rose over in the garden to match another similar piece of hardware that she's just bought.

Grateful for any thoughts...

 

[chunkolini]

Hi guys I have been out of touch for a while. I work as a metal sculptor and do a lot of Mig, Tig and Brazing. Brazing oxyacetylene is definitely the best way to go, just dont buy dodgy cheap kit of ebay, For top avice on welding related matters have a look at www.ukwelder.com they have a top advice forum full of folk who know their stuff and enjoy arguing about it.

re welding 10mm mild steel, you are looking at a powerful Mig or Tig machine, Mig in the 200amps bracket, mine is 180 and will just do the job.

Somebody at the start of this thread was talking about making jigs, I can whleheartedly reccomend the Metalcraft series of cold forming tools, i use these a lot in my sculpture, great for making complicated curves and accurate bends, have a look at my website www.artinsteel.co.uk this is kit that wont break the bank and allows a lot of freedom with a fairly cheap material that has a reputation for being difficult to work

 

[motownmartin]

An old but informative thread... Although I remain a little confused.

A lot of the advice seems to focus on flat or hollow section materials (i.e. up to 6mm thickness etc, tubes for bike frames, etc). What would those experienced in this area choose for welding solid steel up to say about 10mm? (Which would also be useful for other general welding work).

Reason for asking... My wife wants me to make a steel arch to grow a rose over in the garden to match another similar piece of hardware that she's just bought.

Grateful for any thoughts...

Matt, the joints can still be brazed as long as the process of heating the parent metal is good enough to provide adequate heating, it is best to bevel the edges to get adequate joining area especially on a butt joint (end to end or edge to edge), any welding methods would do the job fine but if you were to weld outside I would reccomend MMA (flux coated rods)

Hope this helps

Martin

 

[Nick W]

Maybe you should invest in a copy of Soldering and Brazing by Tubal Cain coupled with The Art of Welding by W A Vause.

 

[matt]

Thanks for the comments and advice. I was in Machine Mart this morning and took the opportunity to ask about their range...

The chap I spoke to did not seem to know a great deal, other than to tell me that the only welder I could power from a domestic power supply would handle up to 4mm thick material. All the others required a 32amp supply for which "I would need the whole house rewired"?

 

[merylvingien]

Machine mart and salesmen not knowing what they talk about, hmm surley not

I have just about every welding machine going in my workshop and i have welded allsorts of material and of various thicknesses.

I have only glanced through this thread quickly and can see that most of the questions have been answered already.

Brazing, similar to solder, whereas the material thats being joined does not get melted, result a fairly strong joint.

Arc, is a welding rod that has a flux coating around it, as soon as the metal core touches the material to be joined, it starts to melt both material to be joined and the rod, the flux also melts creating a protective coating over the weld whilst it cools and solidifies.
Arc is used mainly for thick plate type steel and cast steels.

Mig, (metal inert gas) is a welding wire which is fed off of a reel and through a gun, its is accompanied by a shrouding gas to keep the weld pure from the atmosphere. The gas is non flamable and comes in a variety of different mixes for different applications. Mig can be used for stainless steel and also for alluminium alloys.

Tig, (tungsten inert gas) is an electric flame produced by a tungsten rod which is held in a gun, shrouded by pure argon gas, this type of welding is the purest weld that you can have. Tig welding can weld all types of metal, from mild steel, stainless steel, copper, alluminium alloys and even titanium.
It is also my favourite type of welding.

Gas welding, (oxygen/acetelyne) is a gas flame from a nozzle by mixing the two gasses together, which burns hot enough to melt the material being welded. A filler rod is then melted along side the material to fill the welded joint.

All welded joints are far stronger than any form of solder or brazed joints, simply becuase the material is melted together.

Hopes this helps a few understand the various types of welding techniques.

 

[chunkolini]

Chappie at macninemart is talking cobblers. I use a Butters 180amp machine at high amperages for long periods continuously on a domestic supply with no problems. he has a point about thickness, most hobby welders go up to 150amps which will manage 4mm plate. I used a Clarke 130amp machine for 6 years before it croaked from merciless abuse so I can reccomend them as a budget option.

If you want the facts regards what power you can use on a domestic supply log on to www.ukwelder.com and join their forum, quality info from Pro's you may well start a big argument but these guys know their stuff.

Re Axminster micro lathe, A friend just bought one and hates it.

If you go on to buy a welder what kind of budget are you thinking of? £200 and it will cope, £400 and you are in semipro territory and it gets a lot better and more economical to run. Avoid disposable gas bottles, they are around 100,000 times the price per volume of gas than renting a larger bottle, gasless welders are not a patch on the real thing.

A good piece of advice I was given when I bought my first Mig was 'think of what you are doing and get a machine 20% more powerful than that, as you will need it eventually'.

You could always go with oxy/acetylene kit for gas welding and brazing, but be careful as accidents can happen and this stuff could take out your house and half the street.

I would reccomend doing a night class in whatever technique you go with, I did a 12 week course in Oxyacetylene welding, it changed my life, in the end I went form stressed out careworker to full time sculptor. if you dont fancy a course Mig welding can be picked up very quickly with a few lessons from a mate, I taught myself from scratch. Oh and pay the extra for an autodarkening helmet, brilliant devices.

if you want I can post links to some good welding supplies companies.

Chunko'.

 

[ike]

Hi Matt,

MIG is without a doubt the easist option for solid steel 2mm up. It is certainly not 'glueing' metal together (unless you haven't got the knack!). However, you would struggle to get good penetration on material over 6mm with anything less than a 160A machine which needs a 16A supply. (Let me put that another way before I,m shot down - a 13A plug won't quite hack it on extended use, the fuseholder will get very hot). A 140A machine will happily run off 13A socket but beware of the small cheap units out there, They are much more difficult to get a good weld with. Watching and listening to the arc, they seem quite 'spiky'. Also thecheapest units have a lousy wire feed. The wire feed unit is pretty much the most important bit of the machine as it has the most influence on the smoothness of the weld. I have had a 160A Telwin which has worked well for many years except for exploding a capacitor once. If you can stretch to a 160A machine then do it. Another very useful feature on some machines is timer controls for plug ('spot') welding technigue on sheet metal. I rebuilt my Landrover bulkhead this way - very useful.


So in short, buy the best brand 160A machine you can afford. Forget anything in Ferm or Nutool territory - total rubbish. PS You can get TIG converters with some brands - the least difficult way to weld aluminum :wink: .
cheers,

Ike

 

[ivan]

I got a 180 amp 5kVA arc welder about 40 years ago. At that time MIG was not an option, as the cheap disposable mini gas cylinders hadn't been invented. It's not much good for car bodies (you need MIG for that) but excells on steel from about 2 to 8mm. It's been used to make a lot of workshop equipment - whole machines or machine bases, a panel handling trolley, boat trailers, etc. It will blow 30A fuses at times, I have it on a dedicated 40A trip. A 13A plug would require modifying with a bit of 6" nail - definitely not a fuse I would reccomend!! and would blow the 30A ringmain fuse/trip.

The other bit of essential fabricator's kit if you have room, is a cut off bandsaw (power hacksaw), the best £150 odd I ever spent, as it ensures your joints are all square* (or at the proper angle) Axminster seem to have stopped selling this, they are on £99 clearance at the moment.

* I have definitely not completed the RAF fitters apprenticship which requires ability to file parts to under 5 thou tolerance....

 

[matt]

Thanks again for the additional advice. There's part of me that considering the gas option. Just spotted this and half expecting for it to be inadequate, but here goes: http://tinyurl.com/ytjj6g