Marking Out Dovetails

[custard]

Apparently the Leigh Dovetail Jig can be used to make half-lap dovetail joints with ultra-fine, needle pins and tails. You cut the pins on the jig, transfer the layout to the tail board, then cut the tails by hand.

This could be a real time saver and I'd like to give this a go, but it seems to me the whole thing stands or falls on the accuracy of transferring the marking out.

Because I'm a "tails first" dovetailer when hand cutting, I've never transferred markings from the pin board to the tail board. So does anyone have a recommendation for a marking out jig that can help accurately transfer the layout from a half lap pin board to a tail board?

Thanks.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Carefully holding (or clamping) the pin board to the tail board, assuring accurate alignment, then marking the tails with either a very sharp pencil, a scalpel, or a spear-point marking knife is the only way I can think of (though no doubt there are are other ways).

This is possibly the only application I can think of when those very expensive thin, spear-point marking knives are of real use. I think the 'old craftsmen' used a marking awl instead - but they were often going for speed of joint-making rather than absolute accuracy.

 

[bugbear]

Apparently the Leigh Dovetail Jig can be used to make half-lap dovetail joints with ultra-fine, needle pins and tails. You cut the pins on the jig, transfer the layout to the tail board, then cut the tails by hand.

Got a Link for that?

BugBear

 

[marcros]

http://www.leighjigs.com/data/LEIGH_D4_needlepins.pdf I think BB

 

[johnwc812]

Hi
X 2 for Cheshirechappie.
If you can find an old school Helix pencil compass, the the pointy bit is ideal for scribing dovetails.
If you are working on darkish timber, rub over the surface with chalk, and the lines are easier to see.
Necessary when you reach my age.
Cheers John

 

[custard]

Carefully holding (or clamping) the pin board to the tail board, assuring accurate alignment, then marking the tails with either a very sharp pencil, a scalpel, or a spear-point marking knife is the only way I can think of (though no doubt there are are other ways).

I know this works for some people, but it never really worked for me. The biggest leap in the quality of my dovetails came when I started to use a simple jig to transfer markings from the tail board to the pin board.

But the type of jig I use only allows tails to pins. For this application I have to find something that will do half lap pins to tails. But google isn't showing anything.

Does anyone know of a design for a half lap pin to tail marking jig?

Thanks

 

[Jacob]

If you are going to do half the job by hand why not go the whole hog? No jigs, gadgets, tricks required.
Paul Sellers (again!) somewhat over simplifies it here .
Basically it isn't difficult but you may need a good bit of practice on some scrap. It's definitely worth the investment of time and effort and you gain a life time skill.

 

[AndyT]

One of the challenges when transferring marks is getting the two pieces lined up square to each other. The trad method was apparently to put one piece vertical in the vice, up above the bench top by the thickness of a wooden plane on its side, then rest the other piece on the end of the board and the side of the plane. This can still let the two parts skid around while you are marking.

To clamp the two together you can use a pair of cheap right angle clamps - this sort of thing

(I think I owe that tip to BugBear.)

Alternatively, use a router or a fillister plane to shave a very shallow rebate across one piece so that the other one locates easily in it - I think Chris Schwarz wrote about this on his blog.

 

[custard]

Jacob, I've been cutting dovetails by hand and by jig for thirty years or more. I'm interested in experimenting with my Leigh jig to see if I can speed up the process, but still retain the appearance of needle pins.

All I'm looking for is advice on a jig or holding device to make marking from half lap pins to tails more accurate. Robert Ingham has mentioned that he made and uses such a jig, but I can't find a photo or diagram of it.

 

[Jacob]

Jacob, I've been cutting dovetails by hand and by jig for thirty years or more. I'm interested in experimenting with my Leigh jig to see if I can speed up the process, but still retain the appearance of needle pins.

All I'm looking for is advice on a jig or holding device to make marking from half lap pins to tails more accurate. Robert Ingham has mentioned that he made and uses such a jig, but I can't find a photo or diagram of it.

Oh right. You didn't say.
Holding device - hand? Marking - awl.
Handy awl substitute is a dart. Replace the flights with interesting handle of exotic hardwood, or a brass knob?

 

[custard]

Thanks Andy, the clamp route is a possibility.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Bob Wearing devised a simple jig for holding components whilst marking out through dovetails. It consists of two pieces of nicely-squared wood jointed at 90 degrees, and a third triangular piece glued and screwed on; the finised jig is like an engineer's angle plate with only one end-web. The components to be marked are clamped to the outside faces; for large components, two such jigs are used, one at each end of the joint.

For marking lap dovetails, the same jig could be used, but with the components clamped to the INSIDE faces of the angle-plate jig. It would be wise to ensure that the inside corners are cleaned of all splintering, glue blobs and so on to ensure a fair register, of course. When all is clamped up true, mark with pencil or knife as preferred.

 

[andersonec]

Is this what you mean?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I45mEWAJv4

David Barron has a few videos on the tube plus more on his website.

Andy

 

[custard]

Is this what you mean?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I45mEWAJv4

David Barron has a few videos on the tube plus more on his website.

Andy

Hello Andy, that's pretty much what I use now for marking through and half lap dovetails from tails to pins.

But for the Leigh jig application I need to cut the pins first and mark the tails from the pins, which is the opposite of the way I normally work, so I'm hoping one of the "pins first" dovetailers out there will help by describing a jig they use to transfer the markings for half lap dovetails.